Hyden movements

 
  antiussentiment Locomotive Driver

Location: perth
Hey all,
We're off to Hyden this week end.  I've never seen a train on the Hyden branch.  What's the chance of catching a train there over the next 4-5 days?
I suspect it's too early in the season to spot a grain train?

What other movements on the great southern line should i look out for on the trip down, Thursday/Friday back Monday?

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  Kafoopsy Chief Commissioner

Location: Perth, WA
There is likely enough grain still there from last season to keep the grain trains running all year round.  I'm not sure how it works, but they appear to work certain lines for a few days at a time.  I chanced upon a train loading at Pingaring, not far from Hyden the last time I was out there.
  Graintrain Beginner

Watco/CBH have 3 fleets in the Albany zone and closest load point for next weeks plan will be Kalgarin - just south of Hyde.
  antiussentiment Locomotive Driver

Location: perth
Watco/CBH have 3 fleets in the Albany zone and closest load point for next weeks plan will be Kalgarin - just south of Hyde.
Graintrain
After posting the question, I was unable to login to check answers.  The net in our end of Bayswater is very scratchy and Railpage is pretty unforgiving if your net is crappy....

But as it was we arrived on Saturday morning to find a train loading at the Hyden bin.  It's the first time I've seen traffic on that line.  So quite a highlight for me..

Thanks for your replies..
  Trainplanner Chief Commissioner

Location: Along the Line
Good to hear about some movements in the West.   Hard to imagine twenty plus years ago that the Hyden and Newdegate Lines were candidates for closure but after a big push to heavily upgrade these lines at that time they have become quite significant contributors to the total rail task from that region through to Albany which is why this whole issue of Tier 3 Lines is so short sighted.  An investment like what was done with the Hyden Line using secondhand 47kg/m rail, steel sleepers and crushed metal ballast enabled the line to be operated at 19 tonne axleload and higher speed to significantly improve its performance.

This is even more relevant given the huge impending harvest and the staggeringly poor condition of the road network around the Tier 3 lines which is totally inadequate to handle B doubles of grain.

Thanks to GrainTrain.   Any snippets you have on train movements etc from time to time would be much appreciated.
  antiussentiment Locomotive Driver

Location: perth
Good to hear about some movements in the West.   Hard to imagine twenty plus years ago that the Hyden and Newdegate Lines were candidates for closure but after a big push to heavily upgrade these lines at that time they have become quite significant contributors to the total rail task from that region through to Albany which is why this whole issue of Tier 3 Lines is so short sighted.  An investment like what was done with the Hyden Line using secondhand 47kg/m rail, steel sleepers and crushed metal ballast enabled the line to be operated at 19 tonne axleload and higher speed to significantly improve its performance.

This is even more relevant given the huge impending harvest and the staggeringly poor condition of the road network around the Tier 3 lines which is totally inadequate to handle B doubles of grain.

Thanks to GrainTrain.   Any snippets you have on train movements etc from time to time would be much appreciated.
Trainplanner
We came home via Quarading.  Two of the bridges on that line have gates and fences across the ends of them.  Possibly the most stupid waste of money I've ever seen..
  Bulbous Assistant Commissioner

We came home via Quarading.  Two of the bridges on that line have gates and fences across the ends of them.  Possibly the most stupid waste of money I've ever seen..
"antiussentiment"


The main bridge over the Avon River was fenced mainly as the locals were using the bridge to drive vehicles over to avoid going round the normal way, and off-road vehicles were also using the bridge to cross the river. Where was the second bridge with gates though?

Cheers,

Matt.
  antiussentiment Locomotive Driver

Location: perth
We came home via Quarading.  Two of the bridges on that line have gates and fences across the ends of them.  Possibly the most stupid waste of money I've ever seen..


The main bridge over the Avon River was fenced mainly as the locals were using the bridge to drive vehicles over to avoid going round the normal way, and off-road vehicles were also using the bridge to cross the river. Where was the second bridge with gates though?

Cheers,

Matt.
Bulbous
The second bridge is just west of Green hills..

Hilarious re the short cut..  Amateur hi-railers..
  antiussentiment Locomotive Driver

Location: perth
We came home via Quarading.  Two of the bridges on that line have gates and fences across the ends of them.  Possibly the most stupid waste of money I've ever seen..


The main bridge over the Avon River was fenced mainly as the locals were using the bridge to drive vehicles over to avoid going round the normal way, and off-road vehicles were also using the bridge to cross the river. Where was the second bridge with gates though?

Cheers,

Matt.
The second bridge is just west of Green hills..

