4H (Oscars) to replace Newcastle K-Sets

 
  Aurora8 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Sydney
So are these OSCARs just being run in the peak times? Originally thought maybe they'd be doing all day service on this route.
"Aurora8"


It may have something to do with crew training, can't just throw them all in there, lest you end up with a crew not qualified for the traction.
"Raichase"


I should have used singular there in refering to the OSCAR. Actually got around to looking through the (public) TT just now and the placings, the afternoon services look to me to being done by the one OSCAR. Maybe the morning service is done by the same set as well. I have also just realised doesn't start until Monday (assumed they were already in service since it feels like at least a month since they announced it but looking back it's only been little over 2 weeks).

Added: I've just found the STN for Monday+ so looking through that now Smile

edit1: Same OSCAR. It is apparently staying at Broadmeadow during the day except on Wed/Fri where it conditionally operates empty between Newc and Morie.

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  steam3801 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Newcastle
Now you see them ...


K sets Newcastle station 10 March 2012


K2 set Broadmeadow 18 June 2012

Soon you won't see them ...... ?


H21 set Broadmeadow 18 June 2012


H21 set Newcastle station 18 June 2012

Interesting side note to this photo - H21 stands at Platform 1, the adjacent line is Platform 2. Up until last week there was a centre "engine road" which allowed incoming steam engines and diesels run around their trains. The line was removed last week (ending Fri 15 June 2012) when the line from Broadmeadow to Newcastle was closed for the week. All trains (incl. Maitland/Scone/Dungog) arrived and departed from Broadmeadow .... at taste of things to come, perhaps (but I digress into another thread altogether).

The reason for the removal of the centre road between Platforms 1 and 2 is obvious given the electric and diesel car operations in/out of Newcastle, but ..... It was used during the recent Maitland Steamfest. So, what happens in the future - no more Steamfest to Newcastle? Top-and-tail running (which looks positively stupid!). But again, I digress into another thread ....

EDIT : PS. They could've given the H set a bit of a splash with water, a wipe with a damp cloth or something, for it's "first" run. The outside was just plain bl00dy filthy, with the usual outside dust coated windows that made them almost opaque ....
  Black1050 Chief Train Controller

Location: Out of the Metrop
Splash of water and a wipe with damp cloth!? You serious?! It maybe a special occasion for you that its the first regular OSCAR service, but seriously, its hardly the first time OSCARs have been used there, and hardly worthy of a special trip to Hornsby for a wash that'll be covered in dirt before it gets to Newcastle.
Think railcorp have more important things to do than wash OSCARs for you...
  steam3801 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Newcastle
Splash of water and a wipe with damp cloth!? You serious?! It maybe a special occasion for you that its the first regular OSCAR service, but seriously, its hardly the first time OSCARs have been used there, and hardly worthy of a special trip to Hornsby for a wash that'll be covered in dirt before it gets to Newcastle. Think railcorp have more important things to do than wash OSCARs for you...
"Black1050"


It's called public relations. It's called promoting a service. And not having been there, you don't have a clue - observing from the train, it was obvious that there was some interest in this "new" service to Newcastle, from passengers waiting on opposites stations, AND STAFF (Broadmeadow and Hamilton, in particular), who probably care a damnside more than you.

But obviously presentation doesn't mean anything to you, so what the hell.
  Black1050 Chief Train Controller

Location: Out of the Metrop

It's called public relations. It's called promoting a service. And not having been there, you don't have a clue - observing from the train, it was obvious that there was some interest in this "new" service to Newcastle, from passengers waiting on opposites stations, AND STAFF (Broadmeadow and Hamilton, in particular), who probably care a damnside more than you.

But obviously presentation doesn't mean anything to you, so what the hell.
"steam3801"


Public relations is one thing, promoting the service is a redundant moot point, as it is the SAME service, but with a DIFFERENT and newer train than was being used previous.  The people/customers who were using that service before will still be using it now there is a newer train, those who weren't using it because it didn't match their time/travel needs STILL won't be using it.  The only ones who want to be promoting it are politicians.  Now if it were a new train AND extra additional services, then promote the hell out of it for sure.  So if you want the clean OSCAR for it's first day, please describe your OH&S approved, and Safety Management System documented, method of cleaning the train with damp cloth and splash of water, I'll be quite intrigued to read it.  The public relations part of the equation is having the inside of the train clean, and devoid of litter, and ideally lacking in graffiti, and having the train depart and run on time, which should be quite easy compared to the K-Set it replaces.
For the record, seeing as I spend a "damnside" more time on the OSCARs than you, the passengers, and station staff at Broadmeadow and Hamilton, up to 4 hours continuously at a time, I do actually notice and care if the trains are actually clean or not, both inside and outside, that said, if I see that the outside is dirty/dusty, I understand that operationally, there are more important things for maintenance staff to do... Like maybe keep the train running so that it can be used by passengers.  Perhaps consider the logistics required to satisfy your demands of shiny clean OSCARs.


  steam3801 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Newcastle

It's called public relations. It's called promoting a service. And not having been there, you don't have a clue - observing from the train, it was obvious that there was some interest in this "new" service to Newcastle, from passengers waiting on opposites stations, AND STAFF (Broadmeadow and Hamilton, in particular), who probably care a damnside more than you.

