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Alltrains
Train Controller
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Last Visited: Jun 11, 2008
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 1:08 am
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Phil, on steam4me there is a tutorial "A primer in track", print this off so you have a hard copy to refer to, as on page 5 of this tutorial it shows the different ways that gradients are worked out. Now the first column "Degrees" is how the gradients are worked on MSTS, however in the curves and gradients the gradients are written in "Ratio". If you have "Rail Access Corporation. Infrastructure Engineering Manual. Curve and Gradient Diagrams. Volume 1. TS0002 T1", then goto page 3 of "M00 Sydney to Granville" and you will see the number 174 directly under the word Granville on the graph. This number is the ratio of the gradient thus it would read 1 in 174 or 1:174. So you get the tutorial from above and on page 5 where you have the 3 columns "Degrees", "Gradient %" and "Ratio" you have a look at the Ratio column for 1:174, as the ratio of 1:174 is not listed you must calculate where it belongs (between 1:127 and 1:190). Now the difference between 127 and 190 is 63 and the difference between 300 and 450 is 150, so you divide 150 by 63 which equals 2.38 and because 174 is 16 less than 190 you multiply 2.38 by 16 and the answer to that is 38 you add 38 to 300 and that gives you a reading of 0.338 Degrees.
See how you go with working out different Ratio's and Degrees.
Cheers
Russell
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ARG706
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jun 03, 2005
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: City of doomsayers
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| ARG706 |
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 1:23 am
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Phil, to save you blowing your top solving these arduous mathematics I will just post the chart you need here.
025% 1 in 4000 0.014
.050% 1 in 2000 0.028
.075% 1 in 1333 0.045
.090% 1 in 1160 0.050
.100% 1 in 1000 0.058
.125% 1 in 800 0.072
.150% 1 in 667 0.085
.175% 1 in 571 0.100
.180% 1 in 570 0.102
.200% 1 in 500 0.116
.220% 1 in 455 0.125
.240% 1 in 417 0.135
.250% 1 in 400 0.147
.260% 1 in 380 0.150
.280% 1 in 357 0.162
.300% 1 in 333 0.173
.325% 1 in 308 0.187
.350% 1 in 287 0.200
.375% 1 in 267 0.215
.400% 1 in 250 0.231
.425% 1 in 235 0.243
.450% 1 in 222 0.258
.475% 1 in 210 0.272
.500% 1 in 200 0.285
.525% 1 in 190 0.300
.550% 1 in 182 0.315
.575% 1 in 174 0.329
.600% 1 in 167 0.343
.625% 1 in 160 0.358
.650% 1 in 154 0.373
.675% 1 in 148 0.387
.700% 1 in 143 0.401
.725% 1 in 138 0.417
.750% 1 in 133 0.431
.775% 1 in 129 0.441
.790% 1 in 127 0.450
.800% 1 in 125 0.458
.825% 1 in 121 0.472
.850% 1 in 118 0.485
.875% 1 in 114 0.501
.900% 1 in 111 0.515
.925% 1 in 108 0.529
.950% 1 in 105 0.545
.975% 1 in 103 0.562
1.00% 1 in 100 0.575
1.05% 1 in 96 0.600
1.10% 1 in 91 0.633
1.15% 1 in 87 0.658
1.20% 1 in 83 0.698
1.25% 1 in 80 0.717
1.31% 1 in 76 0.750
1.45% 1 in 69 0.833
1.50% 1 in 67 0.860
1.57% 1 in 64 0.900
1.70% 1 in 59 0.975
1.85% 1 in 54 1.050
2.00% 1 in 50 1.150
2.09% 1 in 48 1.200
2.25% 1 in 44 1.290
2.50% 1 in 40 1.433
2.62% 1 in 38 1.500
2.75% 1 in 36 1.575
3.00% 1 in 33 1.733
3.14% 1 in 32 1.800
3.20% 1 in 31 1.833
3.40% 1 in 29 1.950
3.50% 1 in 28 2.030
3.66% 1 in 27 2.100
3.80% 1 in 26 2.183
4.00% 1 in 25 2.300
4.19% 1 in 24 2.400
4.35% 1 in 23 2.491
4.50% 1 in 22 2.583
4.71% 1 in 21 2.700
5.00% 1 in 20 2.870
5.23% 1 in 19 3.000
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superheatedsteam
Chief Train Controller
Joined: May 19, 2004
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: Perth, WA
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| superheatedsteam |
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 2:11 am
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| Alltrains wrote: | | I have been branded by one member of this forum as a "vindictive bully". I take this as a personal attack |
Dry your eyes princess.
| Alltrains wrote: | | as this person does not know any details of my personal life. |
What’s your personal life got to do with it? I was commenting on your public posts, how I perceived them, and I provided what I considered reasoned analysis of your posts to support my argument. I respectfully request you do the same when posting to or about me. We all have hard luck stories and mine could be worse than yours.
