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  Cato56 Station Master

I don't understand your question. What was proposed was using locomotives to move EMUs stranded without power during the loss of a 25 kV feed. This is ridiculous given the 3000 class DMUs can already do this.

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  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

Edit - And why the hell would you waste money on locomotives and training drivers when there is an entire fleet of 3000 class trains that are capable of coupling with and towing EMUs?

Would this feature actually be used or would the trains split at salisbury instead? I would have thought the later if it was possible.
simstrain
It would only be used for emergency recovery, not in service. It was done on the Seaford line to sort out the mess when the Lonsdale substation failed completely..

If no Federal money is forthcoming and the Gawler line electrification stops at Salisbury for the time being, you can expect to see a new timetable with stopping services terminating at Salisbury (mostly electric) and Gawler/Central services (diesel) mostly running fast between Adelaide and Salisbury (stopping only at Mawson Lakes perhaps).
  nm39 Chief Commissioner

Location: By a road taking pictures
Edit - And why the hell would you waste money on locomotives and training drivers when there is an entire fleet of 3000 class trains that are capable of coupling with and towing EMUs?

Would this feature actually be used or would the trains split at salisbury instead? I would have thought the later if it was possible.
It would only be used for emergency recovery, not in service. It was done on the Seaford line to sort out the mess when the Lonsdale substation failed completely..

If no Federal money is forthcoming and the Gawler line electrification stops at Salisbury for the time being, you can expect to see a new timetable with stopping services terminating at Salisbury (mostly electric) and Gawler/Central services (diesel) mostly running fast between Adelaide and Salisbury (stopping only at Mawson Lakes perhaps).
justapassenger
It is currently used to ferry the 4000 class to Dry Creek for maintenance.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

I was referring to future use after the electrification of the Gawler line, when EMUs will be able to drive to (and around) the Dry Creek depot on 25kV power.

I doubt that anywhere in Australia has locos with the correct couplers and braking system to haul a modern EMU without barrier/translator wagons.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
Edit - And why the hell would you waste money on locomotives and training drivers when there is an entire fleet of 3000 class trains that are capable of coupling with and towing EMUs?

Would this feature actually be used or would the trains split at salisbury instead? I would have thought the later if it was possible.
simstrain
How will the partial electrification work?   The present layout at Salisbury isn't exactly conducive to across the platform changing of trains like Brighton, or Glanville.

Perhaps it will be a split service:  express Adelaide - Salisbury then all to Gawler (Central) by DEMU and a stopping Adelaide to Salisbury by EMU?

That doesn't meet the political promise of faster services on the Gawler line, though.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
Transperth have a DE shunter, a GE U203 from Indonesia via the Philippines for use in the Claisebrook depot.     I can't tell what type of couplers it has but it seems to be able to couple directly to the Perth EMUs and to other stock.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

That doesn't meet the political promise of faster services on the Gawler line, though.
kipioneer
It looks to me like it would.

DEMUs are timed to do Adelaide-Mawson-Salisbury in 21 minutes, against 29 minutes for all stops or 26 for skip-stop.
  patsstuffnow Junior Train Controller

Ok, While wiping off foam HAHA,

There was one incident that closed down the system entirely.

Now lets look at it realistically.

With a second feed available it is possible that the system may work, but would it be more workable if there were four inputs available?

If an event were to happen on a weekday are you suggesting that the other lines should donate railcars to tow the sparks in?

Sorry to have a different opinion to you, but it is backed by some experience. Wish you all well in your endeavours.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
That doesn't meet the political promise of faster services on the Gawler line, though.
It looks to me like it would.

DEMUs are timed to do Adelaide-Mawson-Salisbury in 21 minutes, against 29 minutes for all stops or 26 for skip-stop.
justapassenger
In the old days Salisbury to Adelaide non-stop was 20 minutes.

I remember one ARHS special from Port Pirie (where we met a NSW train) that left Port Pirie around 30 minutes late, stopped everywhere to change the electric staff, passed Salisbury on time, and arrived in Adelaide 12 minutes later.    The loco was one of the 520s.

It must have been in the early 1970s.
  normangerman Junior Train Controller

Edit - And why the hell would you waste money on locomotives and training drivers when there is an entire fleet of 3000 class trains that are capable of coupling with and towing EMUs?

Would this feature actually be used or would the trains split at salisbury instead? I would have thought the later if it was possible.
How will the partial electrification work?   The present layout at Salisbury isn't exactly conducive to across the platform changing of trains like Brighton, or Glanville.

Perhaps it will be a split service:  express Adelaide - Salisbury then all to Gawler (Central) by DEMU and a stopping Adelaide to Salisbury by EMU?

