Great Southern Rail to launch Adelaide-Brisbane service

 
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Just out of interest, what would be the longest SG train that Southern Cross Station could handle?
mikesyd

Back in the 1990's when the footy finals were in Melbourne and there was an Adelaide team in the final, possibly the Grand Final, the (overnight) Overland has been up to 30+ cars long and it had to arrive twice.

That is, the train was split in the yard before arriving and the front portion arrived on Platform 2 and the rear portion on Platform 1.

However Platform 1 isn't as long these days so if the same thing were to occur again, I imagine around 22 cars would be about the limit.

Mike.

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  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Just out of interest, what would be the longest SG train that Southern Cross Station could handle?

Back in the 1990's when the footy finals were in Melbourne and there was an Adelaide team in the final, possibly the Grand Final, the (overnight) Overland has been up to 30+ cars long and it had to arrive twice.

That is, the train was split in the yard before arriving and the front portion arrived on Platform 2 and the rear portion on Platform 1.

However Platform 1 isn't as long these days so if the same thing were to occur again, I imagine around 22 cars would be about the limit.

Mike.
The Vinelander
Dividing (or amalgamating) a passenger train! What will the OH&S fairies have to say? Are we not currently able to even divide/attach two railcars/sets these days with passengers aboard. It's much more fun to tip everyone out to stand in the rain for 20 minutes or so.
  ParkesHub Chief Commissioner

Just out of interest, what would be the longest SG train that Southern Cross Station could handle?

Back in the 1990's when the footy finals were in Melbourne and there was an Adelaide team in the final, possibly the Grand Final, the (overnight) Overland has been up to 30+ cars long and it had to arrive twice.

That is, the train was split in the yard before arriving and the front portion arrived on Platform 2 and the rear portion on Platform 1.

However Platform 1 isn't as long these days so if the same thing were to occur again, I imagine around 22 cars would be about the limit.

Mike.
Dividing (or amalgamating) a passenger train! What will the OH&S fairies have to say? Are we not currently able to even divide/attach two railcars/sets these days with passengers aboard. It's much more fun to tip everyone out to stand in the rain for 20 minutes or so.
YM-Mundrabilla
It was obviously OK back then. Nowadays, there'd be apoplectic fits all round.
  ParkesHub Chief Commissioner

http://www.traveller.com.au/great-southern-train-from-adelaide-to-brisbane-australias-new-luxury-train-unveiled-h188z7
Couple of points of interest

  • Ghan/IP occupancy is running at 90%
  • Total GSR patronage up 30% in five years
  • “National Rail Freight Corporation”(!)
potatoinmymouth
You'd think there would be a 'sweet spot' of occupancy and/or train length. They did say in the article that Platinum is booked out 9 months ahead. You'd have to wonder if they might run extra carriages or additional services to keep the bookings, say, 4-6 months in advance. For me, I could afford to do Platinum but I couldn't plan 9 months ahead realistically.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

How many cars would be platformed for the train stopping at Broadmeadows?

Providing transfers to/from a stop in the suburbs might be better for GSR than having the train battle all the way in to Southern Cross, only to have to faff about with turning it around and go straight out again.

Nice convenient spot for offering complimentary transfers to/from the airport too. Remember that modern GSR doesn't need to pick any side in a rail vs air vs road vs sea 'fight' because they are part of a holiday company, not a train company.

Or you're trying to tap into the potential market for Ghan passengers continuing on elsewhere....
After spending 2 plus days on a train, the last thing I'd be interested in would be boarding another.
michaelgm
There's also the fact that there won't be a "connecting" Ghan service, as the Great Southern will be running in December and January in place of the Ghan.

GSR know their market too well to worry about connections between their trains.
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

Dividing (or amalgamating) a passenger train! What will the OH&S fairies have to say? Are we not currently able to even divide/attach two railcars/sets these days with passengers aboard. It's much more fun to tip everyone out to stand in the rain for 20 minutes or so.
YM-Mundrabilla

In fairness, quite a bit of attaching and detaching occurs at Ballarat with Ararat and Maryborough services, all of which happen with passengers comfortably seated.

Does this happen anywhere else? What about at loco-hauled terminii? Can the punters get on before the loco runs around?
  tazzer96 Deputy Commissioner

The people who catch luxury trains do not want to go anywhere near a place like broadmeadows.
  tazzer96 Deputy Commissioner

Dividing (or amalgamating) a passenger train! What will the OH&S fairies have to say? Are we not currently able to even divide/attach two railcars/sets these days with passengers aboard. It's much more fun to tip everyone out to stand in the rain for 20 minutes or so.

In fairness, quite a bit of attaching and detaching occurs at Ballarat with Ararat and Maryborough services, all of which happen with passengers comfortably seated.

Does this happen anywhere else? What about at loco-hauled terminii? Can the punters get on before the loco runs around?
potatoinmymouth
I thought passengers weren't allowed to be on the parked train when attaching.
  GS4 Train Controller

Lots of interesting hypothesis here ...............

but


I rode on the Indian Pacific a few years ago and had the chance to discuss GSR's train offerings with the train manager on that journey.

