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Gauntlet
Train Controller
Joined: Sep 14, 2007
Last Visited: Dec 1, 2008
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Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:07 am
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Yarra Trams to remove suburban services from Swanston St, St Kilda Rd
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,24481080-2862,00.html
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Shannon Deery
October 12, 2008 12:00am
A RADICAL Yarra Trams plan to remove suburban services from Swanston St and St Kilda Rd and overhaul the network is in line to be introduced by 2010.
Under the plan, passengers travelling along St Kilda Rd would need to change trams at Domain Rd and connect to CBD shuttle services at a soon-to-be built super-terminus.
Another super-interchange would be established at Melbourne University, with shuttle trams to operate between Domain Rd and the university.
Yarra Trams estimates the move would cost up to $60 million.
The revamp, expected to cut services along Swanston St and St Kilda Rd by 20 per cent, has angered public transport lobbyists and the Opposition.
But Yarra Trams chief Dennis Cliche said reinventing the tram network along Melbourne's premier boulevard was the only way to lessen the impact of the public transport crisis.
"Trams are getting hung up in the suburban part of their routes and the whole thing becomes a parade when they hit St Kilda Rd," he said.
He maintained the plan would improve operations despite reducing peak-hour services from one tram per minute to one every three minutes and the inconvenience of passengers having to change trams.
The proposal includes plans for new tram terminals that would have a cafe and wi-fi systems, Mr Cliche said.
Outgoing Lord Mayor John So called for the plan to go further.
"They should build tram stations at the fringe of the city (and) just have shuttle trams in the city," Cr So said.
A spokesman for Public Transport Minister Lynne Kosky said the cost of any proposal would have to be looked at by the Government.
Opposition transport spokesman Terry Mulder said the Swanston St proposal was "not passenger friendly".
"It would go back to 100 years ago when some passengers on cable trams had to change trams midway through a trip," he said.
Public Transport Users Association president Daniel Bowen labelled the idea "crazy" and said it would drive commuters back to their cars.
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joffie
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
Last Visited: Dec 1, 2008
Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 3:31 pm
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You couldn't change the title to something a little more meaningful, could you?
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connexwest
Assistant Commissioner
Joined: Jun 24, 2005
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
Location: Waiting for the World's Biggest Divvy Van
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Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:43 pm
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The Herald Sun really is full of crap.
Where do I start?
A)- During the Grand Prix, general speaking what YT are proposing in the article takes place and there seems to be no problem with any person catching a GP shuttle tram from Fed Square to Commercial Road, High Street, Domain Interchange and St Kilda Junction to connect with their relevant tram. Admittedly, there is a lot of CSEs/TA's about to assist, but generally speaking, given time there shouldn't be any major problem if this situation was to be implemented on a full time basis; especially if they all connected at a central location such as Domain Interchange.
B) A reduction of frequency from one minute to 3 minute is really neither hear or there. If they were to move routes from St Kilda Road/Swanston Street (as seen during the Commonwealth Games and proven to be a success in the sense YT have been wanting to implement it on a full time basis), it would not only help ease the congestion of the trams, but allow for a more smoother ride and frequency of trams to travel. At the moment, you can sometimes wait at Fed Square on the UP and not see a tram for a good ten minutes. Then, in a period of 5 or 6 minutes, you'll have a dozen or so trams come into the stop. If the suggestion does go ahead, it should help reduce this from occurring.
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Robbb01
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Sep 14, 2008
Last Visited: Dec 1, 2008
Location: The eastern suburbs PB whole, Manningham
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Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:47 pm
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I read this article and i though....WHY?
Place 4 tram tracks down St Kilda Road and then send some trams through Flinders St.......or build a tunnel under Swanston St...tram tunnel
Expensive...yes....
Make a Melbourne City congestion tax!
Now I may be an idiot, but there is one thing I am not, sir, and that, sir, is an idiot.
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MelbourneCity
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jan 22, 2003
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:49 pm
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There were proposals in the 50s and 60s for trams to be put in tunnels under Bourke and Swanston Street.
