Seaford Line

 
  dthead Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
With today , Sunday 23 February 2014, being the official opening of the Seaford line for revenue service it seems appropriate to open a new discussion about the Seaford Line.

Impressions of the new extension, services, station facilities and access etc.

Seaford Line information on Adelaide Metro
yoyoman

New thread.

The old thread: http://www.railpage.com.au/f-t11377222.htm  will remain locked. So here's a new thread. I am sure thaere have been developments peole wish to inform us of etc.

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  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Happy Easter all.

Since matters have been brought to a Head and David has now given us back the C4d thread it would be discourteous of me not to use it.

A question. Have any of the drivers on board seen/heard anything that might indicate a revised Seaford timetable post the date for the Tonsley's return, May 5.

A complete time table and diagrams would be excellent!

Any indication with rosters etc would be more realistic?

Ian
  62430 Chief Train Controller

Location: Metro Adelaide
Happy Easter all.

Since matters have been brought to a Head and David has now given us back the C4d thread it would be discourteous of me not to use it.

A question. Have any of the drivers on board seen/heard anything that might indicate a revised Seaford timetable post the date for the Tonsley's return, May 5.

A complete time table and diagrams would be excellent!

Any indication with rosters etc would be more realistic?

Ian
steam4ian

The 5 May date has been revised. See http://www.railpage.com.au/f-p1905833.htm#1905833.  It was probably over optimistic, given training requirements.

Alex C
  Milkomeda Chief Train Controller

I would've expected driver training on the Tonsley Line to take nowhere near as long as Noarlunga due to less track to remember and less frequent services so I would've thought a few days required for the Tonsley Line for the required amount of drivers to begin passenger service with the rest of the drivers being trained gradually as the line is open.
  Aaron Minister for Railways

Location: University of Adelaide SA
The Tons is going to require a good bit of driver training, the number of drivers who have never even seen Tonsley must be near to above 50 by now. Fitting their training in among timetable services is unlikely to be convenient.
  1S47 Assistant Commissioner

Location: On the Down Fast
The Tons is going to require a good bit of driver training, the number of drivers who have never even seen Tonsley must be near to above 50 by now. Fitting their training in among timetable services is unlikely to be convenient.
Aaron

Not to mention some additional rolling stock, if a useful frequency is to be provided in the peak hours.  

Especially if the government starts to promote the new Clovelly Park P&R, where commuters will presumably expect something like a turn-up-and-go service.

With apparently no new EMUs to arrive in the next week or two, A/Metro should have plenty of time to de-bug the signalling and train drivers using a spare 3000/3100 set in the off-peak before it's in a position to resume a proper public service to Tonsley.
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Regarding stock.

20 sets are needed for the 7.5 min frequency on the Seaford line and 15 min frequency on the Tonsley line.

I think we need to see a few more 4000s arrive before Tonsley can commence.
("Could cut the cabs off the 2000s" says he mischievously!)

I am wondering whether a 20 min day timetable frequency would not be more practical; this would allow semi express services during peak with 6 trains per hour in lieu of 8 with the present arrangement. there may need to be a couple of extras or double consists to handle the load.

I recognise the 15 min frequency is a good ideal but why not compromise to 20 mins until the necessary fleet of EMUs has arrived.

Ian
  mm42 Chief Train Controller

Steam4ian, do your calculations allow for single-car trains being used on the Tonsley line, whereas the 3-car trains on the Seaford line can then travel express for 5 stations between Woodlands Park and Adelaide ?  At 1 minute per station, this would save 10 minutes of cycle time on the Seaford service.  To provide a service every 7.5 minutes to Seaford would require one fewer train set, and frees up 3 cars for the Tonsley service.  There could be further cars freed up if turnaround time at each terminus can be reduced.
  Jumbo2001 Junior Train Controller

Steam4ian, do your calculations allow for single-car trains being used on the Tonsley line, whereas the 3-car trains on the Seaford line can then travel express for 5 stations between Woodlands Park and Adelaide ? At 1 minute per station, this would save 10 minutes of cycle time on the Seaford service. To provide a service every 7.5 minutes to Seaford would require one fewer train set, and frees up 3 cars for the Tonsley service. There could be further cars freed up if turnaround time at each terminus can be reduced.
mm42


Turn around times are a bit of a bug bear with me. Many commentators press for LESS turnaround time, but miss the impact of doing so. Currently Seaford's turn around time is not long enough. All stop Seaford trains (particularly using 3000/3100 class) most of the time run late, the entire journey. The timetable does not take into account the ridiculous work instruction forcing drivers to do 40km/h after a Caution aspect.