Hilarious re the short cut..  Amateur hi-railers..
  Graintrain Beginner

Good to hear about some movements in the West.   Hard to imagine twenty plus years ago that the Hyden and Newdegate Lines were candidates for closure but after a big push to heavily upgrade these lines at that time they have become quite significant contributors to the total rail task from that region through to Albany which is why this whole issue of Tier 3 Lines is so short sighted.  An investment like what was done with the Hyden Line using secondhand 47kg/m rail, steel sleepers and crushed metal ballast enabled the line to be operated at 19 tonne axleload and higher speed to significantly improve its performance.

This is even more relevant given the huge impending harvest and the staggeringly poor condition of the road network around the Tier 3 lines which is totally inadequate to handle B doubles of grain.

Thanks to GrainTrain.   Any snippets you have on train movements etc from time to time would be much appreciated.
Trainplanner
Grain season for rail looking pretty solid but will know more once we get harvest into full swing in coming weeks, the dry September has probably knocked grain yields speaking with Gero, Kwinana and Albany growers over past fortnight. Agree Trainplanner that the local regional road issue is very hot topic at the moment and always disappointing to see Tier 3 lines laying idle - lets hope grain trains are out there again soon. The Hyden line a good example of performance improvements that can explored - just need the collective heads to agree our way forward as hopefully grain has a long and prosperous future with rail being a key link to our export markets.
  Trainplanner Chief Commissioner

Location: Along the Line
Thanks Grain Train.   I think a combination of a decent sized harvest and significant pressure from Shire Councils, grain growers and CBH that something my still happen with a couple of the Tier 3 lines even it its not all.   Family contacts in Wickepin say their Shire is just overwhelmed with how it can manage the road damage now taking place and that the cost to reactivate and upgrade some tier 3 lines is a far more cost effective, much more sustainable option than trying to upgrade roads that were never designed for the trucks they are carrying and effectively need to be rebuilt because of damage to the actual subgrade and formation.  The cost of doing that would be massive versus what performance you can get out of a relatively modest upgrade for those rail lines.
  Bulbous Assistant Commissioner

The second bridge is just west of Green hills..

Hilarious re the short cut..  Amateur hi-railers..
"antiussentiment"


I checked it out on the way home from work in Quairading the other day, and was surprised that they gated that one too.

Discussing the Quairading line with someone from Brookfield the other day in regards to upgrading or closing the level crossings on the line for roadworks, and they made a note that the line may not be out of action for the long term at this stage. nothing further though, but I wasn't pushing for more information.

Cheers,

Matt.
  Trainplanner Chief Commissioner

Location: Along the Line
Not sure if posters on this thread are aware that the Quaraiding Grain Bin is well and truly in the top 5 largest receival sites for CBH.   Beccause of a couple of key factors related to this line including condition of and cost to rebuild or replace the bridge of the Avon River, lower track standard (gravel ballast) with poor performance in wet months, fairly twisty alignment and the adjoining high standard/high capacity main east-west standard gauge line, there has always been an ongoing debate to close this line and heavily upgrade the road link to Kellerberrin.

I'm aware of a least three studies from around 1980 on this and on each and every occassion the numbers always rated retaining rail as the best option.   Its also unfortunate as well that at the time Westrail was heavily rehabilitating much lower standard lines like Newdegate, Hyden, Kalannie etc using recycled 47kg/m rail off the main standard gauge line, that that source of rail was exhausted because had it have been available the Quaraiding Line was the next slated that for rehabilitation that would have included rerailing, insertion of steel sleepers and reballasting with crushed metal ballast in low lying sections.   That would have lifted the axleload to 19 tonnes and improved the overall track speed and cycle times as well.

Since that time under the CBH model there is no doubt productivity would have further improved with newer light weight high capacity wagons etc.


I'm still sure that after having previously been exhaustively studied y that the same conclusion that rail on a much upgraded track with the lower cost CBH model
still wins out.
  Graintrain Beginner

Yes the Avon River bridge is a very lumpy piece of capital - along with the poor condition of the Quairading track which has sections of 58lb and 60lb rail from the turn of the 19th Century. This section of track was from York to Bruce Rock however through years of wash-a-ways and minimal maintenance in mid to late 90's was shortened to Quairading as the end point.

Like much of the tier 3 debate, it comes down to freight densities and track alignment to export terminals for the rail economics to work - lets hope there are some positive outcomes. Was speaking with a Watco driver last week and he learnt his craft on the Narembeen line in the 1980's - and he said they travelled at 80KPH from Merredin on route to Narembeen to load grain!
  Trainplanner Chief Commissioner

Location: Along the Line
One of the lower cost Avon bridge replacement options was to replace the bridge with an ARMCO plated design that included enabling water to flow over the top of it in the extremely rare times that that section of the Avon River floods.   It was quite innovative thinking that says for the 1 or 2 days disruption to the line extremely rare flood events would bring would be absolutely minimal in looking at a much, much lower cost bridging solution than replacement with a convential bridge.

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