Spencer street St action is back

 
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Yes, the Liberal party endorsed the motion, but renaming the station is not government policy. The transport minister said following the conference that there are better things to spend the money on.
MelbourneCity

The name is a legacy of Bracks and Bachelor.

They are never keen to erase each other's legacy works/names, despite sitting opposite each other in parliament.

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  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
Oh yes and just what major infrastructure projects will you fund with the little amount it will cost to change over some signage.
Think before making yourself look silly.
Black Hoppers
It's certainly not going to cover a single infrastructure project, but might help pay a part of one.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
I'm quite happy about the cost of changing back to Spencer Street Station, because it's changing something stupid back to something sensible.
  SPSD40T2 Chief Commissioner

Location: Platform 9-3/4 and still waiting !!
Very happy to see Spencer St return. It is after all the name of he Station that occupied this loccation for over a 150 years.  Those cringe mongering rabids who felt compelled to hide their embarassment  ( and really a total lack of historical understanding ) in renaming it to somethng as plastic and irrlevent as SC are the ones who ought to be held accountable. Spencer St has a rightful place and naming in this city's history. Ill be glad to see it back
  TheBlacksmith Chief Commissioner

Location: Ankh Morpork
Couldn't care less, I never stopped calling it Spencer street anyway......
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
Bizarrely the motion was put by the Young Liberals, most of whom wouldn't remember it operating under it's original name.

None, I dare say, would have known it under its original name.  That was Batman's Hill.  

Isn't it time to stop political point-scoring and meddling and get on with creating a decent and viable public transport network?  We have the station (by what ever name) but we don't always get the service to match.  If there's money try buying more trains and track capacity before yet another rebranding or arguably pointless name change.

And yes I do still refer to  it as "Spencer Street station"  Wink
  electric Chief Train Controller

Location: Ist mir egal
Oh yes and just what major infrastructure projects will you fund with the little amount it will cost to change over some signage.
Think before making yourself look silly.
Black Hoppers

Melbourne's network is sufficiently run down that every concrete sleeper and every piece of ballast count. Every man hour spent bring the track a bit closer to some sort of standard is important. Also, given how many train stickers there are and well over hundreds of metal signs in the station, including the big glass doors on the station entries will need replacing, maps reprinted, signs changed at other stations, etc. etc. ad infinitum, the money that could be spent there may well fund a decent chunk of a train. Which again, given our 90% fleet utilisation, is absolutely more important than fulfilling some people's obsessions with throwing good money after a bad decision. Get over it already.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
They waste such huge amounts of money on seemingly inconsequential things why should changing the main terminus name back to the original be a problem.

How many millions wasted on re-branding the trains and trams, over and over and over.  How much money did they spend just a few years ago throwing away all the Connex uniforms, ripping old Connex stickers off everything, just for the sake of giving the contract to the Hong Kong government?  Wasting money on change-of-name is what our state government does best - both sides do it really well and do it frequently.  I say let them do what they do best and waste a few million more on yet another name change so we can erase that awful half-baked marketing idea from Peter Bachelor forever.

Anyway, the original Southern Cross was actually hoisted at Ballarat East during the Eureka rebellion, not in Melbourne.  The name has got sweet FA to do with the actual location... a more appropriate name would have been Melbourne Central but a shopping centre already stole that one.
  XAM2175 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Glasgow
Yet at Melbourne Central yesterday trains were being described by PRIDE as "running express from Melbourne Central to Spencer Street", and in the new voice too.

The display screens continued to say Southern Cross though.

Maybe on the topic of undoing some other stupid ideas - could we also have Ric Stone back? And the original layout and access points for Museum station?
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
Yet at Melbourne Central yesterday trains were being described by PRIDE as "running express from Melbourne Central to Spencer Street", and in the new voice too.

The display screens continued to say Southern Cross though.
jb17kx
This at least should be fixed.  A visitor to Melbourne could be excused for thinking that they are two different stations.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Yet at Melbourne Central yesterday trains were being described by PRIDE as "running express from Melbourne Central to Spencer Street", and in the new voice too.

The display screens continued to say Southern Cross though.

