Dandenong/Pakenham top dangerous suburban station/line list

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PalmerEldritch Say goodnight to the bad guy

Location: Princes Park, Carlton

Found at: http://www.dandenongleader.com.au/article/2008/01/29/28615_osv_news.html

Dandy not safe

Adrian Ballantyne

29Jan08

DANDENONG is officially the most dangerous place in suburban Melbourne to catch public transport, statistics show.

Figures released by the state Opposition show Dandenong had more violent and destructive incidents than any other railway station outside the CBD in the first half of last year.

Among the 23 incidents reported on trains and at the station were alleged gunfire on March 15, which resulted in the trip's termination, a brawl between 15 to 20 people outside the station on May 3, attacks on Connex staff and regular reports of fights between Islander and African youths.

Only Flinders St, with 27, recorded more crimes.

The Pakenham line topped Melbourne's train lines for unruly passengers, assaults, fights and vandalism, with 67 incidents recorded between January and July last year.

Almost 60 incidents were reported at CBD and city loop stations, while the Frankston line (from Glenhuntly to Frankston) was  third with 47.

Opposition transport spokesman Terry Mulder said the presence of unruly passengers on public transport was unnerving to commuters and railway staff.

"Melbourne's 300,000 daily rail travellers who make a return trip are uncertain about whether their trip will be incident free," Mr Mulder said.

There were six incidents recorded at Springvale and three at Noble Park over the same seven-month period.

Connex spokeswoman Kate De Clercq said there were safety measures in place at all stations, including lighting at night, CCTV coverage and emergency buttons, while some stations were staffed from first to last train.

Ms De Clercq said most rail users travelled in complete safety.

- A user

 
Lokan Locomotive Driver

Figures released by the state Opposition

- A user

Is there anywhere on the internet that these figures can be found?

 
lakeyboy Chief Train Controller

Location: Melbourne, Australia



First place: Flinders Street (27)

Second place: Dandenong (23)

Third place: Boronia (21)


Crime scourge of train station

Luke Holmesby, Knox Leader, January 28, 2008

http://www.leadernews.com.au/article/2008/01/28/28452_knv_news.html

A KNIFE being brandished, someone urinating on a station door and a fire in the waiting room are problems plaguing Boronia train station.

Documents obtained by the state Liberal Party under Freedom of Information legislation show Boronia to be one of the most unruly in Melbourne.

Documents show there were 21 incidents reported at the station between January 1 and June 30 last year.

The incidents were reported by rail officers to the Department of Infrastructure's Public Transport Safety Victoria.

Only the high-traffic Flinders St (27 incidents) and Dandenong (23) stations reported more incidents.

But according to Connex, only 2500 people use Boronia station each day, compared with 60,000 at Flinders St and 4800 at Dandenong.

Offences included:

- May 5: A man pulling a knife on another man.

- June 8: Youths unscrewing handrails at the station.

- June 15: A fire in the waiting room.

- June 24: A man urinating at the station's office door.

After the fire was lit in the waiting room, a Connex staffer at the station pleaded with the department to address the issue, writing in an email: ``Nothing is changing. The same kids are still wreaking havoc at the station from 3pm till late. Where do we go now? We need daily assistance.''

Boronia businessman Craig Templeman said last year (Knox Leader, September 4)  the day-time incidents he had seen at the station included people engaging in  sexual acts, children being bashed, people smashing shopping trolleys through shop windows, as well as drug dealing and usage.

A fire was also lit at the newsstand there.

Connex spokeswoman Kate De Clercq said Boronia was a busy station and denied the incidents were out of proportion.

"More than 2500 people use the station each day and while one incident is too many, it's important to consider the incidents in context."

- A user

I have never used Boronia station, but I have ridden past it many times on the parallel bike path. Is the problem the fact that Connex staff are all locked up safe and secure in the station office on the footbridge while people are on the unmanned station platform below, exposed to all sorts of risks? Despite a police station being 100 metres away. I have heard police regularly patrol the station so why is this happening? Surely Boronia can't be nearly as bad as Dandenong, but I guess it is.