There are no cars to be found by time table tweaks, if anything the journey times should be extended to make it more realistic to how the system is run. If they don't want to do this, the only fix is a longer layover time at the terminus to suck up all the lost time. OH for years was a problem with its 4-6min layovers, because of ridiculously large amounts of late running this was extended to 8 minutes. Belair line had similar issues at night with tiny lay overs that never sucked up any lost time, again this was corrected with its current timetable.

Seaford is typically 8 mins, but so much time is lost that this 8mins is pretty well gone once late running and changing ends occurs. Its a bit ridiculous really.
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

nm42.

I think you are suggesting that not to stop at a station saves 1 minute of the typical 2 mins (on the TT) interstation time. I would suggest that this is highly optimistic. In theory the 8 kms Woodlands Park to ARS could be done in 10 mins. As I recall in days of yore the old Willunga Express (which only went to HC) was scheduled for 10 mins to Edwardstown and 14 mins to Oaklands with a stop at Goodwood and average speed of about 30 mph or 50 kph.

Jumbo may have some comments on express times vs stopping times.

Turn around times need to allow that drivers have bladders and as Jumbo says have to absorb delays, the TT not their bladders.

Ian
  1S47 Assistant Commissioner

Location: On the Down Fast
Apart from the modifications at Tonsley Junction, there is other significant track work underway in Adelaide yard at present.

Both the Seaford and Belair tracks are being dug up and replaced with new concrete sleepered track between Nairne Junction and Morphett St bridge.

As of Monday morning, the two Belair tracks have been relaid, while the old trackbed is still being excavated for the Seaford tracks.
At least it's replacing the last stretch of steel-sleepered, weed-infested track that EMUs had to run over approaching Adelaide station.

Installation of electrification overhead now seems fully complete along the Belair tracks between Goodwood & Adelaide yard, including both the crossovers between Showground and Leader Street and the ones at Mile End.  The Belair line platform (platform 3) at Goodwood station now has catenary, with the wires terminating just south of the platform.
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Saw the Seaford Shuttle at Brighton this morning, a 3000 set.

Are the EMUs running or is it only 3000s?

If the EMUs are not running why do they not run through to Oaklands for the turn back? Would give a quicker bus journey.

I am not sure what is being offered is that popular. Five buses "Not in Service" at Brighton and when I caught with the N3 and N4 heading to the city not many pax.

Work at Tonsley Junction on the overhead lining it up with the new junction. Switch machines in place but not wired, cables to axle counters in but no counters or ballises.

Ian
  Epsilon2012 Station Master

Location: Adelaide, Australia
Hi all,

As it is related to the Seaford Line I thought I should mention that I have created a new blog entry covering photos of the new 4000 series electric train, and also photos at various locations along the Seaford Line in March 2014 as part of the NRM charter Electric train service from Adelaide to Seaford.

Link is here: http://interestingtrains.blogspot.com.au/2014/04/charter-train-trip-on-adelaides-new.html

A little off-topic but still South Australia train service related, I also travelled on the Overland train from Adelaide to Melbourne during the recent Easter break (Friday), and another blog entry I wrote covers photos of the train and photos of various disused and used South Australian stations along the route (which I travelled to separately to photograph).

Link is here: http://interestingtrains.blogspot.com.au/2014/04/2014-easter-trip-on-overland-train-to.html

There is also plenty of Adelaide blog content I did in december 2013 if you are interested in more local South Australian train related photos! I hope you enjoy it.

I am glad to see the Seaford line works are progressing well during the Easter shutdown period - thanks to all for the updates on the progress of the works so far.