Maybe on the topic of undoing some other stupid ideas - could we also have Ric Stone back? And the original layout and access points for Museum station?
jb17kx

GPT insisted when redeveloping the centre (about ten years ago) that the direct access from Swanston Street into the station had to go or shopping centre would not be viable.  At that stage the place was in dire straits, the anchor tenant (Daimaru) had just walked and they were having trouble keeping smaller tenants.

Dept of Transport simply complied with what was being asked despite the fact that it's been turned into rat maze.  If you asked GPT why its such a rat maze they would respond how much 'friendlier' or 'convenient' it is.  Nothing to do with proper access or being able to get in or out easily - on top of the extra walking you would have to do it's certainly made a proper evacuation difficult because instead of the access direct to Swanston street you have to go back inside the shopping centre first.  What if the shopping centre is on fire/full of smoke?  

But hey, what's a few lives in a fire when you can get bigger rents from forcing train passengers though a rat maze.  I'm truly surprised GPT didn't make it a condition that you also had to spend money in their shops first before you could enter the station (maybe get stamps from retailers?).

Come to think of it, the recent renovation of Southern Cross has left us with a similar layout - you have to navigate your way through these extra shops to try and get though to the trains.  I recall the spin from when they first announced the 'renovation' saying how much more 'convenient' it was going to be and I thought 'uh oh, another Rat Maze Central'.
  raudteejaam Junior Train Controller

Oh yes and just what major infrastructure projects will you fund with the little amount it will cost to change over some signage.
Think before making yourself look silly.
Black Hoppers
I daresay it will cost more than you imagine. It's not just a matter of changing over "some signage". There'd be a lot of back-end work you simply wouldn't think about or see.

Consider the following:

*Replacing every sign at Southern Cross to say Spencer Street.
*Reprogramming the PIDs and assorted information systems to say Spencer St and not Southern Cross
*Reprogramming the Myki systems so that it registers you at Spencer St and not Southern Cross
*Reprogramming the Vline ticketing system to reflect the change
*Reprogramming the PTV & Vline websites to reflect the change
*Ensuring every single system/facility/piece of paper in PTV/State Government refers to Spencer St and not Southern Cross. (this is a BIG cost item)
*Reprinting and replacing network maps at every station in Melbourne
*Reprinting and replacing network maps on each train carriage (though admittedly, these need updating in a lot of cases anyway; some are 4 years old currently)
*Reprinting and replacing each printed timetable posted up around Melbourne
*An advertising campaign to alert the public that the name has changed.

God only knows what else that I can't think of from the top of my head. Having worked in Government before today, I know how these seemingly small things can cost an awful lot to actually implement. Government projects  A ballpark figure, I would say the cost of changing the station name would be somewhere in the region of $2 mill, all said and done. I'm sure that $2 mill could be better invested somewhere else!
  Camster Chief Commissioner

Location: Geelong
I daresay it will cost more than you imagine. It's not just a matter of changing over "some signage". There'd be a lot of back-end work you simply wouldn't think about or see.

Consider the following:

*Replacing every sign at Southern Cross to say Spencer Street.
*Reprogramming the PIDs and assorted information systems to say Spencer St and not Southern Cross
*Reprogramming the Myki systems so that it registers you at Spencer St and not Southern Cross
*Reprogramming the Vline ticketing system to reflect the change
*Reprogramming the PTV & Vline websites to reflect the change
*Ensuring every single system/facility/piece of paper in PTV/State Government refers to Spencer St and not Southern Cross. (this is a BIG cost item)
*Reprinting and replacing network maps at every station in Melbourne
*Reprinting and replacing network maps on each train carriage (though admittedly, these need updating in a lot of cases anyway; some are 4 years old currently)
*Reprinting and replacing each printed timetable posted up around Melbourne
*An advertising campaign to alert the public that the name has changed.

