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Jahommed
Locomotive Fireman
Joined: Aug 02, 2008
Last Visited: Nov 29, 2008
Location: G set toilet
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:51 am
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Hey guys,
I was wondering, How do drivers see speed boards if they dont use headlights at night?
I know they do in country areas but how about in suburban areas?
Thanks, Jahommed.
Tangara G sets are the best trains on the cityrail network.
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hurstville1
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Mar 13, 2007
Last Visited: Nov 30, 2008
Location: Where Belfordrocks isn't(aka:not Hurstville)
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:31 am
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| Jahommed wrote: | Hey guys,
I was wondering, How do drivers see speed boards if they dont use headlights at night?
I know they do in country areas but how about in suburban areas?
Thanks, Jahommed. |
Well they still have their normal lights which could help.
Also, most speedboards are yellow so they have some visibility. They can also use their previous experience.
But with common sense, nothing should go on.
Vince.
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tsgsjm
Junior Train Controller
Joined: Feb 26, 2007
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
Location: Sydney
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:00 am
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Answer is, you dont most of the time, you just know where they are, its called Road Knowledge and it is a big part of the training course with 9 assessments in all throughout the course.
You need to know amongst other things
speed boards, inparticular the low ones
turnout speeds
points of no return
terminating places and procedures
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nadnerb_2000
Chief Commissioner
Joined: May 07, 2004
Last Visited: Nov 20, 2008
Location: between my hat and my shoe soles
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:08 am
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agreed with tsgsjm.
During training, drivers are quizzed on speed boards constantly.
But more to the point - we spend 8 hours a day going over the tracks, so you get to know the routes pretty well, the same way you would know everything about the route you normally take to work or school. Many crews only go on a few lines, so they get to know those bits of track so well, they can start giving each sleeper a name...
There is also a requirement in the training to do a set amount of night hours. Because some trains don't have headlights, and because its largely impractical to use them in the metrop (you just end up blinding other drivers and motorists), you don't use them. You'd be surprised how much you can see, most of the time (though when you're on the richmond line or between mt colah and berowra, it gets very dark if there is no moon) - its actually usually better to leave them off.
Only temporary speed restrictions can sometimes be a little tricky at night, but those have a light on them to show drivers where they are.
Procrastinators Unite! . . . just after I do this . . .
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FieldShunt74
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Nov 06, 2004
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:31 am
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Carrots. Lots of carrots.
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TE2815
Minister for Railways
Joined: Mar 19, 2004
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
Location: Under the newsdesk !
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 2:35 pm
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I'm not even a driver but did enough trips in my former career to know where to shut off and power up again between Mossy and Picton. With practise and experience you get to know the roads.
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Incog_Neato
Station Master
Joined: Sep 09, 2008
Last Visited: Dec 1, 2008
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:59 pm
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Speed signs usually have a reflective finish also which makes them stand out better at nights.
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tsgsjm
Junior Train Controller
Joined: Feb 26, 2007
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
Location: Sydney
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:03 pm
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| Incog_Neato wrote: | | Speed signs usually have a reflective finish also which makes them stand out better at nights. |
Not when they are covered with graffiti which is very common these days
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nadnerb_2000
Chief Commissioner
Joined: May 07, 2004
Last Visited: Nov 20, 2008
Location: between my hat and my shoe soles
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Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:12 pm
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| tsgsjm wrote: | | Incog_Neato wrote: | | Speed signs usually have a reflective finish also which makes them stand out better at nights. |
Not when they are covered with graffiti which is very common these days |
And that reflective finish is actually - deliberately - not as reflective as road signs.
Road signs are pretty highly reflective, because car headlights are rarely in hi-beam, and even the hi-beams aren't particularly powerful.
Train headlights are much more powerful than car headlights - so signs are less reflective to avoid a situation where they would be too "bright".
That said - the new speed board trials that have been going on, have included a newer speed board which has the same reflective values as your normal road type ones. They had a survey for (intercity) drivers as to which ones were better. I don't know what the outcome, if any, has been.
The thing is, tsgsjm has hit on a point as well - anyone can read a speed sign, but drivers also have to know them by heart as, at any time, they can go missing, be vandalised, or be obscured/obstructed. And when a train goes from one track to another, drivers have to know what the speed is on the new track, usually without the assistance of a speed board. There are less speed boards on the railway than there are on the roads - usually, they only put a board up where the speed limit changes.
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Bwana
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jul 21, 2003
Last Visited: Dec 3, 2008
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Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:31 am
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Even in bright sunlight, what are the chances that a driver who was unaware of the speed board would be able to see it, read it and be able to significantly reduce the train's speed before passing the board?
On tsgsjm's point, I'm guessing it isn't uncommon for a speed board to be unreadable, even stopped right at it, to route knowledge is going to be the only way, the board would be at best a reminder, or a marker of the location.
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Jahommed
Locomotive Fireman
Joined: Aug 02, 2008
Last Visited: Nov 29, 2008
Location: G set toilet
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Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 9:26 am
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Ahh, Thanks guys. It just seems too hard to remeber every bit of track over the whole network............. 
Tangara G sets are the best trains on the cityrail network.
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tomohawk
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Nov 05, 2007
Last Visited: Dec 3, 2008
Location: Abbotsford, Melbourne
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Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:35 pm
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| Jahommed wrote: | | Ahh, Thanks guys. It just seems too hard to remeber every bit of track over the whole network............. |
Part of the job. Really it's a big part of what the driver gets paid for. Any robot can operate the train itself, the knowledge is the skill. This is what a Connex driver has told me, and it makes sense.
I start as a trainee Connex electric driver this Monday, so I'm sure I'll learn more about this.
Off topic somewhat I suppose as it relates to Mexico, but here in Melbourne there are no speed boards on the network at all!
Via the City Loop.
Any opinions expressed in the above post are my own, and my own only, given without endorsement nor support of my employer, unless otherwise advised.
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Nexas
The Ghost of George Stephenson
Joined: Jan 12, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 26, 2008
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Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:01 pm
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| tomohawk wrote: | | Jahommed wrote: | | Ahh, Thanks guys. It just seems too hard to remeber every bit of track over the whole network............. |
Part of the job. Really it's a big part of what the driver gets paid for. Any robot can operate the train itself, the knowledge is the skill. This is what a Connex driver has told me, and it makes sense.
I start as a trainee Connex electric driver this Monday, so I'm sure I'll learn more about this.
Off topic somewhat I suppose as it relates to Mexico, but here in Melbourne there are no speed boards on the network at all! |
We have curve speeds, but not line speeds.
Views expressed by me are strictly my own, not of my friends, employer, or anyone else, unless otherwise stated.
*Back at RP for a limited time only*
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574M
White Guru
Joined: Mar 15, 2006
Last Visited: Nov 30, 2008
Location: Shepparton
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Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 5:33 pm
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| nadnerb_2000 wrote: |
Road signs are pretty highly reflective, because car headlights are rarely in hi-beam, and even the hi-beams aren't particularly powerful.
Train headlights are much more powerful than car headlights - so signs are less reflective to avoid a situation where they would be too "bright".
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In Mexico, some of the dot matrix "searchlight" signals are absolute killers up the bush. In a really dark place, they are mighty bright and distracting.
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