That doesn't meet the political promise of faster services on the Gawler line, though.
kipioneer
I would say that the all stops EMU will terminate at Salisbury, move into the turnback just north of the station, the express DEMU train comes in to Salisbury a few minutes later and picks up the remaining passengers. On the track to the city, the DEMU will come in, drop off the passengers requiring intermediate stations and then continue to the city express. The EMU would then move out of the turnback and start an all stop service to Adelaide. Pretty much what happens now on the Seaford/Tonsley line at Woodlands Park.
  ARG706 Chief Commissioner

Location: SA
Is there anywhere in the world besides Adelaide that has a suburban line with such inefficient operational procedures planned?

Wouldn't it be quicker to just stay on the diesel consist and continue to Gawler? Will be a nuisance when there's drunks and screaming bogans on the train arriving at Salisbury, not to mention passengers in wheelchairs etc.

Too bad if the inbound train is full (unlikely, but not impossible).
  62430 Chief Train Controller

Location: Metro Adelaide
Is there anywhere in the world besides Adelaide that has a suburban line with such inefficient operational procedures planned?

Wouldn't it be quicker to just stay on the diesel consist and continue to Gawler? Will be a nuisance when there's drunks and screaming bogans on the train arriving at Salisbury, not to mention passengers in wheelchairs etc.

Too bad if the inbound train is full (unlikely, but not impossible).
ARG706
Which proposed service pattern are you commenting on? The pattern of a stopping train serving inner stations and semi-fast serving further out stations is very common worldwide.  Are you envisaging EMUs S of Salisbury and DEMUs running only Salisbury - Gawler? What is the inefficiency you are referring to?
  ARG706 Chief Commissioner

Location: SA
All this time, I was under the assumption that electrics would stop at every station from Adelaide to Salisbury, with a transfer to diesels occurring at Salisbury, as one service.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

3012 has had one end repainted in an interpretation of the A-City red and blue livery.

I haven't seen it in daylight yet, but the impression I got from seeing it in the platform at Adelaide tonight is that it needs to be adjusted before being rolled out across more of the fleet. It has the effect of emphasising the blunt-ended nature of the 3xxx class body design and making it look slow (in complete contrast to the A-City, where the livery fits the body and combines to make it look fast even when not moving at all) plus it has funny black panels either side of the headlights that look like eyebrows.

Yellow numbers on the red section look a bit silly too.
  Halo Chief Train Controller

Pity they cant  DO those speeds until you get to brighton.
  DJPeters Assistant Commissioner

It seems that 3012 has been graffiti painted at the Dry Creek Railcar depot after they cut the fence to get in from some photos it looks to be more than one person though as one side of the car from photos has been painted from end to end and top to bottom.  Only this car was done though which seems a bit strange but as it was sort of the Adelaide Metro pet railcar in having the new livery applied you have to wonder if they did it simply because it was in that livery though?

Also a lot of night works happening with cancelling of the last train at night and using buses to Woodville this allows the concrete work to be fully completed on the Parklands dive I think as at the moment the piles are visible to passengers!
  62430 Chief Train Controller

Location: Metro Adelaide
Pity they cant  DO those speeds until you get to brighton.
Halo
Which speeds?

Last time I looked there were 110 sections Mile End - Showground and Marion - Oaklands. Also there are a number of restrictions S of Brighton eg Brighton - Marino, S of Hallett Cove Beach, N of Lonsdale, Noarlunga Centre, Onkaparinga Viaduct.
  DJPeters Assistant Commissioner

Speed on trains here you must be joking the old Red Hens used to get me to Adelaide quicker than the current railcars and that was also back in the days when the signalling etc was all done by hand. Today my ten minute trip to town can take anywhere between 15 to 20 minutes even with the new dive in place. You get into Adelaide yard only to get a red signal and then you have to wait till a platform becomes available which is usually the out going service that passes you at the stop signal. So someone years back fouled up big time in not providing enough platforms for arrivals and departures by the look of it.

There are times when you can spend a good 5 minutes stationary at a signal waiting to get in to a platform or you slowly move up one signal section at time waiting at each signal to allow you to move past it! No use having quick trips if you are going to add waiting times at Adelaide in to the trip though! This needs to be looked at and something done about it, but what could possibly be done is anyone's wild guess at the moment.
  Halo Chief Train Controller

General opoperation speed, say at least 60, some of our stations are way too close together, more appropriate for bus stops, not trains. Get the distance between Mawson and greenfields. Absolutely insane.
  DJPeters Assistant Commissioner

General opoperation speed, say at least 60, some of our stations are way too close together, more appropriate for bus stops, not trains. Get the distance between Mawson and greenfields. Absolutely insane.
Halo
True if you are fit and healthy though Halo but what if you cannot walk far or have some other impediment that stops you walking a long way. The elderly fall into this and even you, yes you will get old and decrepit one day and then you will have to walk a long way in either the stinking heat or the pouring rain. So it is best not to complain about stations being too close together, they are there and used daily by the look of it or else like some on the Belair line they would have been closed by now.

