50 level crossings to be removed

 
  jdekorte Deputy Commissioner

Location: Near Caulfield Station
The LXRA is exactly that - it removes level crossings.  It does not duplicate single track sections of 4.7 kms.  It is possible that both projects could be done at the same time, but not necessarily so.  In that event, whichever is done first must make allowance for the other.

Apparenty the duplication near Rosanna is being taken as an opportunity to raise the railway over Lower Plenty road.
Myrtone
No, there's no correlation between the duplication project between Heidelberg - Rosanna & the elevating of the line at Rosanna with the level crossing removal. The fact is the line is being duplicated between Heidelberg - Rosanna which involves widening the embankment and building a new tunnel. The level crossing removal at Rosanna could have either been built rail under or rail over but the rail over solution was picked. This is a part of a combined project called the Hurstbridge Line upgrade and I believe it also includes money to investigate duplication between Greensborough - Eltham.

Sponsored advertisement

  Myrtone Chief Commissioner

Location: North Carlton, Melbourne, Victoria
But both that duplication and grade separation are being done at the same time in that location, so it seems like one is used as an opportunity to do the other.
  jdekorte Deputy Commissioner

Location: Near Caulfield Station
But both that duplication and grade separation are being done at the same time in that location, so it seems like one is used as an opportunity to do the other.
Myrtone
No, they are seperate components of the one project: http://levelcrossings.vic.gov.au/rail-projects/hurstbridge-rail-line-upgrade

Just because one component is being done is not a cause to do another project. There's a whole range of components that are being completed or initiated as part of this Hurstbridge Rail Line Upgrade project.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
Apparently the railways runs uphill and then downhill through Cave Hill station, just before Lillydale. How about a tunnel through that big hill?

No comment on the rest.
Myrtone
This has been thrashed out previously, but there is no Cave Hill station.  And the name of the station at the end of the line is Lilydale, not Lillyale.  The name confusion has also been dealt with previously.

Why on earth would you want a tunnel, when the line could be duplicated for a fraction of the cost?  The gradients are not a problem for today's EMUs, and the hill is not that big anyway.
  Myrtone Chief Commissioner

Location: North Carlton, Melbourne, Victoria
Why on earth would you want a tunnel, when the line could be duplicated for a fraction of the cost?  The gradients are not a problem for today's EMUs, and the hill is not that big anyway.
Lad_Porter

How can a tunnel be comparable to duplicating the line. You noted this:

There is a long term project for a Lilydale bypass of the Maroondah Highway.  My Melways shows it crossing the railway line near the existing Taylor Street-Melba Avenue crossing.  If this ever goes ahead, it would require a grade separation at that point.

This diagram shows the gradient and makes it look big. If the railway runs through the hill, maybe a road could go straight over it.
  TOQ-1 Deputy Commissioner

Location: Power Trainger
This diagram shows the gradient and makes it look big.
Myrtone
Because the vertical distance in those diagrams is exaggerated compared to the horizontal.

An EMU on the 4.5km section of track between those stations is not going to have a problem. Putting in a tunnel to remove what amounts to about 2km of gradients is a waste of money.

The railway is already effectively paralleled by arterial roads, so there would be no point putting another one in.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
This diagram shows the gradient and makes it look big.
Because the vertical distance in those diagrams is exaggerated compared to the horizontal.

An EMU on the 4.5km section of track between those stations is not going to have a problem. Putting in a tunnel to remove what amounts to about 2km of gradients is a waste of money.

The railway is already effectively paralleled by arterial roads, so there would be no point putting another one in.
TOQ-1
The road is a projected removal of the Maroondah Highway from the main street of Lilydale, and re-routing it around the back of the shops/CBD.  There is a lot of point in removing the through traffic on this busy highway from the main street.  If it ever happens it would also remove the Maroondah Highway from the existing level crossing, but that crossing probably would have been grade separated before this goes ahead - if it ever does.  The projected bypass is shown on Melways map 38.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
  slowcoach Locomotive Driver

http://levelcrossings.vic.gov.au/media-library/news/camp-road-boom-gates-gone-for-good

