Tas models HO or OO scale/gauge?

 
Topic moved from Tasmania by dthead on 03 Oct 2016 11:20
  goodyben1 Beginner

who out there would run Tasmanian model trains on there layout? if so what would the proffered scale be? HO scale in 3.5 mm or OO gauge in 4mm? or maybe N scale?. what do you think?

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  duttonbay Minister for Railways

Historically Tasmanian modellers have used 4mm scale - OO. 16.5mm gauge is very nearly as close to 3'6" as it is to standard gauge.
  Sulla1 Chief Commissioner

With a large amount of HOn3.5 ready to run and kits being produced for the Queensland market, anyone considering starting a Tasmanian layout should at least consider 12mm gauge track and rollingstock as the easiest starting point these days.
  duttonbay Minister for Railways

Maybe. Some of the diesels might be able to be repainted, but how much of the QR rolling stock would be able to be used in a TGR model?
  patsstuffnow Junior Train Controller

Plenty of locos can be modified or just repainted from Johland.  
But in the AN era quite a few rollingstock items were transferred from SAR and CR stock. I can think of OB, FBX , FB, tankers, several types of flat wagons and so on. Just need to squeeze the bogies. !!
In steam days there were loco interchanges as well.
  br30453 Chief Train Controller

Plenty of locos can be modified or just repainted from Johland.  
But in the AN era quite a few rollingstock items were transferred from SAR and CR stock. I can think of OB, FBX , FB, tankers, several types of flat wagons and so on. Just need to squeeze the bogies. !!
In steam days there were loco interchanges as well.
patsstuffnow
And the 830 class DELs from South Australia.
  David Peters Dr Beeching

Location: "With Hey Boy".
Actually old Tasmanian Railways rollingstock would all have to be scratchbuilt if you used HOn3 as has been said most Tasmanian modellers use OO scale with the track being near 3 ft 6 inch or NG. Most Tasmanian Railways stock models are built to OO scale and having OO and HO models together on one layout would work, but it would not look at all good!
  dthead Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
there is some stuff out there. WD models used to make some wagons in HOn3 Black Diamond do offer a Tassie repaint.

I have a kit of a guards van somewhere.......

As the other David said  there is little to buy these days...


David Head
  lkernan Deputy Commissioner

Location: Melbourne
If it all gets too confusing, do what I did and model it in G gauge (1:24 scale) Smile
  SA_trains Deputy Commissioner

Location: ACT
Another option is S-scale on 16.5mm gauge track representing 3'6" gauge.

For example, there are several options for SAR narrow gauge that could be "exported" for TGR railways. Strath Hobbies in Victor Harbour are marketing a range of SAR narrow gauge items in Sn3.5. For example, there is a 830-class loco and also quite interestingly, they offer a kit of the SAR Y-class in Sn3.5. The SAR Y-class steam loco and the TGR C-class (and CC-class) were built to a similar design by Beyer Peacock. (also WAGR and CR!) In my mind, that is the genesis of a nice model railway. Others have suggested that SAR rolling stock also crossed Bass Straight which would make sense. Probably worthwhile to have a look at what else Strath Hobbies offers in Sn3.5!

Good luck!
  mattc66 Locomotive Driver

and there is a chance that Strath Hobbies might do a T class in S scale next year to go with the Y class.

  siroch Locomotive Driver

Historically Tasmanian modellers have used 4mm scale - OO. 16.5mm gauge is very nearly as close to 3'6" as it is to standard gauge.
duttonbay
This is not an accurate statement. Sn3.5 has been around longer as the most prolific scratch builder of steam locomotives in this scale has been active for 50 years. I have been building in this scale for 25 years.
  M636C Minister for Railways

Maybe. Some of the diesels might be able to be repainted, but how much of the QR rolling stock would be able to be used in a TGR model?
duttonbay

The most obvious choice is the QR 2150 class, four of which entered service a few years ago as 2051-2054 without even being repainted, just renumbered with Tasmanian logos replacing QR.

These are generally like the 2300 and 2400 classes available in HOn3-1/2.

The 2001 series are ex QR 1460 and 1502 class, fitted with a low nose that they never had in Queensland. But if you could make a new nose and cab front, (or use one from a 2300 or similar body) you would have two current locomotive types.

And there is one 830 preserved now at Don River and quite a few of them worked in Tasmania during the AN era.

Other posts have mentioned steam, but not the T class 4-8-0s which were sold to TGR by SAR after the CR took over the line to Oodnadatta (and later Alice Springs).

Quite a lot of HO and HOn3-1/2 locomotives are available for TGR models.

M636C
  duttonbay Minister for Railways

Historically Tasmanian modellers have used 4mm scale - OO. 16.5mm gauge is very nearly as close to 3'6" as it is to standard gauge.
This is not an accurate statement. Sn3.5 has been around longer as the most prolific scratch builder of steam locomotives in this scale has been active for 50 years. I have been building in this scale for 25 years.
siroch
My statement related to the original question: if so what would the proffered scale be? HO scale in 3.5 mm or OO gauge in 4mm? or maybe N scale?

I don't believe I have ever seen any examples of, or articles on, S scale Tasmanian layouts. I've seen plenty of WA, QLD and a little SA (plus lots from across the ditch in NZ) but nothing that I can recall on Tasmania. The AMRM index shows nothing.
  dthead Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Historically Tasmanian modellers have used 4mm scale - OO. 16.5mm gauge is very nearly as close to 3'6" as it is to standard gauge.
duttonbay


I'll second What Duttonbay was talking about in this thread.  4mm on 16.5mm track.  No one never said it was toally accurate, but allowed a lot of modellers the chance to use not only RTR mechs, but alot of the bodies and details as well. The  gauge/scale combination is very popular when talking about Tasmanian modelling. We are not talking the history of scales in general here.

