Outer Harbour line double/single track

 
  Calgully Deputy Commissioner

Location:
A question from an out-of-stater here.

Browsing the Adelaide Metro timetables I noticed that some M-F Peak trains terminate at Osborne.  I was intrigued to check that there was a crossover at Osborne - but on looking at Google Earth I see that the double track ends just south of Osborne, so that answers how and why those trains can terminate there.

But I have memories from very many years ago of the double track going further north than that.  In fact IIRC the two tracks went all the way to the former Yerlo station then bifurcated to form the balloon loop at Outer Harbour.  I see from Google Earth that it seems there are rails of a second track still in the road at the Osborne Road level crossing so my memory is not completely false.

So, when was this track singled?  Was it when North Haven opened and when the balloon loop was burst (which must have been about 30 years ago), or was it more recent than that?

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  Milkomeda Chief Train Controller

Well the crossover to single track is halfway in between Midlunga and Osborne stations since the crossover is not far from the terminus (Osborne) they are able to have a train terminating there and one terminating at Outer Harbour with only a few minutes or so apart from when they reach the cross over. So one train is already back to Adelaide when the 2nd train arrives
  GN4472 Deputy Commissioner

I think the Outer Harbour loop closed in 1988 or thereabouts, I re-call riding a Jumbo around it for the last time with the Guard on the train asking me what I was doing? - It was when the Bannon Government was in power and gave us the impression they wanted to close the rail system down with the many cut backs, eg: lines closed, services cut, stations reduced to bus shelters, Guards taken off trains etc.............
  Calgully Deputy Commissioner

Location:
I think the Outer Harbour loop closed in 1988 or thereabouts, I re-call riding a Jumbo around it for the last time with the Guard on the train asking me what I was doing? - It was when the Bannon Government was in power and gave us the impression they wanted to close the rail system down with the many cut backs, eg: lines closed, services cut, stations reduced to bus shelters, Guards taken off trains etc.............
GN4472

Thanks.  I see on Wikipedia (so it MUST be true) that North Haven opened and Yerlo closed in 1981, so there was a time when the Outer Harbour loop was still open and North Haven was open.  So, did the double track ever go thru North Haven, or was the line singled south of Osborne at that time or more recently.  If the line was singled at that time then there must have been a set of points at the site of Yerlo at the neck of the balloon loop, but my fallible memory recalls Yerlo as having been two step-up platforms right where the double track diverged.
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
Not sure on the date, but the track was always double whilst the loop was used (that is there were no points to or from the loop)
The loop was closed originally by a pile of ballast just north of the Outer Harbor platform
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

About 2 km of track became redundant once the loop and double track from Osborne was made single. This represents annual maintenance savings.

I did once hear that the loop cause some operational problems because it reversed the consists; A end became B end etc. if trains don't reverse with a loop the consist is always the same in any set.

In terms of turn back.

Trains used to turn back at the middle road at Glanville. Is the middle road still serviceable?  Note I did not say "in service".
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

I did once hear that the loop cause some operational problems because it reversed the consists; A end became B end etc. if trains don't reverse with a loop the consist is always the same in any set.
steam4ian
Some like to post on here every now and then saying that this loop or the cutoff line heading past the Old Adelaide Gaol (not a loop as such) should be retained or even rebuilt as they used to be purely because they say having the facility to turn consists is a good thing.

How right are they though? On such a simple system as Adelaide has where wheel wear shouldn't be too uneven, is there ever really a need to do that kind of thing? I can only think of the Jumbos as a reason to do that (a 3100 split from its normal partner can have the back end coupled to a 3000) and with their days as tuna cans or artificial reefs rapidly approaching even that justification looks to be shrinking.


Trains used to turn back at the middle road at Glanville. Is the middle road still serviceable?  Note I did not say "in service".
steam4ian
The new timetable featuring the Glanville services extended to Osborne only started four months ago. How much does a line deteriorate in such a short period, apart from a bit of rust on the surface of the rails that is easily dealt with?

Of course, on a real railway there would be an interest in keeping facilities like extra turnbacks (and crossovers) in a condition that they can see emergency use even if they don't need to be used on a regular basis. They are important for building in some level of resilience, so the whole system (not just one line, they are too interlaced at the city line for that) doesn't roll over like a pathetic poodle the instant that real life gets in the way of their nice perfect computer models - see that other thread about the inconvenience of 19 kilometres of wrong direction running on the Gawler line.

I see from Google Earth that it seems there are rails of a second track still in the road at the Osborne Road level crossing so my memory is not completely false.
Calgully
The level crossing may have been refurbished since the satellite images were captured for that area though, Google no longer purchases new satellite imagery to replace the old as they now prefer to focus on getting aerial photography just for more interesting areas.