I am not saying that you are wrong in some cases though, just pointing out something that could affect you in the future.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
General opoperation speed, say at least 60, some of our stations are way too close together, more appropriate for bus stops, not trains. Get the distance between Mawson and greenfields. Absolutely insane.
Halo
Mitcham and Torrens Park are another two.

Torrens Park gets a lot of school traffic to Scotch College and probably could be skipped outside of school hours.

Greenfields came first at the southern end of that suburb and the remains of a path to the SA Institute of Technology Levels campus (now UniSA Mawson Lakes) can be seen running south from Greenfields on the eastern side of the line.

I would use this at least twice a week dodging the magpie in the solitary tree in the paddock between the railway and Cross Keys Road.    That area has changed so much I can't recognise it!
  Cato56 Station Master

General opoperation speed, say at least 60, some of our stations are way too close together, more appropriate for bus stops, not trains. Get the distance between Mawson and greenfields. Absolutely insane.
True if you are fit and healthy though Halo but what if you cannot walk far or have some other impediment that stops you walking a long way. The elderly fall into this and even you, yes you will get old and decrepit one day and then you will have to walk a long way in either the stinking heat or the pouring rain. So it is best not to complain about stations being too close together, they are there and used daily by the look of it or else like some on the Belair line they would have been closed by now.

I am not saying that you are wrong in some cases though, just pointing out something that could affect you in the future.
DJPeters

Stations aren't kept open because of reasonable patronage numbers or whether or not it makes sense to have them so closely together, they're kept open because the one person a day who uses the station will kick up an absolute stink in the media and the politicians aren't willing to wear that to rationalise the network.

If you want stops that close together put in a tram line. Heavy rail should not be operating with such closely spaced stops.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

Torrens Park gets a lot of school traffic to Scotch College and probably could be skipped outside of school hours.
kipioneer
Or we need to find a way to make certain stops on the Belair line request only - specifically thinking of Millswood, Torrens Park, Pinera.

If it works there, apply it to certain other stops like Marino Rocks, Albert Park, Kudla and so on.

Greenfields came first at the southern end of that suburb and the remains of a path to the SA Institute of Technology Levels campus (now UniSA Mawson Lakes) can be seen running south from Greenfields on the eastern side of the line.

I would use this at least twice a week dodging the magpie in the solitary tree in the paddock between the railway and Cross Keys Road.    That area has changed so much I can't recognise it!
kipioneer
The little path out of Greenfields station on the eastern side is still there.

I used it with my bike a couple of months ago when I was on the way home from dropping some work off to a client in Mawson Lakes, as a method of ensuring a seat on the train before the hordes boarded at Mawson Interchange!

The path it joins on the opposite side of the drainage channel runs all the way north to Kings Road, and the full length was recently resurfaced with nice smooth hotmix. This path will become part of the Gawler Greenway if the government ever commits to extending it north of Regency Road.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park

Greenfields came first at the southern end of that suburb and the remains of a path to the SA Institute of Technology Levels campus (now UniSA Mawson Lakes) can be seen running south from Greenfields on the eastern side of the line.

I would use this at least twice a week dodging the magpie in the solitary tree in the paddock between the railway and Cross Keys Road.    That area has changed so much I can't recognise it!
The little path out of Greenfields station on the eastern side is still there.

I used it with my bike a couple of months ago when I was on the way home from dropping some work off to a client in Mawson Lakes, as a method of ensuring a seat on the train before the hordes boarded at Mawson Interchange!

The path it joins on the opposite side of the drainage channel runs all the way north to Kings Road, and the full length was recently resurfaced with nice smooth hotmix. This path will become part of the Gawler Greenway if the government ever commits to extending it north of Regency Road.
justapassenger
Glad to hear that.

It was about a 10 minute walk as I recall and another 5 minutes to the southern end of the campus.

That paddock is now a car park and town centre, and Cross Keys Road has been truncated to its southern extremity.

When I was part of the SAIT Union way back we agitated for a rear gate out on Cross Keys Road and many was the time I would be held up by a mob of sheep on Cross Keys Road on my way back to the city.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
There's not much excavation remaining to be done on the South Road project - I had a glimpse today and it looks like they have finished reinforcing the walls and doing drainage conduits, appears as though bitumen will not be far away. When was the opening projected ?

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