The demise of the Leongatha line and future of the corridor

 
  hotdogpants1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Here.
The Leongatha track was left by the Government for ten years until the decision was made in 2008.  The chances of a rail trail from Cranbourne East (Clyde) - Nyora would be very unlikely.  Why, because it would cost more than it would to dismantle the track, maintain bridges and culverts, clearance of vegetation would make the expenses sky rocket and making safe road crossings in place of the old rail crossing would be hard to do.  I can't imagine the Leongatha line's treatment when rail traffic ran.  I think the Barry Beach goods, Leongatha + Yarram line freight and passenger and the Koala sand siding closures killed the line.  Well the Liberal Government lead by Jeff Kennet did.  I am very happy to see a tourist railway from Nyora - Korumburra - Leongatha.  If the line was not restored by SGR the South Gippsland line would have probably become a rail trail.  So much for the Great Southern Railway.  I think once SGR chooses to back up, the line will become a whole Great Southern Rail trail with the Bass Coast rail trail joining up from Nyora.  I still believe if Lynne Kosky did not drop the voting system for the Leongatha line the line would be running right now.  That's right due to costs of reopening the line she dropped the voting system so she could close it herself rather than benefiting South Gippsland by eliminating trucks on the highway.  I was told the vote was 70per cent in favour of reopening the line and 30per cent closure.  I just don't care about people who think the line should be closed I think people need to think again and benefit South Gippsland for once.  Come on our transport system is in crisis.
"2008godforbid"

Just as much as I desperately want the South Gippy railway to re-open, the odds are not on our side. You have a pretty good argument, except for here -

Why, because it would cost more than it would to dismantle the track, maintain bridges and culverts, clearance of vegetation would make the expenses sky rocket and making safe road crossings in place of the old rail crossing would be hard to do.
"godforbid2008"

It would cost even more to the same except instead of dismantling, they have to replace poor track, re-upgrade level crossings, add new signals (very expensive), add new station buildings and upgrade platforms at Koo Wee Rup, Lang Lang, etc.
I already sent Lynne Kosky a very convincing email - after 3 months, I got one back, saying its too expensive, etc.
I'd suggest SGR try to save Nyora to Lang Lang or Koo Wee Rup while they still can. They already maintain about 30 k's of track- but I'm not sure if they can handle 50 or not.
Then again, the government has too much on their plate than to dismantle and pave over the South Gippsland line- It wasn't even mentioned on the Vic transport plan. Smile

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  gippslander Chief Commissioner

Location: Central Gippsland, Vic
This matter has been discussed on numerous occasions before, but let's clear matter up for once and for all:

+ The State Government did make a general committment that it would re-open the line prior to assuming office in 1999.
+ However, the silence from South Gippsland was half hearted at best - unlike the Save the Train group at Bairnsdale, neither the local Council or community ever seriously pushed for the trains to come back.
+ The feasibility report prepared by the State made it clear that the capital costs to restore the line far outweighed the benefits of two or three trains a day for a fairly sparse population.
+ The funds needed would be far better spent on much-needed rail projects elsewhere in the State, most particularly in the metro area.  
+ There were opportunities to get freight back into South Gippsland but there is no will in Government to push this issue, and PN clearly was not interested.
+ Just be grateful that SGR has worked darned hard for 15 years to keep Nyora-Leongatha operational - if it wasn't for them it would all be rail trail by now!
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
The shed was stuffed, most of It's floor was missing and was In poor condition.

The Leongatha CFA used to use It for fire rescue training

I think the excuses the Government used on the Koo - Wee - Rup swamp and bridges + culverts is a load of rubbish.  The gradient on the line from Nyora - Korumburra especially Bena is a major problem.  
"2008godforbid"


The 1996 era sprinters were designed to work this line, But Kenett and Brown said No

One thing of Interest was the railcars were to be able to travel at 85 km/h In the Bena and Korumburra Hills, thats on 20, 25 & 30 chain curves on 90 Lb/Yard (I think It might be 94 Lb between Korumburra and Leongatha)
"Sounds a bit fast to me"



The livestock on the track from Caldermeade - Leongatha is a problem as well.  