Yes they do remember the Southern Spirit.  It was hoped to be a continual service but it ended up not working out that way.  No matter as they were running short of coaches for the IP and Ghan so they deleted the Southern Spirit.  
I asked if it had a future.  The answer was the company would do reviews of all services and should demand show a Brisbane - Adelaide train was needed it may be restarted , , according to need.

Given the number of repeat passengers on the IP that I met, it could mean the Southern Spirit runs again for people who are willing to spend on a train journey but don't want to go for a third or fourth journey on the IP or Ghan. They may want to see something different.


But .....

there's always another "but"


I rang GSR on the day this thread was posted and asked them if there was any Brisbane - Adelaide train services available or being contemplated any time is the next couple of years.

As far as their booking call center was aware the will be no Brisbane to Adelaide any time soon.  So my positive side hopes the call center operator has not been advised of a new service , I will book for 2 if it becomes available.
My negative side says we were all lead on a wild goose chase.

Wait and see .............
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Cressy, yes this bustling metropolis would benefit from a train station https://goo.gl/maps/iRcFWkojAiB2
ab123
Even the bloody pub's closed!

BG
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

I rang GSR on the day this thread was posted and asked them if there was any Brisbane - Adelaide train services available or being contemplated any time is the next couple of years.

As far as their booking call center was aware the will be no Brisbane to Adelaide any time soon.  So my positive side hopes the call center operator has not been advised of a new service , I will book for 2 if it becomes available.
My negative side says we were all lead on a wild goose chase.

Wait and see .............
GS4
That's the only answer the staff can give until it has been officially announced. I believe they still use an external company for bookings, so there's every possibility that the staff there are yet to be briefed on it.

Anyway, Traveller confirmed the InDaily report with their own story on it today which includes quotes from Journey Beyond (current operator of GSR) CEO Chris Tallent and supplied images.

Four days and three nights for the southbound version would appear to suggest the Twelve Apostles trip will be a full day, ahead of an overnight run to Adelaide.
  trainguy84 Junior Train Controller

Hi

It must be going ahead, there are details on it on the GSR website.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Dividing (or amalgamating) a passenger train! What will the OH&S fairies have to say? Are we not currently able to even divide/attach two railcars/sets these days with passengers aboard. It's much more fun to tip everyone out to stand in the rain for 20 minutes or so.

In fairness, quite a bit of attaching and detaching occurs at Ballarat with Ararat and Maryborough services, all of which happen with passengers comfortably seated.

Does this happen anywhere else? What about at loco-hauled terminii? Can the punters get on before the loco runs around?
potatoinmymouth
Is Ballarat the exception rather than the rule, perhaps?
In my very limited experience it was 'everyone out' but they might have got the message since. Possibly different because of the steep grades approaching Spencer Street (Ingliston etc ........... Very Happy). Or were the fairies just active that day?
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
The people who catch luxury trains do not want to go anywhere near a place like broadmeadows.
tazzer96
Could get the train painted as an added attraction whilst the passengers detrained (or is it deboarded these days?) .
  potatoinmymouth Chief Commissioner

Dividing (or amalgamating) a passenger train! What will the OH&S fairies have to say? Are we not currently able to even divide/attach two railcars/sets these days with passengers aboard. It's much more fun to tip everyone out to stand in the rain for 20 minutes or so.

In fairness, quite a bit of attaching and detaching occurs at Ballarat with Ararat and Maryborough services, all of which happen with passengers comfortably seated.

Does this happen anywhere else? What about at loco-hauled terminii? Can the punters get on before the loco runs around?
Is Ballarat the exception rather than the rule, perhaps?
In my very limited experience it was 'everyone out' but they might have got the message since. Possibly different because of the steep grades approaching Spencer Street (Ingliston etc ........... Very Happy). Or were the fairies just active that day?
YM-Mundrabilla
I have been on a down Maryborough and an up Ararat at the point of attachment/detachment, and haven't been booted. That's all I've got, though. Someone with more knowledge might need to enlighten us.
  LancedDendrite Chief Commissioner

Location: Gheringhap Loop Autonomous Zone
The people who catch luxury trains do not want to go anywhere near a place like broadmeadows.
Could get the train painted as an added attraction whilst the passengers detrained (or is it deboarded these days?) .
YM-Mundrabilla
I believe the verb used these days for getting luxury train passengers to disembark is 'decanted'.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
The people who catch luxury trains do not want to go anywhere near a place like broadmeadows.
Could get the train painted as an added attraction whilst the passengers detrained (or is it deboarded these days?) .
I believe the verb used these days for getting luxury train passengers to disembark is 'decanted'.
LancedDendrite
I think you'll find that is only when one is travelling on the Indian Pacific and has taken the Barossa Off Train Excursion option.