For what it's worth, there are still rails to be seen at the site of a long-gone level crossing in the Pedler Creek gorge on the unlamented Willunga line, and at numerous spots in the Mile End and Port Adelaide areas.
  Black Hoppers Chief Train Controller

Location: Banned
Some like to post on here every now and then saying that this loop or the cutoff line heading past the Old Adelaide Gaol (not a loop as such) should be retained or even rebuilt as they used to be purely because they say having the facility to turn consists is a good thing.

How right are they though? On such a simple system as Adelaide has where wheel wear shouldn't be too uneven, is there ever really a need to do that kind of thing? I can only think of the Jumbos as a reason to do that (a 3100 split from its normal partner can have the back end coupled to a 3000) and with their days as tuna cans or artificial reefs rapidly approaching even that justification looks to be shrinking.



The new timetable featuring the Glanville services extended to Osborne only started four months ago. How much does a line deteriorate in such a short period, apart from a bit of rust on the surface of the rails that is easily dealt with?

Of course, on a real railway there would be an interest in keeping facilities like extra turnbacks (and crossovers) in a condition that they can see emergency use even if they don't need to be used on a regular basis. They are important for building in some level of resilience, so the whole system (not just one line, they are too interlaced at the city line for that) doesn't roll over like a pathetic poodle the instant that real life gets in the way of their nice perfect computer models - see that other thread about the inconvenience of 19 kilometres of wrong direction running on the Gawler line.
"justapassenger"
  62440 Chief Commissioner

I was at the Port Augusta welding depot in about 1990 and the rail from OH loop had just come in for reservicing and is probably still out there somewhere.
Glanville turnback is no longer used but remains intact, the Osborne turnback replaces that service which is appreciated by those north of Glanville who doubled the peak service. I have heard Glanville is up for improvements which would eliminate one island and become a simple two track island. There is a crossover at Port Adelaide Junction and another at Woodville.
  David Peters Dr Beeching

Location: "With Hey Boy".
North Haven used to be a Island platform when built with trains using both sides of the platform, when the line was singled they simply removed one set of rails to make it a single platform. The platform still retains it's heritage as an Island platform though even though now they have put a fence up on the un-used side of it.
  Gayspie Assistant Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
when was the line from midlunga to outer harbor singled; when the balloon loop was closed or when the line was resleepered in the late 1990's? and why was it cut back to midlunga and not north haven?

i would like to see it re doubled from midlunga past the back of the osborne and north haven stations and becoming single line again just after north haven and before kingburg drive. more dual track is better to run more frequent services!!!
  nscaler69 Deputy Commissioner

Location: There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots.
Steamranger ran a trip in October 1988 billed as 'the last steamy to Outer Harbour', the STA probably closed the loop line not long after that.

Looking at the current timetable they allow 6 minutes from Midlunga to O.H. and 5 minutes the other way, that's 11 minutes meaning with driver turn around the line could easily handle a 15 minute service.
  Jumbo2001 Junior Train Controller

Steamranger ran a trip in October 1988 billed as 'the last steamy to Outer Harbour', the STA probably closed the loop line not long after that.

Looking at the current timetable they allow 6 minutes from Midlunga to O.H. and 5 minutes the other way, that's 11 minutes meaning with driver turn around the line could easily handle a 15 minute service.
nscaler69

One problem with that, you only allow 4mins turn around max at OH, which used to be the case and was a very big problem with late running services due to heavy loadings/wheelchairs/etc... This was extended to 8mins to take into account these issues and give a more reliable service. Hence why you have the situation of 15min services in peak times alternating between Osborne and OH. In reality, its unnecessary to go to North Haven and OH every 15 anyway as they have reasonably light patronage.
  Gayspie Assistant Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
why was the line singled at midlunga and not just after north haven and when did that happen; when the loop was closed or during the upgrade 10 to 15 years ago?
  Jumbo2001 Junior Train Controller

why was the line singled at midlunga and not just after north haven and when did that happen; when the loop was closed or during the upgrade 10 to 15 years ago?
Heath Loxton

I don't know the exact reason, but it could have alot to do with Osborne and North Haven being island platforms where as at Midlunga they are side platforms.
  nscaler69 Deputy Commissioner

Location: There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots.
Midnight 29th October 1988 was when the (loop) line was severed. Basically what I said in my last post.
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
I did once hear that the loop cause some operational problems because it reversed the consists; A end became B end etc. if trains don't reverse with a loop the consist is always the same in any set.
steam4ian

Tasmania has/has two triangles used only by engines and passenger cars.

Older freight waggons never used the triangles, so "A" and "B" ends were never reversed.

As a result, freight waggons could be fitted with chains at one end only, and brake handles on one side only.