Imagine if a passenger train was going at 80km, well that was the old speed limit and hit a cow.  That would hold up the train.
"2008godforbid"


Very much the same If a train hit a farm animal on any other line In Victoria (and they do)

The liability laws are stacked against the owners of livestock, If their animals exscape form their property they are liable for all damage the animals cause (unless foul play can be proven)
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
I think SGTR would like a coal fired steam locomotive better than an extended track to run on, If they had the choice.
"Nightfire"

I understand that, but what's gonna happen when the rail trail has been made and the SGR have nothing to do except run trains? I suggest they do what they can before its too late, set some things into motion, but as stated before, no restoration as of yet due to money problems.
"hotdogpants1"


I would think that Lang Lang would be a much better catchment point that to Nyora given It Is on the Highway (well not too far off) between Melbourne and Phillip Island / Bass Coast where a great lot of tourist travel along

There Is only one level crossing between the towns and the station area Is out of the way of the Lang Lang shopping strip (but still close)

The extension nearly happened back around year 2000 but Insurance Issues with Freight Victoria shot that plan down.
I think SGTR even advertised the extension but axed It at the "11 hour"

I am open to correction hear.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
One Interesting thing about Lang Lang now Is that there are still points leading Into roads 3 and 4, but roads 3 and 4 have been lifted.

Same thing at the Monomeith super siding the points are still there but the siding has been lifted.

I did read something about SGTR In a Korumburra new letter that they were Interested In running to Koala as the track was In ok condition.
But there Is not much there arpart from the sand factory but the siding does back onto a "Parks Victoria" Reserve, (Lang Lang something)
To get to this siding you have yo go bush walking through this park (I just walked due North to I struck the Railway) The easy way would be to just dive to It via Unimin 's private road (unless you get stoped)

Note at Korumburra the footing have been layed for two train sheds one over road 3 and the other Is a rebuild of the former loco shed (over the pits)
Don't know how Is building the sheds.
  luznug Banned

Location: Banned
Being a inquisitive Gunzul that I am I would like to ask a couple of question in regards to the South Gippy Tourist Railway

Whats the life expectancy of the Sand Mine at Lang Lang?

Who helps fund the railway?

Whats the average yearly passenger numbers?

Who officially owns the line between Cranbourne-Leongatha?

With the Great Recession happening is SGTR registered on Work for the Dole?
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Being a inquisitive Gunzul that I am I would like to ask a couple of question in regards to the South Gippy Tourist Railway

Whats the life expectancy of the Sand Mine at Lang Lang?
"luznug"


there are Four companies that I know of that mine sand In the Lang Lang/ Koala/Nyora area

TGS Sand and Soil
Unimin
Frank Vella Sand
Nyora Sands

And there are others

As for how many years left of sand reserves.
I would say the sand would last well Into the foreseeable future

The "sand belt" goes all the way down South past Grantville and across to the Bass River and out to the Bay
So I don't think they will be running out any time soon

The sand Is part of South Gippslands very unique and difficult ground soils
  tranzitjim Chief Commissioner

Location: Banned
Does anyone have any info when a V/Line N Class loco ran on the South Gippsland Railway?  I would love to see pictures of this diesel on the old line when it was running passenger trains.  Why were they used on the line?  I would love to also see Koala Siding Sand train pictures as well.
"2008godforbid"


While the 3 car H set, was almost always hauled by a P class locomotive, I can remember being on the train when an 'N class' did in fact haul the train.

Would have been very late 1980s, or very early 1990s.  It happened more than once, to cover a failed P class I think.

ALSO, they ran an 'N car set' down, to run 'free promotional trips between I think Korumburra and Leongatha.  I believe that would have been hauled by an N class locomotive.

It did happen, I know that for sure. It would be very nice to have a photo showing it.
  L1150 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Pakenham Vic.
Independant Susan Davies, when she was member for the area, was very keen to get the sand traffic back on rail. Liberal Ken Smith, the current member, is a remnant of the "close it all down" Kennet era and judging by some correspondence I had with him, is not at all interested in supporting any push for anything (passenger or freight) beyond Cranbourne.  Crying or Very sad
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
What ever happened to the Freight Australia contact for Koala Siding Sand.  Did they abandon it, didn't care, undecided, want to or what is going on?Question   I here the sand industry is still in use.  
"2008godforbid"


The relationship between the Victorian Government and Freight Australia went pear shape back In 2001 and FA threatened to serspend all Investment In the Victorian freight network unless the Government dropped It's open access plan (that FA claimed would ruin their Victorian business)
Peter Batchelor held his ground and FA followed through with their threat, and from than on the Sand train was dead In the water along with other operations FA where planing (Mount Gambier)