Catcha,
Epsilon
  DrJames Junior Train Controller

Location: Adelaide, SA
I am not sure what is being offered is that popular. Five buses "Not in Service" at Brighton and when I caught with the N3 and N4 heading to the city not many pax.
steam4ian


In my experience passenger numbers decline during school holidays (this is the second week) - The 721X I catch every morning is usually standing room only by Panalatinga / Main South Rd intersection, last week and today it was less than two thirds capacity by then.

Also, people may have arranged annual leave today / this week to extend their long weekend since the coming Friday is Anzac Day.
  62430 Chief Train Controller

Location: Metro Adelaide
Saw the Seaford Shuttle at Brighton this morning, a 3000 set.

Are the EMUs running or is it only 3000s?

If the EMUs are not running why do they not run through to Oaklands for the turn back? Would give a quicker bus journey.

I am not sure what is being offered is that popular. Five buses "Not in Service" at Brighton and when I caught with the N3 and N4 heading to the city not many pax.

Work at Tonsley Junction on the overhead lining it up with the new junction. Switch machines in place but not wired, cables to axle counters in but no counters or ballises.

Ian
steam4ian

Ian,
In middle of the day 4 4000s were operating and 1 3100.  4002/3/4/5 were in service.  4006 was stabled at depot along with at least 2x3000and 1x3100.  Don't know when 4005 returned from Dry Creek.  On Saturday 4x4000s stabled in yard at Seaford.  4005A today was without windscreen number or Bombardier logo, so wonder if windscreen has been newly replaced.

I was without car today so reliant on PT.  I was on 2 N4s, very sparsely populated, but saw N3 at Brighton take 20-30 pax off the train c.1415.

Additional cantilevers were being installed for revised support of both Tonsley and Seaford overhead.  Connections to from overhead to air switches were being made.  HV cable was being installed into the new cabinet that was placed next to the old relay room.  This cabinet is an remote controlled earthing switch. At one end there is an access door labelled High Voltage and at the other end the door is labelled 415V.  Booster transformer cabinets have no end doors and have two HV cables and two cables to the return conductors.

Switch machines were wired and operational late morning.  Some axle counters were being installed on branch yesterday, when a lot of cabling was being pulled and wired into signal cabinet.  Today I think all ACs were in place.  Sometimes from the side all that can be seen of the AC is the mounting clamp on the outside foot of the rail.  Balises were in place at all TJ signals.

New notice on DPTI website dated 17th April announcing Tonsley energisation on May 2: http://www.infrastructure.sa.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0009/127728/DOCS_AND_FILES-8482456-v1-RR_Community_Update_17_April_2014_-_SSO_TONSLEY_LINE_SWITCHED_ON_.pdf

Alex C
  62430 Chief Train Controller

Location: Metro Adelaide
Apart from the modifications at Tonsley Junction, there is other significant track work underway in Adelaide yard at present.

Both the Seaford and Belair tracks are being dug up and replaced with new concrete sleepered track between Nairne Junction and Morphett St bridge.

As of Monday morning, the two Belair tracks have been relaid, while the old trackbed is still being excavated for the Seaford tracks.
At least it's replacing the last stretch of steel-sleepered, weed-infested track that EMUs had to run over approaching Adelaide station.

Installation of electrification overhead now seems fully complete along the Belair tracks between Goodwood & Adelaide yard, including both the crossovers between Showground and Leader Street and the ones at Mile End. The Belair line platform (platform 3) at Goodwood station now has catenary, with the wires terminating just south of the platform.
1S47

As of Tuesday afternoon Seaford tracks laid but looks as if tamping and ballast regulation are not yet finished.  Photo taken c. 1645 from Morphett St Bridge.

Was told that yesterday tamping was taking place on Onkaparinga Viaduct, where an 80 TSR is in force.

Alex C

  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Alex

Had a look at the TJ site both this morning (drive past) and this evening (walking) about 1700, still a lot of activity lining up the OH.

Thanks for the update. I noticed the transformer cabinet this afternoon with 415V sign on the down end, I noted the other day only one HV cable into it. Must be back-up power for signalling much as SAPN often have a transformer from a street supply as back power to a substation.

Quite a bit of HV activity. The contact wires leading from the junction toward Tonsley have in-line insulators.

Ian
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

A question re Adelaide Yard.