IMO that would of killed Melbourne and made it generic.
4 tracks is not really viable either - it could ruin the aesthetics of one of our finest thoroughfares.
I think maybe sending some services down William Street may help a bit - maybe send route 72 down Park Street and run it to the Hospital precinct.
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Speed
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Mar 19, 2007
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
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Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:06 pm
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Firstly, something that requires infrastructure changes as the article suggests is unlikely to be in effect by 2010.
Secondly, if this is supposed to reduce congestion on St Kilda Road, I don't see that it will succeed. High-density commercial development extends well beyond Domain Road. If passengers alighting at Flinders Street or Melbourne Central continue to board trams at Federation Square, a significant number will want to travel beyond Domain Interchange. If that required changing at Domain Interchange, then the chaos at Federation Square/ Flinders Street will be duplicated to the south.
For a CBD-shuttle service to be effective, it would need to go as far as Dandenong Road, if not Carlisle Street.
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Natronomonas
Train Controller
Joined: Jan 14, 2008
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
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Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:09 pm
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Phin blogged about something like this a while back, only it seemed a bit better thought out that the YT proposal (or what was reported, anyway).
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Robbb01
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Sep 14, 2008
Last Visited: Dec 1, 2008
Location: The eastern suburbs PB whole, Manningham
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Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:21 pm
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| MelbourneCity wrote: | There were proposals in the 50s and 60s for trams to be put in tunnels under Bourke and Swanston Street.
IMO that would of killed Melbourne and made it generic.
4 tracks is not really viable either - it could ruin the aesthetics of one of our finest thoroughfares.
I think maybe sending some services down William Street may help a bit - maybe send route 72 down Park Street and run it to the Hospital precinct. |
More trams through William St......
closing off Swanstan st fully to traffic from Southbank BVD to Victoria St....place 4 tracks between there...tunnel two at Victoria st and they can terminate under the Uni. Fout tracks will also be placed between Southbank BVD and the Domain Interchange
Now I may be an idiot, but there is one thing I am not, sir, and that, sir, is an idiot.
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mjja
Sir Nigel Gresley
Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
Location: Mount Waverley, Melbourne
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Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 7:49 pm
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Regular shuttle services would be better than suburban services converging - you get a more even passenger load and you know there's no point rushing to catch a tram because there will be another one behind, guaranteed.
Ideally I would like to see two minute frequency rather than three minute, but I guess it's a case of what Mr Brumby is willing to pay for.
If this is the latest iteration of the last YT grand plan then the shuttle trams will be long and 100% low floor - which will be good for moving large numbers of people in peak time. Hopefully they stand up to the PTUA and have ONLY flip-down seats along the walls to leave lots of standing room - it's a short trip folks! Of course that would mean they can't put those trams on suburban routes, but it should be doable.
Running all the suburban trams via William St will be interesting - where would they terminate? Probably Peel St, which would then need an upgrade. More services along Kingsway won't do any harm incidentally.
PS Mr Mulder - passenger friendly means being able to get on the tram. Have you ever been on a Z1 in evening peak? Not pretty.
Happy Gunzelling and remember, "Go by rail!"
Michael Angelico
President, Smart Passengers Inc
(My opinions are my own unless specifically stated.)
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rob72
Beginner
Joined: Oct 14, 2008
Last Visited: Nov 12, 2008
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Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 10:18 pm
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| Robbb01 wrote: |
closing off Swanstan st fully to traffic from Southbank BVD to Victoria St....place 4 tracks between there...tunnel two at Victoria st and they can terminate under the Uni. Fout tracks will also be placed between Southbank BVD and the Domain Interchange |
Yeah, not going to happen. Stand on the corner of Southbank BVD & St. Kilda Road at 5pm any weekday and watch the number of northbound cars. The roadworks at the arts centre have made a mess of the traffic as-is, where are you going to funnel all those cars? Queensbridge st? Kings Way?
North of the city there are many more options (Spencer, King, Lygon, Nicholson, Rathdown, Elizabeth, William) but south we're stuck with St Kilda road.
r.
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