You still have not responded to questions I have put directly to you in relation to copyright and claims you have made on the subject in this thread. Please do not take my repeated questioning as “bullying” behaviour. I am merely employing a ‘teaching’ technique that you use in order to get you to “concentrate” on this matter. I am asking you to clarify some of the statements you have made publicly in this thread and forums. I was under the impression that this is your area of expertise?
In case you missed my post its on page 6 of this thread, seventh post from the top.
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Guard Class 2
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Feb 05, 2003
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: Elizabeth,South Australia
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| Guard Class 2 |
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 10:35 am
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How do the curve figures on the Curve and Gradient Chart relate to curved track in MSTS?
Is there a similar sort of chart to the Gradient chart you published above, ARG706?
I asked this in this thread as it will help me, but also I'm sure it will help Phil as well.
Thanks,
Wayne
Stretch
(Narrow Gauge Rules)
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ARG706
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jun 03, 2005
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: City of doomsayers
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| ARG706 |
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 12:32 pm
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| Guard Class 2 wrote: | How do the curve figures on the Curve and Gradient Chart relate to curved track in MSTS?
Is there a similar sort of chart to the Gradient chart you published above, ARG706?
I asked this in this thread as it will help me, but also I'm sure it will help Phil as well.
Thanks,
Wayne |
I meant to finish off that post but I was "sidetracked". (no pun intended)
Take this figure for example, such as .250% 1 in 400 0.147
250% is irrelevant. 1 in 400 is what you'll encounter on the gradient chart obviously. 0.147 is gradient you will require in MSTS which shows in the window to the right along with some mostly irrelevant garbage. When you tilt a bit of track and create an incline,you get an increment of 150. You must be able to fine tune this to get the precise gradient. This can be done by holding the end key. You can also use the technique for perfect precision when laying an unjoined road or track piece, like to line it up exactly with a parallel piece of track.
There are other techniques you'll also learn the way
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Guard Class 2
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Feb 05, 2003
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: Elizabeth,South Australia
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| Guard Class 2 |
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 12:40 pm
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Thanks ARG706, you've explained the Gradient part very nicely, but I was really after information about the actual curves in the line.
These are shown by the straight line under the gradient information, and have short curved lines where the curves in the track are. These relate to the Kilometre post markings in the diagrams, but I am wondering how this translated to actual usage of track pieces in MSTS RE.
i.e. How do you relate the numbers in the curve diagrams to the numbers in the name of the track piece in RE?
Thanks,
Wayne
Stretch
(Narrow Gauge Rules)
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ARG706
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jun 03, 2005
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: City of doomsayers
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| ARG706 |
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 12:53 pm
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Wayne, I think I've got ya now.
The figures on the curve/gradient charts are in chains. 59 means about 580-600 metre curve. Generally you just double the figure and stick a 0 on the end. Some might want to be more pedantic about it but as long as the trackmeans both markers within 5 metres that's fine with me
The gradient chart isn't the easiest thing to comprehend, but I usually calculate the grades by measuring the length of the incline/decline against the mile/kilometre. Sometimes it measures 30% percent of the next kilometre. Therefore I lay track at that incline for 300 metres
There is a bit of guesswork and it takes time. Don't expect to lay more than about 10 kms per day. It is probably the easiest way to go using the obsolete material though
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PhilChorusch
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Dec 09, 2007
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: Goulburn NSW
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 1:05 pm
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Thanks guy's, you are great for helpng me out here. The versions of the curve & gradient diagrams I have are: NSWR Gradient Diagrams 1894, 1907, & 1932 this cd cost me $59.00 from Redfern Book Shop now located at Central Station and I also have the Version found on railcorps website I think it's version 2 or 0.2 or 2.0 something like that anyway  .
But like Wayne said, what type of tracks in route editor to use e.g. A1tBuffer etc...
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ARG706
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jun 03, 2005
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: City of doomsayers
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PhilChorusch
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Dec 09, 2007
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: Goulburn NSW
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PhilChorusch
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Dec 09, 2007
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: Goulburn NSW
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Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 2:57 am
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MODERATORS: LOCK THIS THREAD AS I HAVE ASKED BEFORE AND YOU HAVE REFUSED MAYBE YOU SHOULD BE SHAKEN UP!!! NOW LOCK IT 
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MrNathan
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Sep 22, 2004
Last Visited: Jan 5, 2009
Location: In and out.
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Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 9:05 am
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PhilChorusch
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Dec 09, 2007
Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: Goulburn NSW
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Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 1:42 pm
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Hi everyone,
I just wanted to ask would anyone have a diagram of Broadmeadow's railway yards please? Any help would be greatful
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mcclelland190
Junior Train Controller
Joined: Dec 28, 2006
Last Visited: Oct 17, 2008
Location: Wollongong, NSW - Australia
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ARG706
Chief Commissioner
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Last Visited: Jan 8, 2009
Location: City of doomsayers
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| ARG706 |
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Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 9:07 pm
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The post is nearly a month old. It's faded into who really gives a damn territory now
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but I need an idea of the SET HEIGHT OFFSET e.g. would 15.00000 do or a little bid lower? e.g. 9.00000 etc.... 