I would also like to see the full list if it has been published freely.

 
Riccardo Minister for Railways

Location: Gone. Don't bother PMing here.

Ms De Clercq said most rail users travelled in complete safety.

- A user

Ms De Clercq must have got a gig at the Melbourne Comedy Festival by now, she's been practising for a long time...

What she's basically saying is lots of people board trains, most get to the end of their journeys, we lose a few along the way.

Most of the Dutch East India Company's ships made it back to Europe. A few were wrecked or sunk.

Most of NASA's missions to Mars make it to the red planet.

People in gothic novels tend to enter haunted houses, most come out. How would we know they were haunted if some didn't come back?

 
PalmerEldritch Say goodnight to the bad guy

Location: Princes Park, Carlton

Found at: http://www.berwickleader.com.au/article/2008/01/29/28614_blv_news.html

Violence on trains

29Jan08

COMMUTERS on the Pakenham train line are now regularly facing journeys of fear and intimidation from their fellow travellers.

Freedom of Information documents obtained by the state Liberal Party show between January 1 and June 30 last year there were 67 formal complaints to the Department of Infrastructure about violence and bad behaviour on the trains.

Rail operator Connex says the reports are only the tip of the iceberg.

Most of the incidents in the FOI documents relate to unruly passengers and fighting.

In some cases Connex staff have been injured and the reports indicate vandalism is rife.

Five incidents, including an assault, occurred at Narre Warren station.

State Opposition public transport spokesman Terry Mulder said the unpredictable presence of unruly passengers on trains was unnerving to many, particularly female travellers and the elderly.

"And the number of assaults rail staff experience is unacceptable," Mr Mulder said.

"Daily rail travellers are quite uncertain about whether it will be incident free."

Mr Mulder called on Police Minister Bob Cameron and Public Transport Minister Lynne Kosky to provide extra resources to police the line.

Connex spokesman John Rees said the number of reported incidents was considerably higher than the Government figures revealed.

"On Monday night alone, we had 15 reported incidents," Mr Rees said.

Emma Diffen, spokeswoman for Public Transport Minister Lynne Kosky, said crimes against train passengers had dropped 7 per cent since July, but any level of violence on the transport network was concerning.

She said the Government continued to work closely with train and tram operators to improve safety.

- A user

 
Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere



Ms De Clercq must have got a gig at the Melbourne Comedy Festival by now, she's been practising for a long time...

- A user



That, in essence, is what she is employed for.  It is no mean feat to placate baying media hounds after every single report of even quite trivial incidents.

That said there have been a small number of violent incidetns across the network and there are known hotspots some of which have been identified above.

We would all like to live in a non-violent society, I am sure, where everyonce could undertake a triop by public transport at any time of any day in perfect safety.

The fact is that for around 99.9% of the time this is indeed the case.  However there is no telling where and when some form of trouble might arise nor how it will impact anyone.

Frankston has a "Safe City Centre" right opposite the railway / bus interchange but it closes at 4.30pm just when it might be needed most.  The police station is some distance away.  There have been times when calls for assistance have been unanswered until the 000 service is used, or callers told there are no police available.  I suspect this is the same in many suburbs.

Like it or not we live in a hot country where alcohol is a bane of society; hot days and alcohol consumption do not mix.  Passions for sport, national identity and even the opposite sex can run high; weather, alcohol and passion do not always make a good mix.

Then there are the often-unlawful substances of choice used by a significant number of our population.  In many cases without adverse effect, I am told, but not always.

I don't have a ready-made panacea for all of society's problems.  We do have to face up to the unruly element and there needs to be some form of intervention now to prevent the public transport network becoming a haven for their activities and unsafe for paying customers.

It is a worrying trend that the higher levels of violence are being reported from staffed stations, though perhaps incidents at unattended stations are less often reported simply because no staff are there to see and report them.  In another thread it is reported that staff at Cranbourne are harrassed daily by youths during the mid-morning period.  This serves to illustrate that anything can happen at any time.  Cranbourne is single-manned and apart from calling for Police assistance (which might or might not be available) there is little the staff member can do apart from close their window and lock themselves in.