BG
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
The people who catch luxury trains do not want to go anywhere near a place like broadmeadows.
Could get the train painted as an added attraction whilst the passengers detrained (or is it deboarded these days?) .
I believe the verb used these days for getting luxury train passengers to disembark is 'decanted'.
LancedDendrite
Thanks LD that has done wonders for my English language skills. Rolling Eyes
'Decanted'! Too long on the job to need decanting ..... (just got on or off)!
That must be why I haven't been on the IP or the Ghan (in GSR days anyway). No pass anymore and being a miserable bastard ................... Smile
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
I have been on a down Maryborough and an up Ararat at the point of attachment/detachment, and haven't been booted. That's all I've got, though. Someone with more knowledge might need to enlighten us.
potatoinmymouth
I have posted about this before but one morning a few years ago I caught the Up Echuca which begins it's day as a 3 car V/Locity and then couples up to another 3 car set at Bendigo. We were forced to de-train for that one.

Then last year (I think it was) I was on an Up Bendigo V/Locity service which was severely delayed due to a trespasser on the track near Riddells Creek The service behind us caught up and was stopped in the preceeding section so V/Line decided to couple the 2 3-car sets to form one train. So on a near 40 degree day all pax were forced to get off and stand in the scorching sun for 20+ minutes while the second train was brought into the platform. It then stopped short of the first set so that it's passengers could get some sun too. Then after an eternity of effing about the 2 sets were joined and we were allowed to get back on.

To say that there were some hot, bothered and unhappy pax that day would be an understatement.

BG
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
I have been on a down Maryborough and an up Ararat at the point of attachment/detachment, and haven't been booted. That's all I've got, though. Someone with more knowledge might need to enlighten us.
I have posted about this before but one morning a few years ago I caught the Up Echuca which begins it's day as a 3 car V/Locity and then couples up to another 3 car set at Bendigo. We were forced to de-train for that one.

Then last year (I think it was) I was on an Up Bendigo V/Locity service which was severely delayed due to a trespasser on the track near Riddells Creek The service behind us caught up and was stopped in the preceeding section so V/Line decided to couple the 2 3-car sets to form one train. So on a near 40 degree day all pax were forced to get off and stand in the scorching sun for 20+ minutes while the second train was brought into the platform. It then stopped short of the first set so that it's passengers could get some sun too. Then after an eternity of effing about the 2 sets were joined and we were allowed to get back on.

To say that there were some hot, bothered and unhappy pax that day would be an understatement.

BG
BrentonGolding
Ah yes but just think how happy the OH&S fairies would have been.Rolling Eyes
There is a KPI for inconvenience and discomfort to be gained.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
The people who catch luxury trains do not want to go anywhere near a place like broadmeadows.
Could get the train painted as an added attraction whilst the passengers detrained (or is it deboarded these days?) .
I believe the verb used these days for getting luxury train passengers to disembark is 'decanted'.
LancedDendrite

Being decanted like oxygenating a red wine or a vintage port...

Possibly the passengers, in various states of alcohol induced numbness, for want of anything else to do to wile away the travelling hours may feel they are being decanted from the train to the platform then to the bus.

Mike.
  Brianr Assistant Commissioner

Location: Dunedin, New Zealand
That is ridiculous
In August I travelled on the Caledonian Express from Euston, London to Fort William. In the evening i walked through 5 carriages to the Dining car for dinner.  In the morning I discovered there was a different dining car right next to my sleeping car serving breakfast.  During the night I knew we were stopped for long periods of time but never felt any jolt. The train divides into three after entering Scotland, not sure whether at Edinburgh or Glasgow and extra dining cars are added. On the return journey they are combined. Thankfully the passengers are undisturbed.
  ngarner Assistant Commissioner

Location: Seville
Imagine the absolute horror that the people who enforce these rules would have if they found out about how the English rail companies used to slip carriages on the run and a guard would control their stop at the platform while the train continued on with little slacking of speed. Full blown heart attack anyone?

I know that in the 1980's the name trains (Aurora, SOP, ICD, Overdue (sorry Overland), Vinelander) had a loco dropped on before the passengers were allowed on board. Did that numerous times myself, for country or big wheel crews to walk up in time to settle in and depart, but can't remember if it was also the case for the run on the mill ones or not. I have a feeling that it was not the case so a hard 'ease up' onto the train would shake up any passengers already on board. Maybe that's the origin of no-one on board during coupling up operations; too many complaints from a mis-judged 'ease up', but uncoupling should never be rough enough to cause any discomfort.

Neil
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
For over 100 years locos have been attached to trains at Spencer Street after passengers have boarded. It was standard practice.

Engines were changed at Serviceton and Albury on interstate services for a similar period plus Ararat in the steam days.

With the progress achieved since we would have all passengers including sleeping car passengers out on the platform* freezing their knickers off at 0200 while the two S classes came off at Serviceton to be replaced by two 900s.

* well some of them as the platform was not long enough for the whole train but the fairies were not around in those days. Rolling Eyes
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
Probably worth noting that the Indian Pacific is split over two platforms at Central Station in Sydney...

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