11 down, 39 to go with Camp Road, Campbellfield officially gone for good. First ever level crossing removal on the Upfield Line.
  slowcoach Locomotive Driver

http://levelcrossings.vic.gov.au/media-library/news/preliminary-designs-release-for-aviation-road-level-crossing- Looks like the railway will NOT be shifted at Aviation Road near Aircraft Station on the Werribee Line, with one of the reasons being the freight line that links Melbourne and Perth.
- Only the road will be shifted either above or below the rail line with either a new roundabout intersection or T-Section.
- No mention of whether the nearby Aircraft station needs to be demolished or upgraded in any way.
- Await further updates next year.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
Obviously the Labor Government's fault:

"The report is scathing of the performance of Victoria's public service, finding that the Department of Economic Development, Jobs, Transport and Resources has failed to give the Andrews government frank and full advice about potential problems with the project.  The finding by Mr Greaves mirrors a similarly damning assessment of how departmental staff mishandled the former Napthine government's failed East West Link project.

"The role of the public service to provide full and frank advice was not realised in this case," Mr Greaves wrote.
"[The department] should have advised the incoming government that an analysis was needed of the selected sites against the stated program objective of removing 50 of the most dangerous and congested level crossings."

In any case, some things just have to be done, regardless of their "value for money".  What if someone had said "poor value for money", and the removal program had never even been started?
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

@bevans & @Lad_Porter

Here's the video summary of the audit



https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=421&v=baZDtTGNuIU

Yes the program was political, everyone knew that, but most of the level crossings needed to get done (eg. Dandenong line). Just some were chosen in marginal areas (the Frankston line)

@slowcoach

Aircraft station is to be left the same. Just a new overpass/underpass connecting both sides.

The road layout I am not really supportive. A better option would connect the road into Williams Landing, and provide a new road underpass more closer towards Laverton station.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
http://levelcrossings.vic.gov.au/media-library/news/camp-road-boom-gates-gone-for-good

11 down, 39 to go with Camp Road, Campbellfield officially gone for good. First ever level crossing removal on the Upfield Line.
slowcoach
'First ever level crossing removal on the Upfield Line.'

Were there not several level crossings on the Upfield line removed years ago with the abolition of manual signalling and hand operated gates?
  drunkill Junior Train Controller

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Who cares, smeg is being done. 50 now, who knows how many more in a decade.

And I don't think they every stated that the 50 most dangerous level crossing would be removed, just 50 dangerous level crossings (all level crossings are dangerous to a degree) would be removed.

Non-issue really, of course there would be pork barrelling, it is politics, all infrastructure is pork barreling.
  Myrtone Chief Commissioner

Location: North Carlton, Melbourne, Victoria
Certainly prioritise level crossing removals over all other road projects. Also, level crossing removals that unlock capacity, such as Caulfield-Dandenong and maybe eventually Macauley road, Kensington, ought to be prioritised over others as well as track amplification, high capacity signalling and new rail extensions.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
http://levelcrossings.vic.gov.au/media-library/news/preliminary-designs-release-for-aviation-road-level-crossing- Looks like the railway will NOT be shifted at Aviation Road near Aircraft Station on the Werribee Line, with one of the reasons being the freight line that links Melbourne and Perth.
- Only the road will be shifted either above or below the rail line with either a new roundabout intersection or T-Section.
- No mention of whether the nearby Aircraft station needs to be demolished or upgraded in any way.
- Await further updates next year.
slowcoach
I'm sure ARTC set out a whole list of requirement of what can an what can't be done with their mainline.

I would assume that Cherry and Werribee Street crossing removals will both be a road diversion with no change to the railway.

Werribee Street crossing removal Is In question today with a claimed 4 trains a day using the crossing ! (sure It's more than that)
Though the crossing carries a high level of road traffic that Is Increasing rapidly, standard gauge trains can charge through at up to 115 km/h.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: North Haverbrook; where the monorail is king!
From https://your.levelcrossings.vic.gov.au/31370/documents/67322/download (PDF)

Why were these options ruled out?

  • Significant disruption to commuters and road users during construction
  • Rail shut down for the Standard Gauge freight line is limited to a maximum of 60 hours in any year
  • Significant impact on existing underground services, including a high pressure oil pipeline
  • Maximum gradient for freight line is 1.25 per cent resulting in a rail trench or rail bridge tying back to existing ground levels just before Laverton Station and Williams Landing Station
  • rail trench would also require high safety fences
  • A substantial amount of rock would need to be excavated during any rail shut down for a rail trench.
Level Crossing Removal Authority
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

This diagram shows the gradient and makes it look big.
Because the vertical distance in those diagrams is exaggerated compared to the horizontal.