FA could no longer see any return In Investing In revitilising the Victorian network
  davesvline Chief Commissioner

Location: 1983-1998
Excellent - wise move.
  fabricator Chief Commissioner

Location: Gawler
One other problem is that it's increasingly difficult to source high quality species timber (like yellow stringybark).
"gippslander"


Simple solution grow a stand or two of these trees somewhere nearby, in a few decades they'll be ready for use, when some of the old ones need replacing. Might need to scatter them around to avoid acts of fire.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Guys, Is still need an answer why all the stations from Cranbourne - Nyora line and some of the stations on the Nyora - Leongatha get burnt down?
List of stations burnt down:= Clyde, Tooradin, Koo - Wee - Rup, Lang Lang, Jeetho,  Bena, White Law, Kardella, Ruby.  Unsure with Kardella and Ruby.
"2008godforbid"


Vandalism ?

A quick, safe and easy way to demolish an old building ?


The name "Whitelaw" Is one word not two
  MOM Chief Commissioner

Location: here, there, everywhere....


snip...

Vanillism ?

A quick,safe and easy way to demolish an old building ?


The name Whitelaw Is one word not two
"Nightfire"


and Vanillism is what exactly?
  hotdogpants1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Here.


snip...

Vanillism ?

A quick,safe and easy way to demolish an old building ?


The name Whitelaw Is one word not two
"Nightfire"


and Vanillism is what exactly?
"MOM"

Vandalism, obviously. It's called a typo....
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Another article In the South Gippsland Sentinel Times about planing Issues In the township of Korumburra reads

The rail land
Cr Fawcett said he didn't believe there was any commercial interest in the Korumburra railway land at the moment, but noted VicTrack had recently told the shire that all It's land was for sale if the price was right,although they weren't prepared to give up the rail corridor, even east of Leongatha.
  hotdogpants1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Here.
Another article In the South Gippsland Sentinel Times about planing Issues In the township of Korumburra reads

The rail land
Cr Fawcett said he didn't believe there was any commercial interest in the Korumburra railway land at the moment, but noted VicTrack had recently told the shire that all It's land was for sale if the price was right,although they weren't prepared to give up the rail corridor, even east of Leongatha.
"Nightfire"

I don't understand? Give up the the rail corridor, even east of Leongatha? It's a rail trail!
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland

I don't understand? Give up the the rail corridor, even east of Leongatha? It's a rail trail!
"hotdogpants1"


The Government won't sell the land the Railway occupies or once occupied to private developers or land owners
  hotdogpants1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Here.

I don't understand? Give up the the rail corridor, even east of Leongatha? It's a rail trail!
"hotdogpants1"


The Government won't sell the land the Railway occupies or once occupied to private developers or land owners
"Nightfire"

Ah ok, thats good. How does that affect railway services? Or Is it just that the rail trail will stay, and the land it occupies won't be bought?
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland


Is it just that the rail trail will stay, and the land it occupies won't be bought?
"hotdogpants1"


Yes thats right

So there will still be the provision for the railway to be rebuilt back to Barry Beach or even Yarram (If ever needed In the future)
  hotdogpants1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Here.


Is it just that the rail trail will stay, and the land it occupies won't be bought?
"hotdogpants1"


Yes thats right

So there will still be the provision for the railway to be rebuilt back to Barry Beach or even Yarram (If ever needed In the future)
"Nightfire"

Thanks for that. Smile
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
If they ever rebuild the railway past Leongatha - Yarram, Foster and Barry Beach.  What will they do about the falling apart Tarwin Trestle Bridges? Especially the one next to the highway, it looks like it could fall down at any time.  How will they build bridges in their places?
"2008godforbid"


You wouldn't touch the old bridges at all.

Build new concrete bridges beside them ?
  MOM Chief Commissioner

Location: here, there, everywhere....
why would you want to re-build a line to Barry Beach?
  hotdogpants1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Here.
why would you want to re-build a line to Barry Beach?
"MOM"

If there were any Oil traffic to the Oil platforms in the Bass Strait in the future, then I assume that would be why.
Or, in our case- We'd just like to see it happen because we're gunzels.  Laughing
  MOM Chief Commissioner

Location: here, there, everywhere....
No, forget Oil...Time to get away from la la land.....

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