Location: Donald. Duck country.
Does anyone know where the Standard Gauge track in Victoria terminates?At the border?
Aus Steam '88, possible to do again?
Donald
Chief Commissioner
Location: Donald. Duck country.
MC3801
Train Controller
Which Steam Locomotives and Diesel Locomotives from NSW and Victoria would take part in the event?
K-Class
Chief Train Controller
Location: Melbourne
Does anyone know where the Standard Gauge track in Victoria terminates?The SG track enters the state at Serviceton from SA, and Wodonga and Yarrawonga from NSW. Southern Cross is the southeastern extremity in Melbourne .
The other end of the lines within Vic are Portland, Yaapeet, Hopetoun and Dunolly (on the currently closed line from Ararat).
Matt
Barrington Womble
Photo Nazi
Location: Banned
Which Steam Locomotives and Diesel Locomotives from NSW and Victoria would take part in the event?What event?
It simply won't happen. Too many things have changed for an event like this to ever occur again.
Fireman Dave
Chief Commissioner
Location: Shh, I'm hiding
Not with that attitude it won't. You should never say never, who knows what could occur with a change of government etc. If we can do such things north of the Murray, albeit on a slightly smaller scale (Maitland Steamfest), surely with a bit of effort something could be put together.
Barrington Womble
Photo Nazi
Location: Banned
I think you'd be in for a bit of a shock. Rail preservation in NSW is supported by the Government a lot more than it is down here.
VBAndy
Chief Commissioner
Paralleling on the broad gauge lines will never happen again, simple.
Gman_86
Chief Commissioner
Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Does anyone know where the Standard Gauge track in Victoria terminates?Only the mystical High Grand Master Train Controller knows the true answer to that, and he's far too important to answer our feeble questions.
Maybe one day we will find out, but I fear that's merely a dream.
Fireman Dave
Chief Commissioner
Location: Shh, I'm hiding
I think you'd be in for a bit of a shock. Rail preservation in NSW is supported by the Government a lot more than it is down here.
Through ALOT of hard work from the people involved on the heritage side.
Barrington Womble
Photo Nazi
Location: Banned
Through ALOT of hard work from the people involved on the heritage side.Believe me when I say that most of the groups ARE trying. It's a case of the Government simply not being interested - no matter who is in power.
Ballast_Plough
Chief Commissioner
Location: Lilydale, Vic
The reasons it won't happen are many and varied - and certainly not due to people not wanting it to happen.
1. Pathing is an issue. Compared to 1988 we have a lot more services running and in the case of the Bendigo line, less capacity. TPWS doesn't help either. Also expect weekend track closures over the next few years for RRL and other projects.
2. Crewing is an issue as the number of steam qualified crews was much greater back then.
3. Cost of tickets would probably be the main issue. These days the fares have to be fairly high to recover costs and people might save up money to travel on one fantrip every couple of months - not travel on a few in a fortnight.
4. Much fewer destinations are available compared to 1988. Austeam was pretty much all about day trips so you might get Geelong, Maryborough, Bairnsdale, Seymour maybe but not much else.
1. Pathing is an issue. Compared to 1988 we have a lot more services running and in the case of the Bendigo line, less capacity. TPWS doesn't help either. Also expect weekend track closures over the next few years for RRL and other projects.
2. Crewing is an issue as the number of steam qualified crews was much greater back then.
3. Cost of tickets would probably be the main issue. These days the fares have to be fairly high to recover costs and people might save up money to travel on one fantrip every couple of months - not travel on a few in a fortnight.
4. Much fewer destinations are available compared to 1988. Austeam was pretty much all about day trips so you might get Geelong, Maryborough, Bairnsdale, Seymour maybe but not much else.
Valvegear
Oliver Bullied, CME
Location: Norda Fittazroy
Fireman Dave- it's not our "bad attitude". This handy, throw-away one liner gets trotted out with monotonous regularity from NSW.
Most of us who have bashed our brains and muscles in rail preservation in Victoria would love to see a repeat of Austeam. We would happily work hard to ensure it ran.
BUT . . . without official sanction and a good deal of interest and help, it just couldn't happen.
This nonsense of "if we can do it in NSW; you can do it in Victoria" is just that - nonsense. We are green with envy at the Government and Departmental help that you receive north of the Murray. We get three-fifths of five-eighths of nothing.
One classic example - Elecrail ( division of Steamrail ) has a beautifully restored set of historic electric suburban carriages in working order. This set used to run fan trips, but has not turned a wheel on Melbourne rails for years, because the powers that be refuse to allow it.
We are not, repeat not, being negative. We are being sadly practical.
Most of us who have bashed our brains and muscles in rail preservation in Victoria would love to see a repeat of Austeam. We would happily work hard to ensure it ran.
BUT . . . without official sanction and a good deal of interest and help, it just couldn't happen.
This nonsense of "if we can do it in NSW; you can do it in Victoria" is just that - nonsense. We are green with envy at the Government and Departmental help that you receive north of the Murray. We get three-fifths of five-eighths of nothing.
One classic example - Elecrail ( division of Steamrail ) has a beautifully restored set of historic electric suburban carriages in working order. This set used to run fan trips, but has not turned a wheel on Melbourne rails for years, because the powers that be refuse to allow it.
We are not, repeat not, being negative. We are being sadly practical.
K160
Minister for Railways
Location: Bendigo
On this subject, is there anyone knowledgeable out there who knows how the safeworking was arranged when there were parallel trains on the broad gauge heading towards Seymour? I've often wandered about this. The tracks are double line block, not ATC like the line to Geelong.