This saved "first costs", and reduced deadweight.

Weren't they clever?

Meanwhile, in Sydney Sector 3 (ESR and Illawarra) one train a day is sent via the City Circle to reverse it, and allow wheel wear on each side to be equalised.

Aren't they clever?

On the Fortescue railway, the waggons have the brake hoses and ECPB brakes on one side and are not reversible on an individual basis.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
Tasmania has/has two triangles used only by engines and passenger cars.

Older freight waggons never used the triangles, so "A" and "B" ends were never reversed.

As a result, freight waggons could be fitted with chains at one end only, and brake handles on one side only.

This saved "first costs", and reduced deadweight.

Weren't they clever?
awsgc24
What about Western Junction near Launceston?    Older wagons had no choice in the matter - consider loading from Hobart to  Launceston, then Launceston to Burnie and finally Burnie to Hobart.
  Calgully Deputy Commissioner

Location:
Midnight 29th October 1988 was when the (loop) line was severed. Basically what I said in my last post.
nscaler69

OK thanks, but what I wanted to know is was that when the double track was cut back to Midlunga?  What was the track configuration on 30th October 1988 - was it exactly the same as today or did the double track extend further out to North Haven or Yerlo?
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
OK thanks, but what I wanted to know is was that when the double track was cut back to Midlunga?  What was the track configuration on 30th October 1988 - was it exactly the same as today or did the double track extend further out to North Haven or Yerlo?
"Calgully"


AFAIR the layout is the same today as when it was single lined.
  Calgully Deputy Commissioner

Location:
AFAIR the layout is the same today as when it was single lined.
Pressman

OK thanks.  There are two LXs on the single tracked section - Osborne Road and Kilingberg Drive.

Osborne Road http://goo.gl/maps/vQPZ7 second track still in place - and medium sized tree on path of second track so its been a few years
Klingberg Drive  http://goo.gl/maps/Ygt65  no second track - but line seems to swerve from former Up alignment to Down alignment just South of LX back towards North Haven.
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
OK thanks.  There are two LXs on the single tracked section - Osborne Road and Kilingberg Drive.

Osborne Road http://goo.gl/maps/vQPZ7 second track still in place - and medium sized tree on path of second track so its been a few years
Klingberg Drive  http://goo.gl/maps/Ygt65  no second track - but line seems to swerve from former Up alignment to Down alignment just South of LX back towards North Haven.
"Calgully"


Once again memory is a bit sketchy, but I do believe they used the former UP track between Midlunga and Lady Gowrie Drive then swung over to the Down for the last section past the gold course to the OH station.

Also I think that the area between the railway alignment and Victoria Road was in the very early stages of development and Klingberg Drive level crossing did not exist at that time.
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Tony

In days of yore the down track used to cross Lady Ruthen Drive twice.
The first crossing was at the north end of the short northern straight before the bend to head towards the harbour and be parallel with LR Drive.
The down track to the pax platform then turned north and cross LR Drive again. Look closely at the Google map and you can see a reservation just south of LR Drive

There was a facing junction about where South Australia One Drive is located for tracks leading to the wharf. Boat trains used these tracks and later stock trains. The junction was protected by an Outlying Switch Lock and a two arm, one light absolute semaphore. There was a country privy type phone hut which probably had the selector for releasing the signal.
The junction disappeared with the redevelopment of Outer Harbour access some years before the marina development when the down track was shifted north of LR Drive.

The up track had a trailing siding running into what is now the golf course to serve what I think was a concrete pipe plant. There were other trailing connections including that returning from the wharf. Each had a disk starter type signal controlling movements from the siding and an OSL locking the points. All mainline signals except at the junction I mentioned were permissive.

Regards
Ian
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

In days of yore the down track used to cross Lady Ruthen Drive twice.
The first crossing was at the north end of the short northern straight before the bend to head towards the harbour and be parallel with LR Drive.
The down track to the pax platform then turned north and cross LR Drive again. Look closely at the Google map and you can see a reservation just south of LR Drive
steam4ian
The old corridor to the south of LR Dr is now occupied by a much-loathed shared path used only by the occasional pedestrians as cyclists doing the popular LR/Victoria loop prefer to exercise their right to use the road instead of the obstacle-ridden cycling non-facility.
  Calgully Deputy Commissioner

Location:
Tony

In days of yore the down track used to cross Lady Ruthen Drive twice.
The first crossing was at the north end of the short northern straight before the bend to head towards the harbour and be parallel with LR Drive.
The down track to the pax platform then turned north and cross LR Drive again. Look closely at the Google map and you can see a reservation just south of LR Drive


Regards
Ian
steam4ian

Interesting.

Would that be this track visible in Google Street View (dated 2009)?

http://goo.gl/maps/LgDTG

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