Southland Station construction

 
  Adogs Chief Train Controller

Amazed it has taken this long to provide a railway station at a major shopping complex.

Is Victoria still asleep at the wheel?
MetroFemme

Ah.  Well, it's not that simple.  The people who own Southland (and Chadstone) have for a long time been quite hostile to the idea of there being a railway station at their complexes.  So they have been able to stymie it any time it came up as an option.

Westfield (owners of Southland) opened a London site a few years ago, built directly adjacent to a rail line.  However, they tried very hard NOT to have it connected to a station - it basically took the local council saying if it didn't have station access, they wouldn't be able to build, before they gave in.

Gandel (owner of Chadstone) was always steadfastly opposed to there being a railway station under Chadstone though, and his pockets are very deep.

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  TheMeddlingMonk Deputy Commissioner

Location: The Time Vortex near Melbourne, Australia
Being hostile to a railway connection just doesn't make sense to me... what was their reasoning for not wanting it (in London or at Chadstone)?
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: North Haverbrook; where the monorail is king!
Being hostile to a railway connection just doesn't make sense to me... what was their reasoning for not wanting it (in London or at Chadstone)?
TheMeddlingMonk
Shopping centre operators tend to think that railway stations attract the wrong sort of 'customers'.
  Adogs Chief Train Controller

Being hostile to a railway connection just doesn't make sense to me... what was their reasoning for not wanting it (in London or at Chadstone)?
TheMeddlingMonk

From the 60s onwards, you had period when (almost) anyone who could afford to drive, did so.  Having a railway station at your shopping centre meant it'd have a lot more poor people and school kids hanging around, or so the thinking went.

There was also the question of cash flow to/from the automotive lobby - from the 50s onward, part of the business model of encouraging everyone to shift to cars included supporting shopping malls and housing estates designed to force people into cars, along with lobbying to funnel infrastructure cash wholly or mostly into freeways.
  Adogs Chief Train Controller

Being hostile to a railway connection just doesn't make sense to me... what was their reasoning for not wanting it (in London or at Chadstone)?
Shopping centre operators tend to think that railway stations attract the wrong sort of 'customers'.
LancedDendrite

Bingo.  You've put it more succinctly than I did.
  TheMeddlingMonk Deputy Commissioner

Location: The Time Vortex near Melbourne, Australia
Interesting. Thanks for answering my question.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
That bridge is dual purpose, it's car access and more shopping center as they expanded south towards the railway line. Which means it's not that far of a walk to access the shops from the new station. Whether they actually provide an access point that doesn't require a ridiculous amount of walking is another thing, for no doubt the center managment won't want regular influxes of Frankston residents.
ARodH
Walking into the centre from the Nepean Hwy is also really painful, the whole centre is a car-orientated development.
  Adogs Chief Train Controller

That bridge is dual purpose, it's car access and more shopping center as they expanded south towards the railway line. Which means it's not that far of a walk to access the shops from the new station. Whether they actually provide an access point that doesn't require a ridiculous amount of walking is another thing, for no doubt the center managment won't want regular influxes of Frankston residents.
Walking into the centre from the Nepean Hwy is also really painful, the whole centre is a car-orientated development.
don_dunstan

The walk from the new station through the carpark will be a bit annoying, but won't be too bad...  Easier than walking in from Chelt via the Nepean at any rate.

BUT - can we please note that the bridge over the Nepean is basically all shops, beside a single lane of carpark access road tacked on the side.

The walk from the new station is only about 50m through the carpark.
  Radioman Chief Train Controller

Hello All,

I have often thought that Southland was a missed opportunity in a number of ways . When the original plan was agreed by the State Government they should have made the provision of a railway station integral to the development and at the developers expense as I understand was done at Cronulla , Sydney .

If that was done an integrated bus and railway station could have been provided . Now to interchange between bus and train at Southland requires a long walk ( Life be in it Programme ! ) . The bus station at Southland is an appalling design that is badly signposted ( we do bad sign posting in Melbourne rather well regrettably ) and which passengers endure , not good for either Public Transport or Westfield in my view .

I also agree that Southland is NOT pedestrian friendly, private cars have priority , and as the late architect Robyn Boyd would have observed it is a great example of the Great Australian Ugliness when it comes to building design.

Then again I would argue that Box Hill Central is an award winner when it comes to ugliness , poor design and a lack of signposting , unless you happen to be a pre teen child when the few signs that are provided are at your height.

Box Hill Central's Bus station ia diesel fume laden draughty ( yes it manages to achieve both of those objectives )  ugly structure that is a case study in what NOT to provide .

