RRL Project - West Werribee / Southern Cross

 
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Michael Greenhill and Woodford, thanks for your spirited defence but I think if you want to flame someone you'll always find a reason won't you.

Now I'm fully aware that it was a silly, redundant question about IC125 vs XPT but having been a member of this forum for a while now I thought the whole point of discussion boards was to have discussions.  And that's exactly what I was trying to do there, generate a discussion (albeit slightly off the topic).  I'm fully aware that the answer was out there on that font of all things correct and accountable, Wikipedia, but I was just posting a question in order to provoke a discussion about that topic. Out of that question - somebody, somewhere, might have something interesting to add that in fact may not be on the highly accurate Wikipedia article; or they may simply have an opinion they want to share.

If someone asks a question that for whatever reason you find stupid, below your intellect or that the answer is easily found elsewhere, then it's your duty to do what I do and IGNORE IT.  If you don't want the conversation to head in the direction in which it appears to be headed, again, IGNORE IT.

It's not an intellectual discourse exclusively for rail industry executives and employees.  It's an internet discussion board.

Sponsored advertisement

  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Certainly possible. If I'm not mistaken there was extra SG stabling facility constructed here during the regauging of the line to Albury, intended for this purpose.
Contrillion

It might have also been useful to have left the original SG track in place at Seymour so two SG platforms were available for use.  Why did they not do this?

Regards
Brian
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
It might have also been useful to have left the original SG track in place at Seymour so two SG platforms were available for use.  Why did they not do this?

Regards
Brian
bevans
Are you talking about that small one carriage platform that once served the North East Standard Gauge track at Seymour Station.

The one that was closed off to the public due to It's poor condition and poor design standard.

The platform that was designed only for emergency use (traveling public)


Hang on Seymour has nothing to do with RRL ! there's a thread for the Nord Ost Railway
  woodford Chief Commissioner

Michael Greenhill and Woodford, thanks for your spirited defence but I think if you want to flame someone you'll always find a reason won't you.
don_dunstan

As I believe this is a serious issue, I feel its worth going after..............

You have highlighted the central issue here, Railpage is so far the only internet communication sight thats does not have a very serious issue on intolerant or antisocial behaviour. One can get plenty of good information without having to wade throughs pages of personal attacks or having some idiot trying to tear down the fabric of civilised society so normal found on sights such as this.
We must for ever be vigilant to keep this sight civilised.

What is a stupid question, if someone without a history of antisocial or intolerant behaviour asks a question its very likely he is looking for an answer. Not all the population is highly knowledgable on a wide range of subjects, surprising as most reading this will find not everyone has good internet access, woodford infact is still using a dial up line for access. This sort of thing seriously handicaps one searching for answers.

Another thing to consider those of the members with good knowledge here or in any other place constantly get asked questions. One tends to get tired of the same questions over and over again mostly comming from newer people. Rememeber you may have seen and answered the question 103 times, chances are though the person asking it is doing so for th first time. Blowing up in frustration on such an occasion helps no one, not the questioner, not the answerer and specially not the site, in this case Railpage Australia™.

As previously mentioned (a number of times) one can disagree with someone but in all cases one must respect the right of a person to be different from you. If this is not done the world would very quickly distintergrate into anarchy and very few would like that.

woodford
  xxxxlbear Token Booking Clerk

Location: Geelong
Completely off topic, nut my thoughts, for what they are worth, are:
I dont believe that any question is too stupid for this forum, considering that it is aimed for the general population, and which anyone can join.
If a newbie wants to ask something as basic as, 'What is standard gauge?' or 'What is broad gauge?' so be it. They have as much right to ask a question that is as important to them as is a question from someone who has been around for a while, and wants to ask something technical about, say, R707.

