50 level crossings to be removed

 
  woodford Chief Commissioner

Postscript to the above post,

Two of these destinations on Melbourne's rail network by thenselves have over 100 kilometres of mostly double track, these being Pakenham (56 ks) and Frankston (48 ks).

woodford

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  TheBlacksmith Chief Commissioner

Location: Ankh Morpork
I think the point that @melbtrip is making is that the daily rate for a full fare myki pass is cheaper than the daily concession myki money fare.
railblogger
Yes, but only if you buy a pass valid for 70 or more days travel, purchased in advance. If you are paying that much up front, then you deserve the largest discount.

Mind you, I would love to know how they arrived at 13 zones for Bendigo, when Traralgon is only 12 zones and is a further distance than Bendigo.
  TheBlacksmith Chief Commissioner

Location: Ankh Morpork
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm, Lets get some perspective in here.

Melbournes population is also slightly less (4 million as opposed to sydneys 4.4 million) so Melbourne has a great deal more to look after with a slightly smaller population base. And going be many Railpage posts sadly almost NONE of which wish to pay for upgrades to the network................ So There!!!!! Wink, Wink.

woodford
woodford
Add to that the fact that Victoria has a highway system throughout the state that is excellent compared to utter cra*p in NSW....
  topher1976 Train Controller

Location: Mill Park, Vic
Yes, but only if you buy a pass valid for 70 or more days travel, purchased in advance. If you are paying that much up front, then you deserve the largest discount.

Mind you, I would love to know how they arrived at 13 zones for Bendigo, when Traralgon is only 12 zones and is a further distance than Bendigo.
TheBlacksmith

A 28 day pass is the same daily amount as 70 days..
  TheBlacksmith Chief Commissioner

Location: Ankh Morpork
A 28 day pass is the same daily amount as 70 days..
topher1976
I don't know where you got that from, but a quick look at the PTV Myki web page gives the following: A concession Myki Pass from Southern Cross to Bendigo is $8.52 for the 28-69 day rate, and $6.21 for the 70-325 day rate.

It is simply a carry-over of the old V/Line discount system which reached it's maximum discount at 10 weeks. 70 days is 10 weeks.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line

Mind you, I would love to know how they arrived at 13 zones for Bendigo, when Traralgon is only 12 zones and is a further distance than Bendigo.
TheBlacksmith

Perhaps a cheaper fare because the service is second rate compared to the Bendigo line.

Mike.
  TheBlacksmith Chief Commissioner

Location: Ankh Morpork
Perhaps a cheaper fare because the service is second rate compared to the Bendigo line.

Mike.
The Vinelander
Hmm, that's a debateable point. Both services are run with Vlocity sets and once out of the suburban network run just as fast as each other. I have done both many times and cannot say there is any significant difference. Well, other than the wankers you get on the Bendigo service.

PS, I forgot there is the ever present danger of sinking into the Morwell swamp, but Vlocities float, don't they?
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Distances from Melbourne SCS

Bendigo 162 km
Traralgon 158 km

I guess 160 km Is the zone boarder ?
  topher1976 Train Controller

Location: Mill Park, Vic
I don't know where you got that from, but a quick look at the PTV Myki web page gives the following: A concession Myki Pass from Southern Cross to Bendigo is $8.52 for the 28-69 day rate, and $6.21 for the 70-325 day rate.

It is simply a carry-over of the old V/Line discount system which reached it's maximum discount at 10 weeks. 70 days is 10 weeks.
TheBlacksmith
I stand corrected.  I was referring to metropolitan areas.  My apologies mate Smile
  melbtrip Chief Commissioner

Location: Annoying Orange
Distances from Melbourne SCS

Bendigo 162 km
Traralgon 158 km

I guess 160 km Is the zone boarder ?
Nightfire
Country zones are based on the V/Line old units fares.

Bendigo to Melbourne was a 170 unit fare and which equals to zone 13
Traralgon to Melbourne was 160 unit fare and which equals to zone 12
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
This thread seems to have diverged from the original topic.

The State budget now says that 20 crossings will be removed in this term of government - about three and a half years to go.  Is there any indication of which crossings these are?
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner
  62440 Chief Commissioner

There seems to be a trend that grade separation involves lowering the railway resulting in long lead times, expense of lowering rail stations, diversion of services etc. I suspect many grade separations could just take the road over, even just an initial 2 lane bridge would help and it would be easier for the govt to trumpet the number of grade seps by adding easy ones to the big ticket ones. There is also a low headrom option where dives are for cars only where trucks have an alternative route.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Very unlikely a rail over road grade separation would be built with less than 5400mm clearance.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Grade separation at Furlong Rd would involve a new Ginifer Station if I'm not mistaken...

Incidentally, I noticed today that rail and signalling in the St Albans stabling yard has just been ripped up.  IMO room should be made for at least three tracks between Albion and St Albans.
  ZH836301 Chief Commissioner

Location: BleakCity
Others are likely to include those to Dandenong.

Exactly what the ALP needs to do to smash the do nothing Libs at the next election.