Best wishes and regards , Radioman
  Gauntlet Chief Commissioner

Location:
I went to Southland again today and noticed that they've made good progress with the shelters.
Later I noticed that I wasn't the only one checking out the station.  


by Gauntlet, on Flickr
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

I went to Southland again today and noticed that they've made good progress with the shelters.
Later I noticed that I wasn't the only one checking out the station.  


by Gauntlet, on Flickr
Gauntlet


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj_ALrC7C_g

Will be some disruption this weekend and opening in a few months time according to the News last night.
  Gauntlet Chief Commissioner

Location:
I know it's only been two weeks since my last photo, but since the line was closed last weekend I thought they might have made quite a bit of progress recently.


by Gauntlet, on Flickr
  Heihachi_73 Chief Commissioner

Location: Terminating at Ringwood
[snip] Part of the business model of encouraging everyone to shift to cars included supporting shopping malls and housing estates designed to force people into cars, along with lobbying to funnel infrastructure cash wholly or mostly into freeways.
"Adogs"

Sounds just like today's politicians!
  Adogs Chief Train Controller

[snip] Part of the business model of encouraging everyone to shift to cars included supporting shopping malls and housing estates designed to force people into cars, along with lobbying to funnel infrastructure cash wholly or mostly into freeways.

Sounds just like today's politicians!
Heihachi_73
Kind of.  Although it's a little different in one regard - the auto manufacturers don't really have political clout like they used to (seeing as most are staving off the wolves) - the lobbyists pushing things nowadays are more the road construction companies, then also Lend Lease etc.
  Gauntlet Chief Commissioner

Location:
It's been eight weeks since my last photo here and opening day is almost in sight (maybe).


by Gauntlet, on Flickr
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

Nice photo, unfortunately the shelters don't cover the whole station.
  TOQ-1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Power Trainger
Nice photo, unfortunately the shelters don't cover the whole station. When it is rainy and windy, I bet most people will just take the car instead.
James974
Frankston Line had 10 minute or better frequency. If people are planning to catch PT, they will catch it.
  Revenue Chief Commissioner

Nice photo, unfortunately the shelters don't cover the whole station. When it is rainy and windy, I bet most people will just take the car instead.
James974
I'm going to take issue with this comment. Smile
There's no evidence that the absence of full weather coverage will drive patronage to a station. There is coverage for people waiting for trains - and with trains every ten minutes they won't be waiting long.
Walking from a station platform into a shopping centre is pretty similar to walking from an outdoor car park to a shopping centre.
The reason why this sort of stuff is important is that you've asked for a change that would have cost hundreds of thousands of dollars - even though there's no evidence it would have made a material impact on the customer experience or patronage.
Just wanted to make the point that every dollar that is wasted on things that aren't needed is a dollar that could be spent elsewhere.
The other factor is that I'm pretty sure the shopping centre will develop towards the station - and maybe even buy the air rights above so they can fully integrate the station into the shopping centre.
I think a lot of people will be really surprised at just how many people will use this station. Smile But they won't be waiting for very long with services every ten minutes in each direction.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Taking a very long time to get this station up and running.  At least the station is appearing on the new Rail Maps in Metro trains compartments.
  Radioman Chief Train Controller

Hello All,

i am amazed that the white walls have yet to be graffitied.

it seems to be taking a long time for what is  a very simple structure.

I suspect that the Cheltenham traders will not be happy.

best wishes and regards, Radioman
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
Being hostile to a railway connection just doesn't make sense to me... what was their reasoning for not wanting it (in London or at Chadstone)?
Shopping centre operators tend to think that railway stations attract the wrong sort of 'customers'.
LancedDendrite
Maybe they should look at Melbourne Central.
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

The idea that train stations at flash shopping centres scares away their upmarket clientele is not really the case anymore.  Lots of cashed up people with money to burn don't drive.

Put two and two together and you'll work out who they are.
  RustyRick Chief Commissioner

Location: South West Vic
Southland are getting ready. Last weekend it looked like boom gates were being installed in the parking areas.

Rick
  Daryl Junior Train Controller

Location: Carrum Downs
I recall that Westfield didn't want to pay a penny toward the construction of the station.
The delay was due to Westfield not budging.

I wonder what they will name the station, will it be called "Southland" or will it be named after a dead politician?
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

I recall that Westfield didn't want to pay a penny toward the construction of the station.
The delay was due to Westfield not budging.

I wonder what they will name the station, will it be called "Southland" or will it be named after a dead politician?
Daryl
Southland.

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