God only knows what else that I can't think of from the top of my head. Having worked in Government before today, I know how these seemingly small things can cost an awful lot to actually implement. Government projects  A ballpark figure, I would say the cost of changing the station name would be somewhere in the region of $2 mill, all said and done. I'm sure that $2 mill could be better invested somewhere else!
raudteejaam
Preferred Spencer Street, changing back may be a waste of time and money, but could perhaps be minimized by waiting for a new line to open or something.
  Braddo Deputy Commissioner

Location: Narre Warren

Come to think of it, the recent renovation of Southern Cross has left us with a similar layout - you have to navigate your way through these extra shops to try and get though to the trains.  I recall the spin from when they first announced the 'renovation' saying how much more 'convenient' it was going to be and I thought 'uh oh, another Rat Maze Central'.
don_dunstan
This is a good point. The old SSS, whilst quite rundown, was a more convenient station to use. I do not recall what Museum was like but I'm sure it was also much more convenient.

The Victorian Government seems to enjoy spending money on worsening things rather than improving them.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy

I daresay it will cost more than you imagine. It's not just a matter of changing over "some signage". There'd be a lot of back-end work you simply wouldn't think about or see.
Consider the following:
*Replacing every sign at Southern Cross to say Spencer Street.

*Reprogramming the PIDs and assorted information systems to say Spencer St and not Southern Cross

*Reprogramming the Myki systems so that it registers you at Spencer St and not Southern Cross

*Reprogramming the Vline ticketing system to reflect the change

*Reprogramming the PTV & Vline websites to reflect the change

*Ensuring every single system/facility/piece of paper in PTV/State Government refers to Spencer St and not Southern Cross. (this is a BIG cost item)

*Reprinting and replacing network maps at every station in Melbourne

*Reprinting and replacing network maps on each train carriage (though admittedly, these need updating in a lot of cases anyway; some are 4 years old currently)

*Reprinting and replacing each printed timetable posted up around Melbourne

*An advertising campaign to alert the public that the name has changed.
God only knows what else that I can't think of from the top of my head. Having worked in Government before today, I know how these seemingly small things can cost an awful lot to actually implement. Government projects  A ballpark figure, I would say the cost of changing the station name would be somewhere in the region of $2 mill, all said and done. I'm sure that $2 mill could be better invested somewhere else!
"raudteejaam"



A very good list, showing yet another reason why the change to SCS was ridiculous.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
This is a good point. The old SSS, whilst quite rundown, was a more convenient station to use. I do not recall what Museum was like but I'm sure it was also much more convenient.

The Victorian Government seems to enjoy spending money on worsening things rather than improving them.
Braddo
The old Spencer Street was dated and dank in that underpass but the new one was complete overkill.  The roof looks really good from above but inside the building it can be surprisingly dark during the day, especially in winter.  It often gets smoky and smelly in there especially when there are a lot of idoling train-sets at once or if there is no breeze to keep the fumes moving.  I also strongly agree with you about the flow of pedestrians too, I don't think it was a substantial improvement over the old set up.   You now have the added problem of having to move through too many levels at the Collins Street end if you are changing between suburban/V-Line services, a problem made worse with these silly extra shops obstructing your path.

Southern Cross Station ran way over budget when being constructed too.  I knew a plumber who was working on the project and he said that there were lots of problems with properly collecting and dispersing the rainwater so it wouldn't stress the roof; we all saw what happened when it hailed (the extra weight broke through the skylight) a couple of years ago so obviously there were design issues with the revolutionary wavy roof.  There was some clause in the PPP that stipulated 'commercial in confidence' if there were cost over-runs so we were never allowed to know the true costs or where the burden of responsibility was for that.

I agree with you, we seem to get big money spent on these projects but the improvement is often marginal.
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
The benefit is rather more than marginal when you consider the state the suburban platforms were in before the rebuild.  Open to the weather, archaic and often filthy toilets .......

As a gateway to Melbourne and an interstate terminal it was a let-down. It had none of the grandeur of Sydney Central nor the architectural merits of Brisbane's Roma Street (the older part of it anyway!) instead it was cavernous and often dark and uninviting.  At least now it's a large airy and enclosed (as enclosed as a railway station can be) structure which is unique and attracts comment from visitors and others.  It's not faultless by any means but for my money it's a big improvement on the run-down place Spencer Street had become.  That owed more to the 1950s and any glory was badly faded; Southern Cross at least belongs to the 21st Century and will serve Melbourne for perhaps another 100 years to come.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
The benefit is rather more than marginal when you consider the state the suburban platforms were in before the rebuild.  Open to the weather, archaic and often filthy toilets .......