Nobody will care about their yearly airport trip on East West Link if they see what the money can do instead.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
They will care about reducing congestion though, and level crossing grade separations alone arguably isn't going to do much. The government will need to begin implementing a world-class system if it is to really smash the other parties.
  topher1976 Train Controller

Location: Mill Park, Vic
They will care about reducing congestion though, and level crossing grade separations alone arguably isn't going to do much. The government will need to begin implementing a world-class system if it is to really smash the other parties.
railblogger
True, but grade separations are a part of it.  They cannot increase services without doing the grade separations.  Reservoir and Bell St are two major ones as well, as the gates are down quite often during peak, especially at Reservoir.
  woodford Chief Commissioner

Yep re route the Highway In the form of a Lilydale bypass and close the level crossing, done !
Nightfire
Victoria rd/Mcintyre ln gets a bit of a flogging now doing just that.

From my experience a good deal of the traffic out of Lilydale on the Coldstream rd is comming from Route C401 from Bayswater, ie the extension of Cantebury rd and therefore are not using the level crossing.

I think you will find a good deal of the traffic over the level crossing is local and therefore cannot be bypassed.

woodford
  don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Adelaide proud
Others are likely to include those to Dandenong.

Exactly what the ALP needs to do to smash the do nothing Libs at the next election.

Nobody will care about their yearly airport trip on East West Link if they see what the money can do instead.
ZH836301
I find myself in rare agreement with you; the several billion up-front cost of East-West Link will buy an amazing amount of other traffic improvement projects. Tony Abbott's stupid billboard campaign against the Andrews government is just a waste of money. In addition I think Andrews will want to be well advanced with the actual digging on Swanston Metro to show the public what they've done - they won't be repeating the terrible dithering of Napthine et al.

There is also a low headrom option where dives are for cars only where trucks have an alternative route.
62440
VicRoads are very reluctant to allow these things to get built - the same as the 'cut-price' options being consider under Napthine for grade separations along the Dandy line, VicRoads were dead against any under-spending. It's a shame because I think we need to come up with some cheaper ways of getting these things done, especially in rural areas - they'll never be able to safely increase speeds on the ARTC/Vline networks without complete grade separation.
  melbtrip Chief Commissioner

Location: Annoying Orange
Yes, but only if you buy a pass valid for 70 or more days travel, purchased in advance. If you are paying that much up front, then you deserve the largest discount.

Mind you, I would love to know how they arrived at 13 zones for Bendigo, when Traralgon is only 12 zones and is a further distance than Bendigo.
TheBlacksmith
What happens if the person is on a low fixed income?,  why should a person get a financial penalty because they can't financially pay their fare in an advance?

This does not happen in capital cities like Sydney and Brisbane, Why should it happen here in Melbourne and why should fares be heavily discounted to people that has greater ability to pay their fares in advance?
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
VicRoads are very reluctant to allow these things to get built - the same as the 'cut-price' options being consider under Napthine for grade separations along the Dandy line, VicRoads were dead against any under-spending. It's a shame because I think we need to come up with some cheaper ways of getting these things done, especially in rural areas - they'll never be able to safely increase speeds on the ARTC/Vline networks without complete grade separation.
don_dunstan
The issue I see with the 'half-pregnant' grade separations is that they don't grade separate truck traffic. Trucks brake slower than cars when the boom gates start coming down and cause much more damage than cars when colliding with trains - from a rail safety perspective, they'd be just about the number one reason to grade separate a level crossing.

I think Melburnians need to harden up and accept that rail-over-road grade separations (and the corresponding elevated rail corridors that creates) are going to be the way forward, noise and visual pollution issues be damned.
  gobillino Junior Train Controller

Location: Melbourne
VicRoads are very reluctant to allow these things to get built - the same as the 'cut-price' options being consider under Napthine for grade separations along the Dandy line, VicRoads were dead against any under-spending. It's a shame because I think we need to come up with some cheaper ways of getting these things done, especially in rural areas - they'll never be able to safely increase speeds on the ARTC/Vline networks without complete grade separation.
don_dunstan
Plenty of the grade seps slated for removal aren't on the declared road network anyway. VicRoads have no real say on those ones. Plenty of opportunities to pursue low cost options on those.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
Government press release regarding first four crossings: http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/contract-awarded-for-first-four-level-crossing-removals
  don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Adelaide proud
Plenty of the grade seps slated for removal aren't on the declared road network anyway. VicRoads have no real say on those ones. Plenty of opportunities to pursue low cost options on those.
gobillino
It would be great if they could find a 'cookie cutter' solution for regional or country locations to cut costs - like a standard pre-fab set-up that could be easily deployed. Not being an engineer I'm not sure if that's practical but if we're going to speed up the country/interstate lines it's a necessity to get those grade separations done.

Government press release regarding first four crossings: http://www.premier.vic.gov.au/contract-awarded-for-first-four-level-crossing-removals
Railblogger
Call me cynical but some of these (Burke Road, North Road) seem to be re-announcements of existing projects.

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