2018 State Election / Transport

 
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

Observers more astute than I on Twitter have realised that the demand modelling maps in the SRL strategic appraisal document include Metro 2 along its full length from Newport to Clifton Hill.

This is not over yet, folks. We have another massive announcement almost certainly inbound.

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  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Bring it on I say. The more the merrier.
  Maximas Station Master

Location: Geelong
This whole thing needs to be backed with some pretty serious investment in jobs going to these 'employment precincts' that this rail is meant to serve.

This announcement sets up the libs to run a campaign based on decentralising Victoria and pledging some regional investment, not holding my breath though
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

What is the SRL document  ?  Link please ?
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
What is the SRL document  ?  Link please ?
kuldalai
Suburban Rail Loop, more info over at https://www.railpage.com.au/f-t11398258.htm

https://bigbuild.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0006/325572/Suburban-Rail-Loop-Strategic-Assessment.pdf

BG
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Talking through this announcement yesterday with you guys and thinking about this overnight, I now wonder how the Coalition are going to win this election in November.   The Suburban Loop has been so widely accepted by all including die hard car users.

I for one cannot see how all the infrastructure works under the ALP can be matched by the coalition and how Guy can get a look in remembering he is all about 1960's investment in freeways.

I also think the events in Canberra over the past week will have a major impact on how people vote in the state election later this year.  Several Federal and state seats will fall from the libs over the next 9 months.
  Inland_Sailor Junior Train Controller

Talking through this announcement yesterday with you guys and thinking about this overnight, I now wonder how the Coalition are going to win this election in November.   The Suburban Loop has been so widely accepted by all including die hard car users.

I for one cannot see how all the infrastructure works under the ALP can be matched by the coalition and how Guy can get a look in remembering he is all about 1960's investment in freeways.

I also think the events in Canberra over the past week will have a major impact on how people vote in the state election later this year.  Several Federal and state seats will fall from the libs over the next 9 months.
bevans
I think that your pretty close to the mark here. Stability is an important factor for many voters and Dan seems to deliver that in spades, as well as getting on and delivering what he's promised. Something that was absent during the previous Governments term!
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

Talking through this announcement yesterday with you guys and thinking about this overnight, I now wonder how the Coalition are going to win this election in November.   The Suburban Loop has been so widely accepted by all including die hard car users.
bevans
I think you're spot on here bevans. My faith was injured slightly though this morning when I saw the front page of the Herald Sun, which naturally neglected to mention the single biggest infrastructure promise ever made by a Victorian politician. Looks like Rupert will be pulling out all the stops for November.

The Age, naturally, led with the main story and a healthy dose of skepticism, and did a three page spread on the inside.
  ParkesHub Chief Commissioner

I think Guy and David Davis will do the obfuscation process, they won't try to match it. O'Brien (the East-West Link side letter author) was on 7 News last night stating it was a $100b project starting in 2050. Really?

Liberal party ideology is all about small Gov't. OK, that's what they believe in. But small Gov't means that projects of this magnitude (or indeed many other projects) never get off the ground in order to meet the ideological constraints. One exception was Rupert Hamer.
  gippslander Chief Commissioner

Location: Central Gippsland, Vic
---- The Gippsland line timetables should be restructured into the future so at least half of all trains run express Drouin-Pakenham, there should be local trains originating at Warragul to service those fairly thin rail users.   Someone from Traralgon shouldn't have to stop at Tynong where a handful of people get on. Contrast that to the Ballarat & Bendigo corridors where the micro stops have long been abolished.
Add to that sentiment Gippslander:

- Trains originating at Traralgon to pick-up to Warragul, then express to Dandenong (or something like that).
- Trains originate from Warragul to serve Warragul to Pakenham.
- Set up Garfield as a true major station.  Look at closing Tynong(go to Garfield), Nar Nar Goon (go to Pakenham) and Bunyip (go to Garfield) - seriously, they are not that far apart only 4km to 5km with a good direct road between them.
- Given the Cranbourne/Pakenham mix of traffic, set up the Metro area so each serves every second station - like the do on the Armidale line in Perth.
- sort out Pakenham, which is likely fixed with the opening of the return loop in the maintenance facility, to prevent turn back trains occupying one platform.