It has been documented in various publications on the event (the ARHS Vic. book "A Vintage Year For Steam" springs to mind immediately as it has a section written by the then V/line special operations manager Bob Evans) on how it was done. Special safe working instructions for "wrong line" running of one train were used. All the crossings had to be manned so that if the train running "wrong line" arrived first the crossing could be set off at the appropriate distance. There have only been 4 occasions when both BG lines have had to be operated in this way for steam specials AFAIK:
-AusSteam '88: R761 and D3 639-K153 running beside 3801 on SG.
-Flying Scotsman Farewell August 1989: R761 and R707 running beside the Scot on SG.
-Easter Steam Festival 1993: R766 and K183 running beside 3801 on SG.
-ARHS R-class 50th 2001: R707-R711 and K183-R761.
So as you can see it hasn't happened often.
Some rail man
Junior Train Controller
Location: CIA Headquarters in Washington D.C
It will not happen because of Metro. Ever again
G41
Chief Commissioner
Location: Footplate of any K class
What's Metro got to do with it not running?
Last time I checked Vline/ARTC controlled the country lines including SG...
And it's not just them that will say "no". A lot more has to go into it, and as previously mentioned, there simply are not enough crews! They struggle now as it is to man 1 train let alone 3! This isn't the fault of anyone, it's just the cost of training, insurance etc is increasing by the minute and there isn't much government support out there.
Valvegear has hit the right spot by saying volunteers and labour will not be a problem if it could be pulled off, and yea, it's would be fantastic to see, point being is it probably won't and its something that has to be accepted.
Last time I checked Vline/ARTC controlled the country lines including SG...
And it's not just them that will say "no". A lot more has to go into it, and as previously mentioned, there simply are not enough crews! They struggle now as it is to man 1 train let alone 3! This isn't the fault of anyone, it's just the cost of training, insurance etc is increasing by the minute and there isn't much government support out there.
Valvegear has hit the right spot by saying volunteers and labour will not be a problem if it could be pulled off, and yea, it's would be fantastic to see, point being is it probably won't and its something that has to be accepted.
Some rail man
Junior Train Controller
Location: CIA Headquarters in Washington D.C
Metro like delaying tourist trains like at Upfield where the Suburban Rambler waited over an hour in the siding to return to Spencer Street.
Barrington Womble
Photo Nazi
Location: Banned
Metro have timetabled trains that have to run to time.
If a gunzel special has to be shafted somewhere to allow these services to pass, so be it. They are not priority trains.
If a gunzel special has to be shafted somewhere to allow these services to pass, so be it. They are not priority trains.
MC3801
Train Controller
Which station would be the best station to have the event, Flinders Street or Southern Cross?
D3621
Locomotive Driver
Location: Castlemaine Vic
Which station would be the best station to have the event, Flinders Street or Southern Cross?
IF the event was going to happen and IF heritage groups got priority over Metro and Vline and IF New South Wales locomotives were involved in the event it would have to be Spencer St station again like in '88. Flinders St Station has no SG track there. Southern Cross has more capacity for locomotives, sidings in which to store rolling stock if needed and more platforms than Flinders St.
On side note Seymour could be a venue location due to they have suitable locomotive facilities there. I'm only making the point based on locomotive facilities.
VBAndy
Chief Commissioner
None, there simply isn't the capacity for that kind of event anymore.
Please stop foaming!
Please stop foaming!
railblogger
Chief Commissioner
Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
IF the event was going to happen and IF heritage groups got priority over Metro and Vline and IF New South Wales locomotives were involved in the event it would have to be Spencer St station again like in '88. Flinders St Station has no SG track there. Southern Cross has more capacity for locomotives, sidings in which to store rolling stock if needed and more platforms than Flinders St.Wouldn't it be better to run such an event between Seymour and, say, Benalla? The event wouldn't interfere with so many trains compared to running it in Melbourne, and regular SG trains could use one track while the event uses the other.
On side note Seymour could be a venue location due to they have suitable locomotive facilities there. I'm only making the point based on locomotive facilities.
Valvegear
Oliver Bullied, CME
Location: Norda Fittazroy
Allow me to back up VBAndy - stop foaming and dreaming -IT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN IN VICTORIA, and all the theoretical "where and how" is a waste of space.
D3621
Locomotive Driver
Location: Castlemaine Vic
Allow me to back up VBAndy - stop foaming and dreaming -IT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN IN VICTORIA, and all the theoretical "where and how" is a waste of space.I'm really sure that everyone who is involved in this thread would know that it would never happen again no matter what. But there shouldn't be any real problem with theoretical points of view that can allows people to think and discuss ideas that is relevant to the thread. Last time i checked people are allowed to have a theoretical conversation but for many people who have never seen events like this due to one reason or another they are allowed to think and imagine what it would be like unlike many of the other people that use Railpage.
Hell im only 18 years old and i have only seen one parallel steam trip and that was only around 800m from start to finish. This thread is not a waste of space Valvegear and VBAndy its a conversation of peoples opinions and views on where and how something like another AusSteam '88 could happen again. Again we all know that it would never happen again it is theoretical conversation about the thread's main contention.
Valvegear
Oliver Bullied, CME
Location: Norda Fittazroy
Suit yourself D3621- whilst you're theorising, why not talk about your next trip to the moon, or the harem full of virgins you're going to have?
Both are just as likely as another Austeam.
Both are just as likely as another Austeam.
VBAndy
Chief Commissioner
It's dreamland crap, if you want to discuss irrelevant tripe use 'The Lounge" thread. Foam, be gone!
Quick Reply
We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.