In terms of Tassie S scale, in these days of 3D modelling,  a print can often see a model be made and printed in different scales....... and yes the current growth od SA narrow gauge items may indeed inspire someone.

Regards,
David Head
  brod13 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Norske Skog, Tasmania
http://www.railtasmania.com/modelling/

Max and Simon Chandler have Sn3.5 layouts, Max has a new layout based around Penguin to debut in a few weeks time.


Simon Handby is producing 4mm scale stuff for 16.5mm or 14mm gauge track. Both locos and wagons.

OZRail are releasing FB fish belly wagons in HO.
WD Model kits in Hon3.5 are E Van, C open, H Cattle and DB guards can.
  brod13 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Norske Skog, Tasmania
Marbleup models in WA also offer a few wagons which were transferred to Tas in the CR/ANR Era. 3D printed in most scales also.
  David Peters Dr Beeching

Location: "With Hey Boy".


OZRail are releasing FB fish belly wagons in HO.
brod13
These wagons are a bit of a disappointment though as they have the stanchions moulded on the sides of the wagons and not easily removed as well as clip in one's to stand up. The real wagons have only one set of stanchions that are either stood up or clipped into place on the side when not in use. So a wagon having two sets of stanchions is going to look a bit funny.  The model should have been made as just the bare wagon with either your choice of stanchions either upright or on the side provide in a bag for you the modeller to put on. If you want a FB with all the stanchions stowed on the sides then get them, but if you want to have the stanchions upright then you might be better buying a kit from End Of the Line hobbies at Victor Harbor here in SA and using them as as basis for the Tasmanian ones.
  Newcastle Express Chief Commissioner

HO scale in 3.5 mm or OO gauge in 4mm
goodyben1
If it's not a "toy" railway but model railways(1), it's important to say scale, not gauge, as for the above examples, you can run S scale on non S-gauge track. Saying XYZ gauge could be any scale trains running on XYZ gauge. But probably not important enough for beginners.

But remember while it is good to get advice for any models (trains or not), they are YOUR models. For the correct scale, you also need to factor in other things, such as how big your space is, where it will be, etc & etc.

1. Yeah, yeah, I know, some consider models are toys & v.v.
Lego trains I'm not so sure about, as some of those Lego trains look more like models than toys. Even the adults are into Lego trains!! Surprised
  duttonbay Minister for Railways

The Poms call it OO Gauge - and they invented it! Possibly because it's not a scale anything, with rolling stock and structures to one scale and the track to another.
  robertc Chief Train Controller

You can chose whatever scale/ gauge combination you want to.

However these days there is plenty of 12mm equipment available that makes the compromise 4mm scale on 16.5mm track not such a necessity.

While both HO and S scales have their advantages, HO has the wide range of economically priced details available.

Just because it was not in AMRM does not mean it didn't happen.  You might want to read some back issues of Tasmanian Railway Hobbyist.

cheers
Bob Comerford
  NSWGR1855 Deputy Commissioner

who out there would run Tasmanian model trains on there layout? if so what would the proffered scale be? HO scale in 3.5 mm or OO gauge in 4mm? or maybe N scale?. what do you think?
goodyben1
H0 gauge track with 1/64 scale models or TT gauge track with 1/87 scale models result in a reasonably accurate scale gauge combination. 4mm/foot scale results in a track gauge close to 4ft, to big for reasonably accurate models. I would stear clear of this combination to represent any 3'6 gauge prototype.

Cheers,
Terry Flynn.
  David Peters Dr Beeching

Location: "With Hey Boy".
Really you have to go with what is made for Tasmanian models so if you do not want to do a lot of scratchbuilding of models etc then it might be better to go with the flow that is Tasmanian modelling. So if they do use 4mm scale then at least you can get models of wagons etc as kits or whatever rather than building everything from scratch. There is nothing of course stopping you from scratchbuilding the models of Tasmanian rollingstock in any scale though, but most would not have the time to scratchbuild everything.
  dthead Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
It's always up to many factors

* Do you want to run with your existing models ?

* Do you want to build and be compatible with certain others?n

* Do you care not for others and want to start with a blank sheet in whatever scale, as long as you can do Tassie stuff?

So it is up to the modeller to decide.

You can go 4mm/ft scale on 16.5 mm gauge like many currently do for Tassie modelling. It may niot be accurate, there again the classic OO is not either, and look how popular that still is !

One could go the 12mm way and take advantage of the same scale as alot of stuff these days.
Sn3 1/2 is quite possible these days, look at the SA stuff on offer.
Even On42 might be a proposition.

There are a lot of possibilites for modelling 3ft 6inch gauge railways. One could try to be a rebel and do what a ot of QLD modellers did
- model HO scale but still on 16.5mm gauge ( runnig on broad gauge).

What is popular, what is best, what to decide.

That's up to you Smile

Regards,
David Head
  allan Chief Commissioner

The most important factor is the scale/gauge combination used by your friends and associates. Railway modellling is, now, potentially very complex, which means that very few, if any, can "know it all". Railway modelling is a collaborative, co-operative and social activity, hence the importance of clubs (formal and informal), Facebook groups and Railpage.

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