The above is suggested on the basis of better utilising what we already have.
skitz
I agree with all your observations Skitz!
You really wonder why Latrobe Valley passengers have to put up with a stopping all stations service between very closely spaced, tiny settlements. From what I see the pax numbers are absolutely minimal. Garfield should be much better used, but the north carpark always seems to be nearly empty.
  gippslander Chief Commissioner

Location: Central Gippsland, Vic

The Age, naturally, led with the main story and a healthy dose of skepticism, and did a three page spread on the inside.
potatoinmymouth
The Herald Sun is a hardly a balanced journal of record anymore. Expect Murdoch to push for a freeway led infrastructure program.
  skitz Chief Commissioner

---- The Gippsland line timetables should be restructured into the future so at least half of all trains run express Drouin-Pakenham, there should be local trains originating at Warragul to service those fairly thin rail users.   Someone from Traralgon shouldn't have to stop at Tynong where a handful of people get on. Contrast that to the Ballarat & Bendigo corridors where the micro stops have long been abolished.
Add to that sentiment Gippslander:

- Trains originating at Traralgon to pick-up to Warragul, then express to Dandenong (or something like that).
- Trains originate from Warragul to serve Warragul to Pakenham.
- Set up Garfield as a true major station.  Look at closing Tynong(go to Garfield), Nar Nar Goon (go to Pakenham) and Bunyip (go to Garfield) - seriously, they are not that far apart only 4km to 5km with a good direct road between them.
- Given the Cranbourne/Pakenham mix of traffic, set up the Metro area so each serves every second station - like the do on the Armidale line in Perth.
- sort out Pakenham, which is likely fixed with the opening of the return loop in the maintenance facility, to prevent turn back trains occupying one platform.

The above is suggested on the basis of better utilising what we already have.
I agree with all your observations Skitz!
You really wonder why Latrobe Valley passengers have to put up with a stopping all stations service between very closely spaced, tiny settlements. From what I see the pax numbers are absolutely minimal. Garfield should be much better used, but the north carpark always seems to be nearly empty.
gippslander
Add to the list all Gippsland trains using the Caulfield Loop, straight in, straight out with no West Richmond conflicts.
  ianb26 Station Master

---- The Gippsland line timetables should be restructured into the future so at least half of all trains run express Drouin-Pakenham, there should be local trains originating at Warragul to service those fairly thin rail users.   Someone from Traralgon shouldn't have to stop at Tynong where a handful of people get on. Contrast that to the Ballarat & Bendigo corridors where the micro stops have long been abolished.
Add to that sentiment Gippslander:

- Trains originating at Traralgon to pick-up to Warragul, then express to Dandenong (or something like that).
- Trains originate from Warragul to serve Warragul to Pakenham.
- Set up Garfield as a true major station.  Look at closing Tynong(go to Garfield), Nar Nar Goon (go to Pakenham) and Bunyip (go to Garfield) - seriously, they are not that far apart only 4km to 5km with a good direct road between them.
- Given the Cranbourne/Pakenham mix of traffic, set up the Metro area so each serves every second station - like the do on the Armidale line in Perth.
- sort out Pakenham, which is likely fixed with the opening of the return loop in the maintenance facility, to prevent turn back trains occupying one platform.

The above is suggested on the basis of better utilising what we already have.
I agree with all your observations Skitz!
You really wonder why Latrobe Valley passengers have to put up with a stopping all stations service between very closely spaced, tiny settlements. From what I see the pax numbers are absolutely minimal. Garfield should be much better used, but the north carpark always seems to be nearly empty.
Add to the list all Gippsland trains using the Caulfield Loop, straight in, straight out with no West Richmond conflicts.
skitz
What about the fumes in the loop with the VLs. It's bad enough at Spencer Street Station. SORRY to all the modernists out there but I refuse to use the name of Southern Cross. Razz
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
I think Guy and David Davis will do the obfuscation process, they won't try to match it. O'Brien (the East-West Link side letter author) was on 7 News last night stating it was a $100b project starting in 2050. Really?

Liberal party ideology is all about small Gov't. OK, that's what they believe in. But small Gov't means that projects of this magnitude (or indeed many other projects) never get off the ground in order to meet the ideological constraints. One exception was Rupert Hamer.
ParkesHub

I'm certain the City Loop was born under the long standing Bolte Liberal government. Then Sir Henry retired and handed the reins to Sir Rupert....along with a decision reversal on abolishing the entire tram network...imagine ANY thought of that 40 years later Question

...and the 'New Deal' for country travellers, the N cars and the Comeng suburban cars was also under the Hamer Liberal government.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Deal_(railway)

Mike.
  skitz Chief Commissioner

---- The Gippsland line timetables should be restructured into the future so at least half of all trains run express Drouin-Pakenham, there should be local trains originating at Warragul to service those fairly thin rail users.   Someone from Traralgon shouldn't have to stop at Tynong where a handful of people get on. Contrast that to the Ballarat & Bendigo corridors where the micro stops have long been abolished.
Add to that sentiment Gippslander:

- Trains originating at Traralgon to pick-up to Warragul, then express to Dandenong (or something like that).
- Trains originate from Warragul to serve Warragul to Pakenham.
- Set up Garfield as a true major station.  Look at closing Tynong(go to Garfield), Nar Nar Goon (go to Pakenham) and Bunyip (go to Garfield) - seriously, they are not that far apart only 4km to 5km with a good direct road between them.
- Given the Cranbourne/Pakenham mix of traffic, set up the Metro area so each serves every second station - like the do on the Armidale line in Perth.
- sort out Pakenham, which is likely fixed with the opening of the return loop in the maintenance facility, to prevent turn back trains occupying one platform.