But obviously presentation doesn't mean anything to you, so what the hell.
"steam3801"


Public relations is one thing, promoting the service is a redundant moot point, as it is the SAME service, but with a DIFFERENT and newer train than was being used previous.  The people/customers who were using that service before will still be using it now there is a newer train, those who weren't using it because it didn't match their time/travel needs STILL won't be using it.  The only ones who want to be promoting it are politicians.  Now if it were a new train AND extra additional services, then promote the hell out of it for sure.  So if you want the clean OSCAR for it's first day, please describe your OH&S approved, and Safety Management System documented, method of cleaning the train with damp cloth and splash of water, I'll be quite intrigued to read it.  The public relations part of the equation is having the inside of the train clean, and devoid of litter, and ideally lacking in graffiti, and having the train depart and run on time, which should be quite easy compared to the K-Set it replaces.
For the record, seeing as I spend a "damnside" more time on the OSCARs than you, the passengers, and station staff at Broadmeadow and Hamilton, up to 4 hours continuously at a time, I do actually notice and care if the trains are actually clean or not, both inside and outside, that said, if I see that the outside is dirty/dusty, I understand that operationally, there are more important things for maintenance staff to do... Like maybe keep the train running so that it can be used by passengers.  Perhaps consider the logistics required to satisfy your demands of shiny clean OSCARs.

"Black1050"


Oh dear. I really hope that you aren't representative of the profession ... although given you're attitude, I doubt whether the word "professional" is part of your vocabulary.

I sure there are many more out there who have some pride in their work and the organisation(s) they represent when on duty. You just don't seem to care what anyone else thinks, do you?
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
Oh dear. I really hope that you aren't representative of the profession ... although given you're attitude, I doubt whether the word "professional" is part of your vocabulary.

I sure there are many more out there who have some pride in their work and the organisation(s) they represent when on duty. You just don't seem to care what anyone else thinks, do you?
"steam3801"


My understanding of Black1050's post is that he is revealing the realist nature of work prioritisation in the face of limited resources. The rest of this post is based on this understanding.

Let's keep it simple. Say you have two trains requiring some attention. One has a number of doors that are broken. The other is a bit dirty.

Due to various limitations in resources (time, staff, material...?) you are only able to fix one. Which one do you fix, the one with broken doors that shouldn't run in revenue service, possibly leading its services to be cancelled; or the one that's a bit dirty, possibly upsetting some gunzels?

Despite being all for a shiny, spotless H21 arriving in Newcastle on 18 June for the inaugural OSCar service to Newcastle, I'd rather have defects attended to so trains actually run.
  Black1050 Chief Train Controller

Location: Out of the Metrop


Oh dear. I really hope that you aren't representative of the profession ... although given you're attitude, I doubt whether the word "professional" is part of your vocabulary.

I sure there are many more out there who have some pride in their work and the organisation(s) they represent when on duty. You just don't seem to care what anyone else thinks, do you?
"steam3801"



Seriously?!

My attitude? And what pray tell is my attitude?

Professionalism?  Well, I turn up for work, fit for duty, with appropriate uniform and PPE, with all equipment and documents required to execute the duties and tasks of my job, I ensure I am qualified to operate the machinery, and operate in the areas I am rostered to work at.  My key priorities are ensuring people get to their destinations, safely, comfortably and as close to on time or early as possible, with SAFETY being my primary concern along with ensuring maximum efficiency for the tax paying public.  
Now tell me what is the matter with my attitude and that I lack the word "professional" from my vocabulary.  
Now if making sure people (as many as possible) are able to get to where they need to be as quick as possible whilst being kept safe, is what matters to me,  and being less concerned whether the outside of the 250 to 500 tons of steel, glass and plastic they are carried in is dirty and will disappoint a gunzel makes me unprofessional in your opinion, then so be it.  I take pride in making sure people get to their destinations SAFE and on time or early.  SIMPLE.  

Fact is, the external cleanliness of a train is:  A- not something I am responsible for, and B - not pertinent to passenger safety.  If it affects passenger safety, then I take action accordingly.  In an ideal world, yes all the trains would be clean and there would be no graffiti anywhere.  Unfortunately, Australia has yet to develop into a true utopia.  The reality is, that to have your first regular tabled OSCAR service in Newcastle all clean and dust free is very resource and logistic intensive, and NOT good use of resources.  Perhaps if you understood the logistics involved (and I did mention it in my first post) you would appreciate the level of wastage you are asking for, meanwhile your "damp rag and splash of water" is an OH&S minefield.  

I do see that you've chosen not to address those to issues I raised, and instead chosen to attack my perceived apathy for public relations and caring for train cleanliness, and attack my integrity and professionalism instead.  Interesting.



For the record, I do like your photos. 


  Kamz Assistant Commissioner

Nice vids boxythingy.