We should be looking to the State Government for answers this year, not promises which can be ignored, welched on or distorted by spin doctors down the track.  

Connex has AO teams who can be anywhere anytime but cannot be everywhere all the time.  It might well be time to look at having an increased security presence on board trains (and trams) as well as a station-based presence.  These need not necessarily be Connex staff but could be perhaps security contractors.  

Violence on board the Frankston line trains diminished very sharply after the Coemng trains were refurbished and cameras installed.  The chance that any offender would be identified and dealt with improved markedly.  It is time that this was extended beyond simply having cameras as a deterrent to having a visible human presence.

When violence on the London Underground started to get out of hand some years ago (particularly on the southern end of the Northern Line) a voluntary group based on the American "Guardian Angels" set themselves up and rode as many trains as they could every day and night.  Most passengers were pleased to see them and the violence swiftly abated; they were not security guards nor staff but volunteers (who paid for their tickets as well) who were trained in restraint and intervention, and who would only become involved as a last resort and never as "vigilantes" or strutting around in the way sometimes seen of self-important security staff.

Melbourne should learn from that operation.  There might be scope for something similar here.

 
Metro Transit Minister for Railways

Location: Error.

Found at: http://www.dandenongleader.com.au/article/2008/01/29/28615_osv_news.html

Dandy not safe

Adrian Ballantyne

29Jan08

DANDENONG is officially the most dangerous place in suburban Melbourne to catch public transport, statistics show.

- A user

- PalmerEldritch



I could have told them that.

Figures released by the state Opposition show Dandenong had more violent and destructive incidents than any other railway station outside the CBD in the first half of last year.

Among the 23 incidents reported on trains and at the station were alleged gunfire on March 15, which resulted in the trip's termination, a brawl between 15 to 20 people outside the station on May 3, attacks on Connex staff and regular reports of fights between Islander and African youths.

Only Flinders St, with 27, recorded more crimes.

The Pakenham line topped Melbourne's train lines for unruly passengers, assaults, fights and vandalism, with 67 incidents recorded between January and July last year.

Almost 60 incidents were reported at CBD and city loop stations, while the Frankston line (from Glenhuntly to Frankston) was  third with 47.

Opposition transport spokesman Terry Mulder said the presence of unruly passengers on public transport was unnerving to commuters and railway staff.

"Melbourne's 300,000 daily rail travellers who make a return trip are uncertain about whether their trip will be incident free," Mr Mulder said.

There were six incidents recorded at Springvale and three at Noble Park over the same seven-month period.

Connex spokeswoman Kate De Clercq said there were safety measures in place at all stations, including lighting at night, CCTV coverage and emergency buttons, while some stations were staffed from first to last train.

Ms De Clercq said most rail users travelled in complete safety.

- A user



Nasty stuff, and everyone thought the Frankston line was the one to avoid, well aparenlty not as it now seems, something i've been saying for donkey's years. Although there was no mention of Cranbourne in all that which is odd, but anyway. And many of those Island gangs come from Cranbourne, as i used to work with a really nice lady who said she had trouble with her sons going into Dandy and beating all the african lads up but it happens.

Metro II.

 
Braddo Deputy Commissioner

Location: Narre Warren

I don't believe Dandenong is the most dangerous station at all. Sure it might have the most reported incidents outside of the CBD, but its far safer than some of the unmanned/host stations such as Yarraman, Noble Park & Westall.[/i]

 
per1 Banned

Location: Banned

Lets be blunt. Immigration is the problem. Muslims in the Northern suburbs. Africans and Maories everywhere. Yes of course there is also the odd white fellow. Melbourne lines are now too dangerous to travel at night. Dont see such problems in Japan where there in no immigration.

 
Metro Transit Minister for Railways

Location: Error.

Dont see such problems in Japan where there in no immigration.

- per1



Yeah? whats their excuse anyway? What ever it is perhaps it should have been said here maybe? If it's good enough for us to have them by the boat load then so should they. And what makes them exempt from taking immigrants?

