Today's Herald-Sun article

Gauntlet · Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 10:07 am

Yarra Trams to remove suburban services from Swanston St, St Kilda Rd
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,24481080-2862,00.html

joffie · Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 3:31 pm

You couldn't change the title to something a little more meaningful, could you?

Photo's here
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connexwest · Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:43 pm

The Herald Sun really is full of crap.

Where do I start?

A)- During the Grand Prix, general speaking what YT are proposing in the article takes place and there seems to be no problem with any person catching a GP shuttle tram from Fed Square to Commercial Road, High Street, Domain Interchange and St Kilda Junction to connect with their relevant tram. Admittedly, there is a lot of CSEs/TA's about to assist, but generally speaking, given time there shouldn't be any major problem if this situation was to be implemented on a full time basis; especially if they all connected at a central location such as Domain Interchange.

B) A reduction of frequency from one minute to 3 minute is really neither hear or there. If they were to move routes from St Kilda Road/Swanston Street (as seen during the Commonwealth Games and proven to be a success in the sense YT have been wanting to implement it on a full time basis), it would not only help ease the congestion of the trams, but allow for a more smoother ride and frequency of trams to travel. At the moment, you can sometimes wait at Fed Square on the UP and not see a tram for a good ten minutes. Then, in a period of 5 or 6 minutes, you'll have a dozen or so trams come into the stop. If the suggestion does go ahead, it should help reduce this from occurring.

Rob

Check out my tram pictures at http://robsgallery.fotopic.net/

Robbb01 · Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 6:47 pm

I read this article and i though....WHY?
Place 4 tram tracks down St Kilda Road and then send some trams through Flinders St.......or build a tunnel under Swanston St...tram tunnel
Expensive...yes....
Make a Melbourne City congestion tax!

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MelbourneCity · Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 9:49 pm

There were proposals in the 50s and 60s for trams to be put in tunnels under Bourke and Swanston Street.
IMO that would of killed Melbourne and made it generic.

4 tracks is not really viable either - it could ruin the aesthetics of one of our finest thoroughfares.

I think maybe sending some services down William Street may help a bit - maybe send route 72 down Park Street and run it to the Hospital precinct.

MELBOURNE CITY

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Speed · Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:06 pm

Firstly, something that requires infrastructure changes as the article suggests is unlikely to be in effect by 2010.

Secondly, if this is supposed to reduce congestion on St Kilda Road, I don't see that it will succeed. High-density commercial development extends well beyond Domain Road. If passengers alighting at Flinders Street or Melbourne Central continue to board trams at Federation Square, a significant number will want to travel beyond Domain Interchange. If that required changing at Domain Interchange, then the chaos at Federation Square/ Flinders Street will be duplicated to the south.

For a CBD-shuttle service to be effective, it would need to go as far as Dandenong Road, if not Carlisle Street.

Natronomonas · Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 3:09 pm

Phin blogged about something like this a while back, only it seemed a bit better thought out that the YT proposal (or what was reported, anyway).

Robbb01 · Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:21 pm

mjja · Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 7:49 pm

Regular shuttle services would be better than suburban services converging - you get a more even passenger load and you know there's no point rushing to catch a tram because there will be another one behind, guaranteed.

Ideally I would like to see two minute frequency rather than three minute, but I guess it's a case of what Mr Brumby is willing to pay for.

If this is the latest iteration of the last YT grand plan then the shuttle trams will be long and 100% low floor - which will be good for moving large numbers of people in peak time. Hopefully they stand up to the PTUA and have ONLY flip-down seats along the walls to leave lots of standing room - it's a short trip folks! Of course that would mean they can't put those trams on suburban routes, but it should be doable.

Running all the suburban trams via William St will be interesting - where would they terminate? Probably Peel St, which would then need an upgrade. More services along Kingsway won't do any harm incidentally.

PS Mr Mulder - passenger friendly means being able to get on the tram. Have you ever been on a Z1 in evening peak? Not pretty.

Happy Gunzelling and remember, "Go by rail!"

Michael Angelico
President, Smart Passengers Inc
(My opinions are my own unless specifically stated.)

rob72 · Beginner Joined: Oct 14, 2008 Last Visited: Jan 7, 2009

Mr. Lane · Posted: Sat Dec 06, 2008 12:51 pm

I overheard a some YT employees and one was saying that he had seen some design proposals for new super stops for St. Kilda Road.

There was no mention of any changes to the service though.

I would like to see the shuttle service go from Melbourne University to St. Kilda Junction...if it is only to Domain Interchange then it is not worth it, as it will not solve the problem of waiting for a City bound tram on the busy part of St Kilda Road in the afternoon peak. A wait of 7 or 8 minutes is usually only ended by the arrival of 3 or 4 Z-class trams, none of which have room to take people on board.

Glen Iris and Camberwell trams both join St.Kilda Road between Domain Interchange and St. Kilda Junction, these should be run though to William Street, perhaps one of them actually merging with the 55...and the other terminating at Peel Street (probably the longer Camberwell to terminate at Peel Street).

Other routes should terminate at St. Kilda Junction. The 1 and 8 would run as they do now.

A new order of trams, my preference the Siemens Combino Plus, would be ordered for this new system. The Combino Plus is an impressive tram, the 3 module one is 27m, almost as long as a 5 module first generation Combino which is 29m).

The shuttle trams should be 4 module (36m) like the Lisbon tram trialled not long back. These would be based at a new depot in Docklands.

3 module trams would be bought to replace Z1 and Z2's, and get the handful of A's and B's freed up for other lines. I guess you could also buy more to get the Z3's freed up for other lines as well. Camberwell and Glen Iris could be given priority for conversion so William Street would gain these long low floor trams...

Well, that is how I would do it...

I have no Signature

tonyp · Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 8:09 am

This is unbelievably stupid.

Aren't these the key words:

'But Yarra Trams chief Dennis Cliche said reinventing the tram network along Melbourne's premier boulevard was the only way to lessen the impact of the public transport crisis.

"Trams are getting hung up in the suburban part of their routes and the whole thing becomes a parade when they hit St Kilda Rd," he said. '

Shouldn't they be dealing with "trams getting hung up in the suburban part of their routes"? That's the last place they should be getting hung up. Why are they? Is this the lack of clearways again?

penov · Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:23 am

YarraTramDriver · Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:26 am

The problem is simple - Slow tram drivers. Get rid of the donkeys, and you get rid of the problem.

tonyp · Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:29 am

^^
Thanks penov. So tram tracks need to be quaratined from general traffic on busy suburban routes and that might eliminate the need for such a radical and counterproductive solution further in. Perhaps Cliche is actually trying to wind the government up to get them to do something much more for general tram priority.