If you find a question mundane, or below your level of intelligence, then move on to another thread topic that suits your level of interest Smile
  gomer Train Controller

Location: Melbourne
Ah okay, that makes sense...in that case, I wonder if this change of trains at Geelong for Warrnambool passengers is going to be a permanent feature of the upcoming new regular timetable then, and not just for the holiday timetable Confused
xxxxlbear
This arrangement will only occur until Jan 19th. The Albury passes will be running as far as Broady and when shunting back into Sth Dynon will use the new duel gauge shunting neck through the old creek sidings going under the RRL flyover.
  xxxxlbear Token Booking Clerk

Location: Geelong
This arrangement will only occur until Jan 19th. The Albury passes will be running as far as Broady and when shunting back into Sth Dynon will use the new duel gauge shunting neck through the old creek sidings going under the RRL flyover.
gomer
Ah, okay, thank you for the info, gomer Smile
I had an idea that the change of trains plan couldn't possibly be a permanent arrangement.
  waynes Junior Train Controller

Location: Victoria
Are you talking about that small one carriage platform that once served the North East Standard Gauge track at Seymour Station.

The one that was closed off to the public due to It's poor condition and poor design standard.

The platform that was designed only for emergency use (traveling public)
Nightfire

Prior to the SG going into Platform 1 did the XPT stop at Seymour?
  Contrillion Junior Train Controller

Location: Geelong, VIC
Prior to the SG going into Platform 1 did the XPT stop at Seymour?
waynes
As far as I am aware the XPT has never stopped at Seymour, apart from when it was recently added to the timetable of course. In the ~20 years since CountryLink ran past Albury the nearest stop from Spencer Street was always Benalla.
  waynes Junior Train Controller

Location: Victoria
As far as I am aware the XPT has never stopped at Seymour, apart from when it was recently added to the timetable of course. In the ~20 years since CountryLink ran past Albury the nearest stop from Spencer Street was always Benalla.
Contrillion

Had me fooled. I always thought the XPT stopped at Seymour prior to the standardisation.
  michaelgreenhill Administrator That's Numberwang!

Location: Melbourne
Had me fooled. I always thought the XPT stopped at Seymour prior to the standardisation.
waynes
It would seem not: http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/media-centre/media-releases/5489-countrylink-xpts-now-stop-at-seymour-and-broadmeadows.html

Incidentally, the old standard gauge platform at Seymour was in all likelihood simply too small. As I recall there wasn't even public access to it.
  woodford Chief Commissioner

It would seem not: http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/media-centre/media-releases/5489-countrylink-xpts-now-stop-at-seymour-and-broadmeadows.html

Incidentally, the old standard gauge platform at Seymour was in all likelihood simply too small. As I recall there wasn't even public access to it.
michaelgreenhill
The old platform was only around 2 cars long, it was in very poor condition and was accessed via a gate normally locked from the side walk on the road to the carpark. The only time I am aware it was used was when somthing had come up an a train, such as a violent passenger, or a medical emergency.

woodford
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
As far as I am aware the XPT has never stopped at Seymour, apart from when it was recently added to the timetable of course. In the ~20 years since CountryLink ran past Albury the nearest stop from Spencer Street was always Benalla.
"Contrillion"
Indeed. It was a pleasant surprise to hear it announced on our side that set-down stops were being introduced at Seymour and Broadmeadows, which was a sensible if extremely overdue move that paralleled the Campbelltown, Moss Vale and Goulburn stops at the Sydney end.

Out of curiosity, does anyone know why the Wangaratta and Benalla stops are on the XPT?
  Duncs Chief Commissioner

Out of curiosity, does anyone know why the Wangaratta and Benalla stops are on the XPT?
Watson374
That is a very good question
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
That is a very good question
Duncs
Watson374 wrote:
Out of curiosity, does anyone know why the Wangaratta and Benalla stops are on the XPT?


The stops are because since the opening of the SG in 1962 and the instalment of the SG platforms soon after at those two locations, the Spirit of Progress always stopped at Wangaratta and Benalla.

Mike.
  mikesyd Chief Commissioner

Location: Lurking
Watson374 wrote:
Out of curiosity, does anyone know why the Wangaratta and Benalla stops are on the XPT?