Metro II.

 

Location: Banned

This forum really is full of racists.

 
Metro Transit Minister for Railways

Location: Error.

This forum really is full of racists.

- Somebody in the WWW



tsk tsk tsk, never said anything about a hate towards anyone, just asked a question, so keep your trap shut.

 

Location: Banned

Did I specifically mention you Metro?

This post just screams racist:

Lets be blunt. Immigration is the problem. Muslims in the Northern suburbs. Africans and Maories everywhere

- per1

(bolded by me)

 
Metro Transit Minister for Railways

Location: Error.

Did I specifically mention you Metro?

This post just screams racist:

Lets be blunt. Immigration is the problem. Muslims in the Northern suburbs. Africans and Maories everywhere

- per1

(bolded by me)

- Somebody in the WWW



Well if you don't mention anyone, you are referring to all. Plus, i don't think saying where specific groups are located is being racist, in what way is that possibly racist? Please explain?

 
loco2301 Chief Train Controller

Let's face it................sometimes the truth hurts.

If you work on public transport, you will soon realise that what has been suggested packs a punch.

I have often wondered why some people from refugee backgrounds, and particularly their children, seem to have a propensity to graviate towards criminal and  anti social behaviour.

It is unfortunate, but it definetly seems to me to be more so the case,  than from people from other streams of life.

Is it a clash of cultures, or is it just ingrained debauch behaviour learnt over many years of having to fight for survival??

Maybe it could be both?

I personally believe our immigration policies need to be redefined, from what I have personally observed and witnessed.

 
Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere

There are cases of violence and antisocial behaviour on the railways which have been attributed to tensions between individuals or groups of differring ethnic origin and / or religion.

There is a (probably far larger) number of incidents in which those factors are not the cause.  

One fact overall we should not lose sight of is that Melbourne's public transport system is extremely safe almost everywhere almost all of the time.

While it might be possible to argue that, based on statistics, certain lines / stations / suburbs are more or less "dangerous" than others we have nowhere near the level of street and transit violence known in many other cities around the world.

To post something like

Melbourne lines are now too dangerous to travel at night

- A user

might be the personal opinion of one member but it is not borne out by the majority of travelling public who continue to use the system during all operating hours and do so safely very nearly all the time.

It would simply not be possible to guarantee 100% safety from violence or abuse all of the time anyway.  There are steps which can be taken to discourage those who intentionally cause trouble on the system.  There is little which can be pro-actively done to ease the occasional excess of alcohol or drug consumption leading to antisocial behavour.



Immigration is the problem. Muslims in the Northern suburbs. Africans and Maories everywhere.

- A user



Those people, who in most cases hold Australian passports and would hold entry visas in all other cases, have as much right to be here as anyone else.  Immigration is not a problem, and it is not the problem.  Occasional bigotted attitudes are a problem.  We are not all the same.  We come in all sizes, shapes and colours with a myriad different traditions and backgrounds.  If you expect everyone to always be identical to yourself then how poor must your life be with no variety?

Almost everyone in this country has come from somewhere else, or their families have, within the last 200 - 250 years.  Many have arrived within the past 100 years.  Was immigration a problem when YOU arrived?  Why is it any different now?

 
loco2301 Chief Train Controller

Are you a Connex Manager by any chance Gwiewer???

 
Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere

I am not and never have been an employee of Connex nor any of their predecessors in Melbourne.

 
PalmerEldritch Say goodnight to the bad guy

Location: Princes Park, Carlton

Yes of course there is also the odd white fellow.

- per1



Most incidents on the Frankston, Belgrave and Lilydale lines can be attributed to Caucasians.

Melbourne lines are now too dangerous to travel at night. Dont see such problems in Japan where there in no immigration.

- per1



Nonsense, there are large immigrant communities in Japan from places such as Korea, China, and Brazil, and smaller numbers from countries as diverse as Iran, the Phillipines, Russia and Nigeria.