An EMU on the 4.5km section of track between those stations is not going to have a problem. Putting in a tunnel to remove what amounts to about 2km of gradients is a waste of money.

The railway is already effectively paralleled by arterial roads, so there would be no point putting another one in.
TOQ-1
A station on top of a rise is actually beneficial for operations. Wear and tear on braking systems is reduced, and energy can be saved on departure.

Building a hugely expensive new underground station would be hard to justify for Lilydale even if it were a new build line, doing it when there is an existing station that has nothing wrong with it would be pure madness.
  Lad_Porter Chief Commissioner

Location: Yarra Glen
This diagram shows the gradient and makes it look big.
Because the vertical distance in those diagrams is exaggerated compared to the horizontal.

An EMU on the 4.5km section of track between those stations is not going to have a problem. Putting in a tunnel to remove what amounts to about 2km of gradients is a waste of money.

The railway is already effectively paralleled by arterial roads, so there would be no point putting another one in.
A station on top of a rise is actually beneficial for operations. Wear and tear on braking systems is reduced, and energy can be saved on departure.

Building a hugely expensive new underground station would be hard to justify for Lilydale even if it were a new build line, doing it when there is an existing station that has nothing wrong with it would be pure madness.
justapassenger
In the case of Lilydale, it remains to be seen exactly how the Maroondah Highway crossing will be removed, but due to the closeness of the station to the highway, it seems inevitable that a new/modified station in some form will be necessary.

As to nothing being wrong with the existing station:  the building is old, and is largely occupied by the old VRI which is locked up for most of the time:  that space could be better used.  The facilities are fine, except for the toilets, but the other day while I was waiting for a train I took a good look at the track on platform 2 (the main platform).  Around one in three/four sleepers have been replaced with concrete, but many of the remaining wooden ones are rubbish, being rotten and falling apart, or double-dogged, or both.  The track is probably OK as a low speed platform track, but there is an obvious comparison with #3 road where a recent derailment occurred.  It's hard to avoid thinking that this platform track is just being band-aided because the station will be relocated at some point in the future.
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

bevans
Wow. I would take what David Davis says with a pinch of salt. Love them or hate them the ALP did and has built new and have build new facilities for schools. In my Area Brighton and Bentleigh High schools are having major work, and I suppose the new Childrens Hospital, the Cancer Centre and Bendigo Hospital do not count as new hospitals. So I have no idea what point D Davis is making, except a pointless political one.

Of course it is easy to manage the budget when you spend zilch on infrastructure and siphon off what is meant for rail to roads. I was a fan of a Ballieu led Government, but the Liberals sent two years undermining him and replaced him with someone from the right. The Conservative right who will bang on about law and order and would not hesitate to put the hard word on a community (e.g. Somalians) to make that point.

The Coalition did nowt for Public Transport bar Transit Police (very good) and very minor upgrades.

Michael
  Adogs Chief Train Controller

As said above, David Davis' tweet should definitely be taken with a grain of salt.  Two thoughts spring to mind:

1. Most (perhaps all) of the remaining crossings will not be separated at all if the Libs win in 2018.  They know that there simply isn't a realistic alternative available to SkyRail in many locations, but they've firmly chained their wagon to NoSkyRail.  So rather than go to the expense of doing rail under, they'll just cancel it.  Maybe one or two over roads with heavy traffic (maybe e.g. Bell St) as a token gesture.

2. He's got nothing to offer in return, besides that the Libs have suggested to repurpose the LXRA but for road intersections (this btw is a terrible, terrible idea, and will create massive clover-interchange messes across the suburbs).
  Adogs Chief Train Controller

And hey...  Pretty much every major project has cost blowouts.  Overall, it's been a fairly publicly popular project, besides the noise generated by the NoSkyRailers (who aren't as numerous as the astroturfing and free HS space makes them look).
  trainbrain Deputy Commissioner

whatever you reckon, this is one thing that the goofballs in Labor have done right, ivesting in the future every gouv works on a deficit. Those that do not think so are kidding themselves..................and I do not like politics.....................
  mejhammers1 Chief Commissioner

whatever you reckon, this is one thing that the goofballs in Labor have done right, ivesting in the future every gouv works on a deficit. Those that do not think so are kidding themselves..................and I do not like politics.....................
trainbrain
Sorry Trainbrain. Fed Labor you are right there, however the State ALP since the disastrous Cain years has been as fiscally responsible as the Coalition.


Michael

Sponsored advertisement

Display from: