RRL Opening Timetable - April 2015

 
  melbtrip Chief Commissioner

Location: Annoying Orange
If you want to go down that path your could force them to buy a V/Line paper ticket which could cost the Metro fare plus $10 or something like that.
Bendigo and Traralgon services are both fully myki apply and both Sunbury and Pakenham users pay same amount of fare as person wishing to travel from Melbourne to any of these locations: Riddlers Creek, Wandong and Bacchus Marsh.


The only problem of Sunbury and Pakenham using the V/Line is peak pm time(services from Melbourne) and then you can't tell the difference between a person get off at Metro station or person get off a V/Line station because everyone has a myki with them.

The best solution is run a train service that does the following:

Long term future ( which I think should happen:

1st tier: Watergarden (every 2nd train from Sunbury) to Dandenong via the Melbourne metro tunnel (run as 10mins metro train style service)

2nd tier: Bendigo stopping all stations to  Watergarden and then limited stops via Flinders Street to Dandenong and then stopping all stations to Traralgon

Sponsored advertisement

  Bogong Chief Commissioner

Location: Essendon Aerodrome circa 1980
Not many given the trip would be 10+ minutes longer, and wouldn't include Tarneit.


Geelong fills trains, Maryborough doesn't - they should be happy they have trains at all when it is clearly unsustainable.
ZH836301
True. I would also add that Maryborough's seat of Rippon is just one marginal seat in state parliament, whereas there are a whole swag of marginals in the Geelong area.

If the politicians (or their ministerial advisors) have any input into timetabling, (which I suspect they do), then it's a "no brainer" that they would favour an area where their political party has the chance to win several seats over an area where there is only one marginal seat.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
Bendigo and Traralgon services are both fully myki apply and both Sunbury and Pakenham users pay same amount of fare as person wishing to travel from Melbourne to any of these locations: Riddlers Creek, Wandong and Bacchus Marsh.
melbtrip
So do passengers travelling from Watergardens, Sunshine, Dandenong, Footscray, Caulfield, Clayton etc.

Why should Sunbury and Pakenham passengers get special treatment?
  Bogong Chief Commissioner

Location: Essendon Aerodrome circa 1980
I've always said that it you want to stop the riff-raff from outer suburban termini like Sunbury and Pakenham using country trains, simply bypass those termini and instead stop country trains at little used stations one stop in from the terminus, namely Digger's Rest and Cardinia Road.

That way rural passengers can transfer to or from the suburban train network, without being overwhelmed by what are essentially suburban passengers.

Easy. Very Happy
  Chidda Bang Locomotive Driver

Location: Banned
Yer i like ya idea my proposal needs SG platform in jacana RRL platform in tottenham

Seymour/Shepparton train stops at
Southern Cross
North Melbourne
Glenbervie (peak)
Jacana
Roxburgh Park
Donnybrook

Albury train and XPT stops at
Southern Cross
Jacana
Seymour

Bendigo train stops at
Southern Cross
Footscray
Diggers Rest
Clarkefield

Ballarat/Geelong train stops at
Southern Cross
Footscray
Tottenham
Ardeer

Gippsland train stops at
Southern Cross
Flinders Street
Richmond
Carnegie
Westall
Yarraman
Beaconsfield (peak)
Cardinia Road
Nar Nar Goon
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Chidda Bang, put down the crack pipe. Seriously.
  ZH836301 Chief Commissioner

Location: BleakCity
That way rural passengers can transfer to or from the suburban train network,
Bogong
But can't access the end of line station they actually wanted to reach.
  melbtrip Chief Commissioner

Location: Annoying Orange
So do passengers travelling from Watergardens, Sunshine, Dandenong, Footscray, Caulfield, Clayton etc.

Why should Sunbury and Pakenham passengers get special treatment?
railblogger
There is no special treatment, Sunbury and Pakenham passengers would treated as same way if person used the train service to travel to Caulfield from the city.

Normally a person travelling from the city to Caulfield - has choice been an express trains and a stopping all stations services.

My view the following should happen:

1st tier: Watergarden to Dandenong via the Melbourne metro tunnel (run as 10mins metro train style service)

2nd tier: Bendigo stopping all stations to  Watergarden and then limited stops via Flinders Street to Dandenong and then stopping all stations to Traralgon - it nearly same way as Vicrail run their services - http://www.victorianrailways.net/timetables/tt1967/tt1967_070_071.html
(may be a double deck train like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSW_TrainLink_H_set and which has 800 seats)


The benefits of this - PTV can put on a metro style service and if the metro train ends at Dandenong and then Metro can run more services with the same number trains that is currently run today.
In fact a train set can return to the city an hour earlier to start another service and in pm peak hour, that means more trains service can be run with the same number of train sets.

It also allows for better running of the 2nd tier services- because it would not be running slowly behind a metro train between Dandenong and Pakenham.

Personally - I do not believe there should be a metro style  trains running to outer suburban area like Pakenham - it just waste of resources.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Thanks Don.  I feel some rebound and screaming about to come from other areas around the state. Maryborough, Easglehawk and Echuca for starters.

Are more Vlocties on order and finannly are we really now approaching a time where the Geelong line should really go to electrification and the large number of expensive multiple unit DMU's be broken up and deployed around the network for other routes?  it is really looking like that to me.
bevans
20 minute frequency is a very intense suburban-type frequency on an interuban line - I can't think of another service like it in Australia that is diesel.

A separate 25kv V/line system might turn out to be inevitable as traffic continues to grow... Perhaps not until we have another Kevin Rudd splash out on state-based projects again (not under the current government I suppose). Otherwise Melbourne Metro and the level crossing project will probably suck the money out of every other capital works improvement for the next six or seven years.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
The new Geelong timetable will be almost impossible to remember. In fact it's even worse than the Belgrave/Lilydale as far as stopping patterns are concerned. The majority of trains will be run with VLocities anyway so they should just make all trains except Warrnambools stop all stations. Otherwise you have some trains packed to the brim and others carrying fresh air.

Disappointing that there are no extra services on the Gippsland, Seymour and Bendigo corridors. Even more disappointing there are no extra services for Eaglehawk and Epsom, despite promises of alternating trains. What a waste of money the new station has proved to be...
712M

Do you actually travel on the Geelong line, moreover a timetable change not including extras to Epsom and Eaglehawk doesn't mean a waste of money for all eternity of building a new station.

There's an election in three years....
  SamTheMan79 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Geelong
My 2 cents.

I work in IT in the CBD and commute from Geelong daily. Being in IT I have the need to travel to my place of work at different times of the day. In my experience the only services that aren't almost full, full or overcrowded are those prior to 6am, between 11am-2pm and after 8pm.

In my opinion the Geelong line has needed this change for a long, long time. All of the stop gap measures of adding one or two extra services here and there and an extra carriage here and there have helped but only for short periods of time. Have a look at V/Line's figures for the last 10 years, passenger numbers have increased and continue to increase at an amazing rate.

The changes might be over the top but I think it'll be a case of build it and they will come. With the addition of two stations on the line and services stopping at Deer Park & Ardeer I think they might be revisiting electrification and duplication of Melton sooner rather than later as well as the extension of Werribee services to Wyndham Vale.

As for the other lines not receiving extra services or new rollingstock I think you'll find by November or April (aligning with normal timetable changes) these will come to fruition.

Cheers.
  gomer Train Controller

Location: Melbourne
November is when Bendigo, Seymour and perhaps Traralgon will get their turn.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

November is when Bendigo, Seymour and perhaps Traralgon will get their turn.
gomer
Jacinta Allan was interviewed on Win News last night about the lack of new Bendigo services and she mentioned November too.

As for Melton electrification - given the population boom there at present, that should happen sooner rather than later IMO.
  TOQ-1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Power Trainger
Possibly waiting on the community consultation on the Bendigo Metro which will most likely come back with the outcome alternate ever other service at Eaglehawk and Epsom, so they can claim they acted on Community Consultation. And also when the suburban network is rearranged for different paths, and there is more rolling stock available.

If the Metro is starts construction in 2018, Melton electrification isn't likely until that's completed in around 2022. I agree though, it should be done as soon as possible. If the line is electrified before the metro is completed services could possibly run to Southern Cross only
  SamTheMan79 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Geelong
Note  RRL speeds now  Plats 1 - 7 to Franklin St  25kmh, Over flyover to Spion Kop Junction 40kmh, Plats 15/16 to Spion Kop Junction  65kmh,  Spion Kop Jct West Footscray  Loco hauled 65kmh / DMU  80kmh,  West Footscray - Sunshine  100/130,
Sunshine - Deer Park Junction  basically  Down line  115/160  Up line  115/130, Deer Park Junction - Manor Junction - Corio  115/160 .
kuldalai

What is the reason behind Sunshine - Deer Park Junction down line 115/160 & up line 115/130?
  ab123 Chief Train Controller

What is the reason behind Sunshine - Deer Park Junction down line 115/160 & up line 115/130?
SamTheMan79

To save $$ I guess. It has been that way since RFR as most trains used the South (Down) Line. (Now the North line is the Up line)

As for Melton electrification, I think its not going to be a simple as it once was now that Bacchus Marsh has also boomed. I think a better value for money option would be to complete a 2nd track Melton - Rockbank and Rockbank - Deer Park West.
  Trainplanner Chief Commissioner

Location: Along the Line
Agree with you AB 123.  The best investment for the Ballarat Corridor is to increase track capacity first by duplication to at least Melton initially.   You can then make decisions later about electrification.  The growth around Bacchus Marsh has been and continues to be massive so establishing what the overall long term needs are for Deer Park through to Bacchus Marsh should be considered first prior to developing plans for electrification.

This will form one of many elements to be considered in the Regional Network Master plan.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

What is the reason behind Sunshine - Deer Park Junction down line 115/160 & up line 115/130?
SamTheMan79
The Down line is Class 1, the Up line is Class 2.  Class 2 track has a 130 km/h limit for Sprinters/Velocity DMUs.
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

What is the reason behind Sunshine - Deer Park Junction down line 115/160 & up line 115/130?
SamTheMan79
Prior to RRL  when  Sunshine to Deer Park West was duplicated in the late 1970's it was signalled as Class-2 track for 115kmh for loco hauled with bi-directional signalling on both tracks.

When the RFR  project was done in the early 2000's  the South line only was upgraded to Class-1 and re signalled for 160kmh operation . The North line remained as Class -2 track and  130kmh maximum for DMU.  It was a cost thing .

Then with RRL it was decided to only have uni directional signalling Southern Cross to  Deer Park Junction and from there onto  Manor Junction .  Again cost issue.  So the South Line signalling in the Up direction between Sunsine and Deer Park Junction was removed, and the Down signalling removed from the North line over the same section .  So that is why the speeds are 160kmh on the Down (South) line and 130kmh on the Up (North) line .  

There are considerable extra costs and interlocking implications especially with level crossing protection involved with bi directional signalling and 160 kmh running .

That is why on the Werribee - Little River - Lara - Corio   section whilst both tracks still retain the bi-directional signalling  and Class - 1 track ; but  160 kmh on the Down & 130 kmh on the Up for the East line, and  160kmh for the Up and 130kmh on the Down on the West line.  (So  160kmh for DMU for normal left hand running, and 130kmh for right hand running.)  Again  an issue of costs, signalling, and level crossings  .
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

With the Ballarat  track  badly needed short term improvements are an extra crossing loop between Parwan and Bank Box,  duplication between Melton and Deer Park Junction, and installation of a high speed crossover at Warrenheip.

The new loop at Rowsley immediately on the Down side of Bacchus Marsh is funded and due for completion in the first quarter of  2016/17.  Melton - Rockbank will be duplicated first as there are no platforms involved followed immediately by Rockbank - Deer Park Junction involving a second platform at  Caroline Springs  now under construction (hopefully building the second platform now.)
A high speed crossover at Warrenheip is planned so as to restore duplicated track between Warrenheip and Ballarat for VLP Melbourne line services .