Apparently Australians are taking over the snowfields in Japan, and US servicemen are notorious for partaking in anti-social behaviour in Japan.

 
northbritish Train Controller

This forum really is full of racists.

- Somebody in the WWW

Maybe they are realists instead.

 
northbritish Train Controller

Let's face it................sometimes the truth hurts.

If you work on public transport, you will soon realise that what has been suggested packs a punch.

I have often wondered why some people from refugee backgrounds, and particularly their children, seem to have a propensity to graviate towards criminal and  anti social behaviour.

It is unfortunate, but it definetly seems to me to be more so the case,  than from people from other streams of life.

Is it a clash of cultures, or is it just ingrained debauch behaviour learnt over many years of having to fight for survival??

Maybe it could be both?

I personally believe our immigration policies need to be redefined, from what I have personally observed and witnessed.

- loco2301

Very good observations, you see the world as it really is not like some who see it how they believe it should be through their PC coloured glasses.

 
hansonator Chief Commissioner

Location: Strathmore, Victoria

Lets be blunt. Immigration is the problem. Muslims in the Northern suburbs. Africans and Maories everywhere. Yes of course there is also the odd white fellow. Melbourne lines are now too dangerous to travel at night. Dont see such problems in Japan where there in no immigration.

- per1

Apart from being extremely racist, you really have no idea

Too dangerous to travel,  all lines, my you really are a moron.

So your saying immigrants are the issue here, all the times i've seen people vandalising suburban trains it's been a person of white decent.

I've travelled on Broadmeadows trains at 11.30 at night, i've never had a problem. If you keep your mouth shut, and mind your own business, you don't have a problem, but people like you, i can see why your terrified of getting bashed, when you make comments like you did per1 Rolling Eyes

 
PalmerEldritch Say goodnight to the bad guy

Location: Princes Park, Carlton

From the Dandenong Leader, Monday February 4, 2008, p.3:

More patrols

POLICE have stepped up patrols around Clayton railway station after a spate of robberies. Clayton Acting Sgt Nick Murray said several people had been robbed in the past fortnight after being followed from the station.

- A user

 
Riccardo Minister for Railways

Location: Gone. Don't bother PMing here.

PE - is your approach 'homeopathic' - post a few crime articles each day, milk the racism out of the dribblers (like placing the snake's fangs over the rubber stretched across the jar) until they have no more left?

Not sure it's working  Exclamation

 
PalmerEldritch Say goodnight to the bad guy

Location: Princes Park, Carlton

PE - is your approach 'homeopathic' - post a few crime articles each day, milk the racism out of the dribblers (like placing the snake's fangs over the rubber stretched across the jar) until they have no more left?

Not sure it's working  Exclamation

- Riccardo



Venomous stuff ain't it  Wink

Found at: http://www.moorabbingleneiraleader.com.au/article/2008/02/13/29331_mgv_news.html

Workers robbed

Sarah Scopelianos

13Feb08

ELEVEN teenagers who waylaid and robbed workers walking home from train stations have been charged by police.

An unmarked police car was rammed by a stolen car during the investigation into the pack that attacked 10 late-shift workers during January around Westall and Clayton train stations.

Detective Sgt Michael Grumley of the Moorabbin Embona  Taskforce said two people were seriously injured with one suffering from fluid on the brain.

The group allegedly attacked nine Indian and one Asian victim between 10pm and 1am during the 10-day spree, which began on January 14.

Det-Sgt Grumley said four boys were inside the stolen car that rammed a police vehicle after a chase on January 31.

Other alleged offenders were detained by police after raids last week.

"(The attacks) happened suddenly and they hunted in packs targeting Indian workers coming off late shift," Det-Sgt Grumley said.

Det-Sgt Grumley urged people to remain vigilant when walking late at night.

The boys, who were aged between 14 and 16 years, were charged with 80 offences including armed robbery and assault.

One child is in custody, with the remainder released on bail to appear in a Children's Court at a later date.

Anyone with information should contact Crime Stoppers on 1300 333 000 or Moorabbin Police on 9556 6565.

- A user

 

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