The above is suggested on the basis of better utilising what we already have.
I agree with all your observations Skitz!
You really wonder why Latrobe Valley passengers have to put up with a stopping all stations service between very closely spaced, tiny settlements. From what I see the pax numbers are absolutely minimal. Garfield should be much better used, but the north carpark always seems to be nearly empty.
Add to the list all Gippsland trains using the Caulfield Loop, straight in, straight out with no West Richmond conflicts.
What about the fumes in the loop with the VLs. It's bad enough at Spencer Street Station. SORRY to all the modernists out there but I refuse to use the name of Southern Cross. Razz
ianb26
They have ventilation fans.  Diesel engines underground is nothing new or insurmountable.  Kind of like extraction fans at Spencer Street
  justarider Assistant Commissioner

Location: Stuck on VR and hoping for better.
what about the fumes in the loop with the VLs. It's bad enough at Spencer Street Station. SORRY to all the modernists out there but I refuse to use the name of Southern Cross. Razz
They have ventilation fans.  Diesel engines underground is nothing new or insurmountable.  Kind of like extraction fans at Spencer Street
skitz
see other thread. Diesel in loop is real.
https://www.railpage.com.au/f-p2115106.htm
  gippslander Chief Commissioner

Location: Central Gippsland, Vic
I'm certain the City Loop was born under the long standing Bolte Liberal government. Then Sir Henry retired and handed the reins to Sir Rupert....along with a decision reversal on abolishing the entire tram network...imagine ANY thought of that 40 years later Question

...and the 'New Deal' for country travellers, the N cars and the Comeng suburban cars was also under the Hamer Liberal government.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Deal_(railway)

Mike.
The Vinelander
I'm pretty certain the concept of a city loop was first conceived about 1929, but it was not until the mid 1950s that it was seriously pursued. There were LNP & ALP Governments throughout the period.
But there is no doubt at all that was the Bolte Liberal Government that finally set up the Melbourne Underground Railway Loop Authority and got it going. That was in the days when we had railways in Victoria - now the youthful journos of the media have christened them as 'train lines' and ''train stations', and these titles now seem to be the new norm. What would Bolte have thought of that?
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
The Herald Sun is a hardly a balanced journal of record anymore.
gippslander

Was it ever Question
  gippslander Chief Commissioner

Location: Central Gippsland, Vic
The former Sun News-Pictorial seemed to be a little more balanced to me, growing up in the early 70s.
Unfortunately, the Murdoch Hun seems to be more of a Mugabe one party state journal.
And they don’t understand rail - just build the East West Link and all will be fine.
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

That was in the days when we had railways in Victoria - now the youthful journos of the media have christened them as 'train lines' and ''train stations', and these titles now seem to be the new norm.
gippslander


Apart from:
  • Rail Projects Victoria
  • Mernda Rail
  • Skyrail
  • Suburban Rail Loop
  • Regional Rail Link
  • Murray Basin Rail Project


I could go on...
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
The scandals involving use of public money for the election of Daniel Andrews is not over meaning voters are still not convinced the ALP are trustworthy. Daniel maybe voted out rather than the libs being voted in.
  drunkill Junior Train Controller

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Fair enough bevans, was just having a laugh really. But it is a genuine fear that the SRL could suck up so much funding nothing else is done on existing infrastructure for 35 years.
potatoinmymouth
Not really, $1.5bn per year for 30 years = $45bn which should cover the project. A little bit frontloaded in 2020-2023 or so to get the project underway.

Plenty of space in the budget left over for other projects, especially as the city grows to 8 million by 2045-2050 when the entire project will be finished, thus (hopefully) commanding more federal funding which Victoria has missed out on for the past decade vs NSW and QLD.
  John.Z Chief Train Controller

Fair enough bevans, was just having a laugh really. But it is a genuine fear that the SRL could suck up so much funding nothing else is done on existing infrastructure for 35 years.
Not really, $1.5bn per year for 30 years = $45bn which should cover the project. A little bit frontloaded in 2020-2023 or so to get the project underway.

Plenty of space in the budget left over for other projects, especially as the city grows to 8 million by 2045-2050 when the entire project will be finished, thus (hopefully) commanding more federal funding which Victoria has missed out on for the past decade vs NSW and QLD.
drunkill
This project could be a good one for ScoMo to buy some victorian sandbelt seats. VicLab should try and get both sides of Fed politics to pitch in a fair bit for a "city building" project.
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Now the Coalition Libs/Nats have a plan which they pushed again today.

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