The stops are because since the opening of the SG in 1962 and the instalment of the SG platforms soon after at those two locations, the Spirit of Progress always stopped at Wangaratta and Benalla.

Mike.
The Vinelander
I believe that the BG SOP only stopped at Wangaratta and Benalla on Saturdays and Sundays, but yes, no doubt the reason why they got SG platforms at the outset - the SOP was the only train to stop there, the ICD didnt.
  Duncs Chief Commissioner

I believe that the BG SOP only stopped at Wangaratta and Benalla on Saturdays and Sundays, but yes, no doubt the reason why they got SG platforms at the outset - the SOP was the only train to stop there, the ICD didnt.
mikesyd
Why were Wangaratta and Benalla chosen in the first place?
  Contrillion Junior Train Controller

Location: Geelong, VIC
Why were Wangaratta and Benalla chosen in the first place?
Duncs
One could assume they were chosen because of their larger population compared to other towns along the line, as well as their proximity to the NSW border.

Guessing here, could be far from fact.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Why were Wangaratta and Benalla chosen in the first place?
Duncs
Ummm..because they are larger cities than Barnawartha or Glenrowan Question
  woodford Chief Commissioner

One could assume they were chosen because of their larger population compared to other towns along the line, as well as their proximity to the NSW border.

Guessing here, could be far from fact.
Contrillion

On the 1954 and 1961 timetables the "Spirit of Progress" was express Melbourne to Albury, The 1975 timetable shows stops at Benalla and Wang, these were chosen almost certainly because of size. Seymour was left very likely because the "Spirit" was a long haul express and there fore stops were always going to be limited and Seymour already had a good service with a number of local pass's and the "Albury express".

woodford
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Some interesting photos have appears on VicSig of the track junctions that are being built at the Western end of the Dynon flyover - where the RRL tracks from Southern Cross platforms 1-8 will diverge from the flyover dual gauge tracks.  I'm finding it a bit hard to visualise how these junctions will eventually form (as I'm not an expert on these things) but the photos are showing lots of work in preparation for the January shutdown.:

http://www.vicsig.net/photo/17483

http://www.vicsig.net/photo/17484

http://www.vicsig.net/photo/17485
jdekorte
Photo #1 shows the BG RRL lines on the ramp coming down from the North Melbourne flyover and leading towards South Kensington (behind the camera)

Photo #2 shows the tracks leading down towards Dynon loco depot (the RRL lines can be seen on the far right)
Don't know what happens to the dual gauge line on the far left ?

Photo #3 Is looking towards SSS from the same position as photo #2
  gomer Train Controller

Location: Melbourne
Photo #1 shows the BG RRL lines on the ramp coming down from the North Melbourne flyover and leading towards South Kensington (behind the camera)

Photo #2 shows the tracks leading down towards Dynon loco depot (the RRL lines can be seen on the far right)
Don't know what happens to the dual gauge line on the far left ?

Photo #3 Is looking towards SSS from the same position as photo #2
Nightfire
Hi, just like to correct you on photo #2, The new track on the left is the broad gauge connection to Sth Dynon, The one in the middle will be the new dual gauge main line while the one on the right is the new duel gauge shunting spur which goes under the RRL which is out of view on the right.
When looking at photo #3 you will notice a standard gauge set of points  which is the start of a standard gauge loop which finishes the other side of the Dudley st bridge utilizing the up and down broad gauge.

Cheers
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

The history of the original sg platforms at Benalla and Wangaratta is as follows .

When originally opened to sg Interstate passenger services in April, 1962 there were no intermediate platforms between Albury & Spencer Street  where former bg platform 1 became platform 2 (on same site as todays plat 2 at Sthn Cross) but was dg, and a new platform 1 on the site of existing plat 1 at Sthn Cross was dg also but from 1962 till 2005 was longer right up to Little Collins St.