Vincent's track diagram A001 shows post 131 on road 2 as having a route indicator which can show SM ,BM, S2 and S4. Likewise post 102 from No 2 stabling road shows access to Road 2. How can you get from Road 2 to 102 (S2)?

Has the double slip (compound) 38A/50 been replaced by a turnout which would be 50. When 38A was reversed it used to lead to the south car yard.

See some tragic reads those diagrams!

Regards
Ian
  62430 Chief Train Controller

Location: Metro Adelaide
A question re Adelaide Yard.

Vincent's track diagram A001 shows post 131 on road 2 as having a route indicator which can show SM ,BM, S2 and S4. Likewise post 102 from No 2 stabling road shows access to Road 2. How can you get from Road 2 to 102 (S2)?

Has the double slip (compound) 38A/50 been replaced by a turnout which would be 50. When 38A was reversed it used to lead to the south car yard.

See some tragic reads those diagrams!

Regards
Ian
steam4ian


Ian,
I must be a tragic as well.

A crossover and single slip was removed from under Morphett St Bridge some time last year. It allowed access from the Up SM to Plat 2 and from Plat 2 to the Dn SM. In my earlier message today http://www.railpage.com.au/f-p1908318.htm#1908318 in the foreground of the photo you can see the new concrete sleepers which replaced the switch on the Dn SM. Not in the photo more new sleepers are present in the Up SM where the single slip was. The change simplified the overhead work but means that up movements now negotiate 19/19A to access Plat 2. During the day offpeak Plat 2 is not regularly used.

38A/50 still exists as a double slip!

Edited 22.34 to add photos

Before removal of 18/15 taken 11/01/2013 during ARS shutdown.  38A/50 can be seen directly below RHS of SAMRI building.


Taken 23/05/2013 immediately after removal of 18/15 crossovers with replacement track in Dn and Up SM


Alex C
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

G'day all.

The post 5th May timetable is out.

The Seaford NC mob are not going to be happy, no exclusive expresses.
The 0711 and 0741 ex Seaford do run express from Woodlands Park to ARS with a journey time of 43 mins. From NC that is 38 mins which compares reasonably with the 35 mins of the former NC-ARS express services.

The situation will improve when more sets are available so the Tonsley service can run at a 15 min frequency during peak. Isn't that why the junction was upgraded?

The facilities at Brighton remain under utilised.

The evening service is still a joke with 60 minute intervals. Unfortunately I shall continue to drive in to functions.

Ian
  2001 Moderator The Snow Lord

Location: The road jump at Charlotte Pass. Paxman Valenta on two planks.
The new timetable

http://www.adelaidemetro.com.au/var/metro/storage/original/application/826149f1e0d497597e6fa8f433090fc3.pdf
  62430 Chief Train Controller

Location: Metro Adelaide
Late afternoon there was a completely electric service Brighton - Seaford.  4002-4006 were all out.  Brighton centre road was occupied about 80-90% of the time!  And at 1835 it was doubly occupied, 3125/26 arrived at 1830 from the city on a test working and a minute or so later a Seaford train also arrived.  The test train returned to the city at 1835.

Early afternoon Tonsley Jn was having a final inspection and cleanup.  At 3pm there was hardly an orange vest in sight and it was scarcely recognisable as the intensive worksite from earlier in the week.

Alex C

Test train turning at Brighton


Tonsley Jn looking SW (What is missing from this photo?)


Tonsley Jn looking NW


Tonsley Jn looking SE (STOP boards lying redundant at trackside)
  Milkomeda Chief Train Controller

Thank you for the pictures I've been craving to see what the Tonsley Junction looks like now. Nice to finally see the up track connected to the main line.
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
Thanks for the pics 62430
  1S47 Assistant Commissioner

Location: On the Down Fast
Two observations today . . . .

1) It's 30 April - a historic day!
Tonight sees the end of evening closures on the Belair & Seaford lines and should be the last runs of B1, N3 and N4 buses.
Will be back to 7-day full train services from 1st May (hopefully).

2) For those Goodwood commuters who are missing the old "Say No to Drugs" platform shelters, new shelter panels are being installed today. These are a fancy purple and metallic design, similar to the huge throw/noise screens erected around the Goodwood Underpass, but unfortunately are perforated so they'll not offer much protection from cold winds and driving rain.

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