As a gateway to Melbourne and an interstate terminal it was a let-down. It had none of the grandeur of Sydney Central nor the architectural merits of Brisbane's Roma Street (the older part of it anyway!) instead it was cavernous and often dark and uninviting.  At least now it's a large airy and enclosed (as enclosed as a railway station can be) structure which is unique and attracts comment from visitors and others.  It's not faultless by any means but for my money it's a big improvement on the run-down place Spencer Street had become.  That owed more to the 1950s and any glory was badly faded; Southern Cross at least belongs to the 21st Century and will serve Melbourne for perhaps another 100 years to come.
Gwiwer
Agreed, the only good thing about the old terminal was the huge train mural.  Everything else was cheap and reflected the diminished status of train travel in the sixties by the time it was rebuilt.

Southern Cross will be much better with a mostly 25kv V-Line fleet in the future (if that ever happens).  The diesel fumes can be really overpowering on those upper levels, especially in hot, still weather.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
What's in a name?  That which we call a railway station by any other name would smell as sweet (or not, as the case may be - diesel fumes excepted).  At least, in those days there were helpful signs in the archaic toilets, such as "Do Not Spit", and "Please Adjust Your Dress Before Leaving".
  xxxxlbear Token Booking Clerk

Location: Geelong
One thing I do miss about Spencer Street, apart from the name, is the 1st floor cafeteria.
The food might have been a tad basic, but at least it was cheap....and tasty. And a nice, inviting place to sit and eat a hot meal while waiting for a train. The sausages (plus gravy) and three veg was sensational Smile
And the view across Spencer Street itself from a window-side table was a bonus too.
  Madjikthise Assistant Commissioner

Open to the weather, archaic and often filthy toilets .......
Gwiwer

A rather accurate description of Flinders St.
  rwatts Junior Train Controller

Location: Adelaide SA
One thing I do miss about Spencer Street, apart from the name, is the 1st floor cafeteria.
The food might have been a tad basic, but at least it was cheap....and tasty. And a nice, inviting place to sit and eat a hot meal while waiting for a train. The sausages (plus gravy) and three veg was sensational Smile
And the view across Spencer Street itself from a window-side table was a bonus too.
xxxxlbear
My Mother took my sister and myself on the Overland to Melbourne in 1969, and the only thing I really remember about Spencer Street Station was that cafeteria!  

Back in the seventies the Adelaide station cafeteria was not too bad either but certainly didn't have the same ambience as SSS.

Richard.
  Flagstaff Red Afro

Location: Eaglemont, Hursty line, Melbourne.
Isn't it cheaper in the long run to change it back to 'Spencer Street'?  The announcements when changing the name to Southern Cross were more required than would be for changing it to  Spencer Street' because the road 'Spencer Street' is a well known feature near the station, people knew roughly where to go.  There is no famous 'Southern Cross' feature, locality or item nearby, this name gives no indication of where you are if at the station or where to go if you want to get there.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
The name "Spencer Street" seems to pair well with "Flinders Street".  It was easy to explain to visitors that one was the country terminus and the other the suburban terminus.

There seems to be some confusion about the origin of the new name.  As I recall, "Southern Cross" was actually a bright idea that Peter Bachelor had whist on holidays during the new station planning ten years ago.  Yes, that's right, the talented and hard-working minister who signed such wonderful contracts as 'Smart' Meters and myki.  I never forget Peter Bachelor.  He's the one I thank every time my myki overcharges me because all the validators are broken/off-line at my destination station... what a wonderful system myki is, so user-friendly.

For that reason alone we should change the name back to Spencer Street.
don_dunstan
What a ridiculous argument Exclamation

The scrotes and window etchers vandalise the MYKI readers, therefore Southern Cross station should revert to its former name...

Rolling Eyes
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
This at least should be fixed.  A visitor to Melbourne could be excused for thinking that they are two different stations.
Lad_Porter
Ohh....like Sydenham and Watergardens Question

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