With the new loop at Rowsley the  Weekday Ballarat Off Peak frquency can then be stepped up to every 40 minutes .

With Bendigo  what is likely and needed is extension of the existing Castlemaine Loop in a Down direction to around Harcourt.  Then one can run Bendigo on a 40 minute frequency too with alternate trains originating/terminating at  Epsom and Eaglehawk .  That would fulfil the desire to provide a local Bendigo Metro rail service also .  On the leg not serviced by the train in each 40 minute cycle one simply operates an Express shuttle bus from/to   Bendigo station to  to/from Epsom or Eaglehawk .

The reason both Geelong and Ballarat have got their full new RRL timetables now is because with full RRL completion those lines have no interface at all with Metro trains, so those services can go now .

Bendigo will no doubt get an enhanced service later around November as hinted at by Minister when all Metro train groups are scheduled to get revamped timetables.  As  VLP interfaces with Metro still between Anderson Road (Sunshine) and Sunbury  this is no doubt why VLP Bendigo has to wait till later in 2015 .  

The other issue is that with RRL completed a full year early  VLP is really under the pump for rollingstock, so a staged opening of RRL  over Geelong, Ballarat and Bendigo allows more time for extra  V/Locity  deliveries.  With all cars on order it will be late 2017 at earliest till the last of 64 cars on order will be delivered .
  SamTheMan79 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Geelong
The other issue is that with RRL completed a full year early  VLP is really under the pump for rollingstock, so a staged opening of RRL  over Geelong, Ballarat and Bendigo allows more time for extra  V/Locity  deliveries.  With all cars on order it will be late 2017 at earliest till the last of 64 cars on order will be delivered .
kuldalai
With regards to the rollingstock and availability the V/Line website was updated mid last month advising that the bogie repairs on Z carriages would be complete by July 2016.

With the additional V/Locities and all the Z carriages coming back the $64,000 question is how much growth are we going to see between now and then?
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
 Melton - Rockbank will be duplicated first as there are no platforms involved followed immediately by Rockbank - Deer Park Junction involving a second platform at  Caroline Springs  now under construction (hopefully building the second platform now.)
kuldalai


Yer...what Question

I don't think so....I looked 2 days ago and nuthin.....no work whatsoever has been completed at the site of Caroline Springs station, let alone the first platform.....Confused
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

Serious mistakes in printed edition of new Geelong line timetable effective  21/06/15 .  Bad errors like this show a poor level of checking and attention to detail at both VLP and  PTV .

Up Weekdays  .  In the middle of the day services are out of sequence and the  1212  Up Waurn Ponds and 1241 Up South Geelong services are also shown  TWICE  !!!!   Up  Sundays the 1637  Up Waurn Ponds is NOT shown at all .
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Yer...what Question

I don't think so....I looked 2 days ago and nuthin.....no work whatsoever has been completed at the site of Caroline Springs station, let alone the first platform.....Confused
The Vinelander
Wouldn't It be better to build Caroline Springs station as an Island platform ?
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

According to PTV Press adverting the first public service via  Wyndamvale will be the 0010  Down  Waurn Ponds in the early hours of Sunday  21/06/2015 .  

For the record the first day of rail passenger services from Geelong (via Werribee)   to  Greenwich was  June 25th 1857.  When first opened the Geelong Line was a private railway and it operated to Greenwich on the banks of the Yarra where a ferry connection up the Yarra to the City of Melbourne provided the final leg .  It was not until some time later when the Melbourne – Wlliamstown line opened that though operation of Geelong trains via Newport was  realized .  So just short of 158 years of operation via Werribee, Geelong trains now operating from their fourth Southern terminus at Waurn Ponds  will cease running via Werribee . The Chief Engineer of the Melbourne / Geelong railway Company was knocked from the locomotive of the inaugural train (25/06/1857) near Separation Street North Geelong and died .  A memorial plaque is placed outside the site of his original residence in Skene Street Newtown on the North side a few doors West of Latrobe Terrace in the footpath.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from:   

Quick Reply

We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.