It's official. The last day of Newcastle K sets (and local services) will be Friday 18 October 2013.
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
It's official. The last day of Newcastle K sets (and local services) will be Friday 18 October 2013.
Kamz
So where are they going from Newcastle, then?
  bjwh86 Chief Train Controller

The use of 2K sets won't be needed from october as the Morissett locals will be no longer as the Wyong terminators are being extended to Newcastle.

Would they use them on the Carlingford line? The SWTT says all runs will be 4S so maybe not.
  David10 Station Master

The use of 2K sets won't be needed from october as the Morissett locals will be no longer as the Wyong terminators are being extended to Newcastle.

Would they use them on the Carlingford line? The SWTT says all runs will be 4S so maybe not.
bjwh86
I would imagine they will return to Sector 3 and be pooled with the other K sets as they were for about 10 years before moving to the Short North to replace U boats in the mid 1990s.

A sign of things to come, tonight's 1745 Central - Newcastle was formed of an 8 car OSCAR.
  Kamz Assistant Commissioner
  HMC1989 Chief Commissioner

Location: Behind a desk.
So where are they going from Newcastle, then?
s3_gunzel

They all are to be converted into 2 x 4 car sets. K3 & K4 Driver trailer cars are being modified at HMC at the moment.
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
They all are to be converted into 2 x 4 car sets. K3 & K4 Driver trailer cars are being modified at HMC at the moment.
HMC1989
Thank you; good sir. Are the cabs being fully removed or what?
  HMC1989 Chief Commissioner

Location: Behind a desk.
Thank you; good sir. Are the cabs being fully removed or what?
s3_gunzel

I will confirm but the talk around here is they will be converted into trailer cars. Our Sparkies are removing wiring atm. It's quite a drawn out process. This Friday I will try and get some last minute pics and video of the Morisset-Newcastle yo-yo's before Sunday's new timetable commences.
  Raichase Captain Rant!

Location: Sydney, NSW
I will confirm but the talk around here is they will be converted into trailer cars. Our Sparkies are removing wiring atm. It's quite a drawn out process. This Friday I will try and get some last minute pics and video of the Morisset-Newcastle yo-yo's before Sunday's new timetable commences.
HMC1989
I'd be curious to know if they're removing the slackless drawgear permanent coupler between the motor/trailer pair. I have wondered the same about the ex horse-and-cart L Sets from Wollongong (I recall L3 became L13, and the original motor/trailer in that setup retained the permanent coupling, at least initially).
  Highrise Assistant Commissioner

I will confirm but the talk around here is they will be converted into trailer cars. Our Sparkies are removing wiring atm. It's quite a drawn out process. This Friday I will try and get some last minute pics and video of the Morisset-Newcastle yo-yo's before Sunday's new timetable commences.
HMC1989
I'll have a snoop around the sheds tonight, and see if I can grab a photo of 2.
  scott4570 Chief Train Controller

Friday, 18/10/13, sighted the following K sets:-  

Set K2 in charge of last K set tabled to Terminate at Morisset at 1541 hours (N860) forming Down service at 1547 hours (N849).  

This evening, last Down departures from Gosford were provided by:-
Set K1 at 1644 hours (N859)
Set K70 (4cars) at 1743 hours (N863)
Set K2 at 1838 hours (N871)  


- Scott.
  Johnny_Walton Railcorp Crash Test Dummy No.1

Location: Flemington Maintenance Centre
I'd be curious to know if they're removing the slackless drawgear permanent coupler between the motor/trailer pair. I have wondered the same about the ex horse-and-cart L Sets from Wollongong (I recall L3 became L13, and the original motor/trailer in that setup retained the permanent coupling, at least initially).
Raichase

I do believe that the bar couplings were removed from the L sets,
The bar couplings are still between the surviving 2-car V-sets currently on V21 being refurbished to purple ATM at FCS.
Don't all K-sets have semi permanent couplers between the Motor Trailers?
I can't recall as I don't get on them much/anymore now.

Jono.
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
The bar couplings are still between the surviving 2-car V-sets currently on V21 being refurbished to purple ATM at FCS.
Johnny_Walton
Bit off topic, but doesn't that set include DCM8035, and shouldn't it have been withdrawn months ago with the rest of the DCM/DTM/DTD/DCT class?
  Raichase Captain Rant!

Location: Sydney, NSW
Don't all K-sets have semi permanent couplers between the Motor Trailers?
I can't recall as I don't get on them much/anymore now.
Johnny_Walton
I'm 99% sure that the K and C sets have knuckle couplers between the motor/trailer pair, although obviously the high tension wires under the coupler precludes just uncoupling them on the run.
  Johnny_Walton Railcorp Crash Test Dummy No.1

Location: Flemington Maintenance Centre
Bit off topic, but doesn't that set include DCM8035, and shouldn't it have been withdrawn months ago with the rest of the DCM/DTM/DTD/DCT class?
s3_gunzel
Yes I have NO IDEA why V21 survives with its consist.

Jono.
  Newcastle Express Chief Commissioner

I wasn't going to say what had the honours of the last Newcastle suburban K-Set, but Scott4570 spoiled that idea!

Okay then, the second last K-set for Newcastle was K_ or K_ _

Nope, I suppose no one would want to see a video of the last K-Set.

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