The sg loco hauled SOP whilst primarily an overnight sitting train, also carried a twinette sleeping car, and on 5 nights a week a composite sitting/sleeping car (VACx2,VAMx1) that was detached at Goulburn and operated into Canberra .  In the mid 1960's the VR Commissioners decided to provide sg platforms at both Benalla & Wangaratta with SOP stops at those stations so residents could have overnight services to Sydney and intermediate stations in NSW.

The sg platform at Sunshine was provided around the same time so that pax off the Up "The Overland"  bg could change to the Down Intercapital Daylight (sg) .  In the reverse direction the transfer took place at Spencer St on most occasions.

The short platform at Seymour was provided in the 1970's so in an emergency passengers could be detrained and continue their journey to  Melbourne by road coach .

The old sg SOP Northbound one night was the victim of Australia,s Great Train robbery .  Between Benalla and Wangaratta the crooks found the valuable mailbags they wanted in the VHN van and unloaded the valuables through the side door into the off platform side during the brief stop at Wangaratta .  In those days the Aurora, SOP and Overland hauled dedicated vans piled high with mailbags.

During the recent standardization of the North East mainline, the original sg mainline was slued to run through the Eastern platform face at Seymour, and a replacement bg platform was provided on the Western side of the yard at Seymour.  This simplified track arrangement basically split bg to the Down side of Seymour and sg to Up side .

The sg platform at Broadmeadows is a result of the recent Nth east standardization, to save Nthn suburbs having to go into sthn Cross to join VLP sg trains .

The XPT trains all stop at Benalla & Wangaratta.  In addition XPT services stop if required to pick up (Northbound) or set down (Southbound)  also at Broadmeadows and Seymour .   XPT trains do NOT stop at Wodonga, only at Albury .
  Duncs Chief Commissioner

The history of the original sg platforms at Benalla and Wangaratta is as follows .

When originally opened to sg Interstate passenger services in April, 1962 there were no intermediate platforms between Albury & Spencer Street  where former bg platform 1 became platform 2 (on same site as todays plat 2 at Sthn Cross) but was dg, and a new platform 1 on the site of existing plat 1 at Sthn Cross was dg also but from 1962 till 2005 was longer right up to Little Collins St.

The sg loco hauled SOP whilst primarily an overnight sitting train, also carried a twinette sleeping car, and on 5 nights a week a composite sitting/sleeping car (VACx2,VAMx1) that was detached at Goulburn and operated into Canberra .  In the mid 1960's the VR Commissioners decided to provide sg platforms at both Benalla & Wangaratta with SOP stops at those stations so residents could have overnight services to Sydney and intermediate stations in NSW.

The sg platform at Sunshine was provided around the same time so that pax off the Up "The Overland"  bg could change to the Down Intercapital Daylight (sg) .  In the reverse direction the transfer took place at Spencer St on most occasions.

The short platform at Seymour was provided in the 1970's so in an emergency passengers could be detrained and continue their journey to  Melbourne by road coach .

The old sg SOP Northbound one night was the victim of Australia,s Great Train robbery .  Between Benalla and Wangaratta the crooks found the valuable mailbags they wanted in the VHN van and unloaded the valuables through the side door into the off platform side during the brief stop at Wangaratta .  In those days the Aurora, SOP and Overland hauled dedicated vans piled high with mailbags.

During the recent standardization of the North East mainline, the original sg mainline was slued to run through the Eastern platform face at Seymour, and a replacement bg platform was provided on the Western side of the yard at Seymour.  This simplified track arrangement basically split bg to the Down side of Seymour and sg to Up side .

The sg platform at Broadmeadows is a result of the recent Nth east standardization, to save Nthn suburbs having to go into sthn Cross to join VLP sg trains .

The XPT trains all stop at Benalla & Wangaratta.  In addition XPT services stop if required to pick up (Northbound) or set down (Southbound)  also at Broadmeadows and Seymour .   XPT trains do NOT stop at Wodonga, only at Albury .
kuldalai

Many thanks for that
  xxxxlbear Token Booking Clerk

Location: Geelong
Interesting read, thank you, kuldalai.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from:   

Quick Reply

We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.