The Transport heritage NSW website has not made any updates about anything since it passed it's boiler test (September 6)As an old saying goes.. "No news is good news."
Does anyone know what is happening with it or has something gone wrong again
The Transport heritage NSW website has not made any updates about anything since it passed it's boiler test (September 6)The project is going through that "Oh, I just discovered yet another problem, are we going to let this thing go back out like this or are we going to fix it now?" stage.
Does anyone know what is happening with it or has something gone wrong again
Thanks for the information, a shame it's taken so long (all credit for that to Dampflokwerk Meiningen)The Transport heritage NSW website has not made any updates about anything since it passed it's boiler test (September 6)The project is going through that "Oh, I just discovered yet another problem, are we going to let this thing go back out like this or are we going to fix it now?" stage.
Does anyone know what is happening with it or has something gone wrong again
Of the ones I've seen as of 2 weeks ago, this included issues with the cab floor, the tender and some steam pipes in the smoke box end of non standard size that had to be manufactured from scratch.
I'm sure you'll see it on the THNSW news soon.
Plans are for it to be moving up and down the yard under its own power in a few more weeks. On track trials before Christmas.
Thanks for the information, a shame it's taken so long (all credit for that to Dampflokwerk Meiningen)Peter, a spot post. Like many others I was agast at the new boiler being not dimensionally correct when the news went out, even to the point where I had earlier stated that China could have built the boiler for a lot less, likewise its a lot closer to get to China for inspections then Germany. At the time, China still had two shops capable of building the new boilers, I doubt if that would be the case now.
While it is convenient to blame the Germans, the mistakes and delays were all locally generated.
Meiningen tendered to design and build a boiler. They were provided with drawings of the 38 class boiler.
Meiningen submitted their drawings to Australia for approval AND THEY WERE APPROVED IN AUSTRALIA.
The boiler was built to the approved design and on arrival was found not to fit.
So who checked the drawing in Australia and why did they not notice that the dimensions were wrong?
Then the boiler was sent back to Germany in the ill founded expectation that it would be corrected or a new boiler supplied.
However, the Germans pointed out that they had built exactly what was agreed, even if it wasn't what was wanted.
Almost all of the delay occurred after the first boiler was delivered.
Some of this was due to efforts to shift the blame and to conceal the fact that the money had been wasted.
Meiningen built the boiler for "Tornado" and it is expected that an exact copy will be built for "Prince of Wales".
But Tornado's boiler was built to drawings prepared by the society building it.
These were carefully checked against the original A1 boiler drawings.
Nobody checked the proposed Meiningen 38 class boiler drawings against the original 38 boiler drawings or if they did so failed to note the discrepancies. Had the differences been corrected, the Meiningen boiler would have been in use for most of the "delay" period.
Peter
IIRC China still has the capacity to manufacture parts for locos, they still do so for the SY's, JS's and what ever the NG Russian copies that are still running about.Thanks for the information, a shame it's taken so long (all credit for that to Dampflokwerk Meiningen)Peter, a spot post. Like many others I was agast at the new boiler being not dimensionally correct when the news went out, even to the point where I had earlier stated that China could have built the boiler for a lot less, likewise its a lot closer to get to China for inspections then Germany. At the time, China still had two shops capable of building the new boilers, I doubt if that would be the case now.
While it is convenient to blame the Germans, the mistakes and delays were all locally generated.
Meiningen tendered to design and build a boiler. They were provided with drawings of the 38 class boiler.
Meiningen submitted their drawings to Australia for approval AND THEY WERE APPROVED IN AUSTRALIA.
The boiler was built to the approved design and on arrival was found not to fit.
So who checked the drawing in Australia and why did they not notice that the dimensions were wrong?
Then the boiler was sent back to Germany in the ill founded expectation that it would be corrected or a new boiler supplied.
However, the Germans pointed out that they had built exactly what was agreed, even if it wasn't what was wanted.
Almost all of the delay occurred after the first boiler was delivered.
Some of this was due to efforts to shift the blame and to conceal the fact that the money had been wasted.
Meiningen built the boiler for "Tornado" and it is expected that an exact copy will be built for "Prince of Wales".
But Tornado's boiler was built to drawings prepared by the society building it.
These were carefully checked against the original A1 boiler drawings.
Nobody checked the proposed Meiningen 38 class boiler drawings against the original 38 boiler drawings or if they did so failed to note the discrepancies. Had the differences been corrected, the Meiningen boiler would have been in use for most of the "delay" period.
Peter
As time has passed your post really illuminates the inefficiency of the people in charge of the project, hopefully they have learnt from this sad and sorry episode and maybe even look locally if new boilers are needed for any of the fleet, in saying that I am assuming the people who built the new boiler for 3265 would be able to still do similar works and even for larger boilers.
Certainly the company at Glbn should also be part of a local consortium that can provide efficient boilers and who knows what else they could do.
Not sure outside of Sandaolong which is JS only operated and do their own repairs who else does steam parts, the only other place that may do things is the old Sujiatun works that stopped overhauls and manufacturing but had several flying teams that were able to go to locations that had some steam in service, such as Yakeshi. This was the result of CNR in most districts banning the movement of steam on their main lines.IIRC China still has the capacity to manufacture parts for locos, they still do so for the SY's, JS's and what ever the NG Russian copies that are still running about.Thanks for the information, a shame it's taken so long (all credit for that to Dampflokwerk Meiningen)Peter, a spot post. Like many others I was agast at the new boiler being not dimensionally correct when the news went out, even to the point where I had earlier stated that China could have built the boiler for a lot less, likewise its a lot closer to get to China for inspections then Germany. At the time, China still had two shops capable of building the new boilers, I doubt if that would be the case now.
While it is convenient to blame the Germans, the mistakes and delays were all locally generated.
Meiningen tendered to design and build a boiler. They were provided with drawings of the 38 class boiler.
Meiningen submitted their drawings to Australia for approval AND THEY WERE APPROVED IN AUSTRALIA.
The boiler was built to the approved design and on arrival was found not to fit.
So who checked the drawing in Australia and why did they not notice that the dimensions were wrong?
Then the boiler was sent back to Germany in the ill founded expectation that it would be corrected or a new boiler supplied.
However, the Germans pointed out that they had built exactly what was agreed, even if it wasn't what was wanted.
Almost all of the delay occurred after the first boiler was delivered.
Some of this was due to efforts to shift the blame and to conceal the fact that the money had been wasted.
Meiningen built the boiler for "Tornado" and it is expected that an exact copy will be built for "Prince of Wales".
But Tornado's boiler was built to drawings prepared by the society building it.
These were carefully checked against the original A1 boiler drawings.
Nobody checked the proposed Meiningen 38 class boiler drawings against the original 38 boiler drawings or if they did so failed to note the discrepancies. Had the differences been corrected, the Meiningen boiler would have been in use for most of the "delay" period.
Peter
As time has passed your post really illuminates the inefficiency of the people in charge of the project, hopefully they have learnt from this sad and sorry episode and maybe even look locally if new boilers are needed for any of the fleet, in saying that I am assuming the people who built the new boiler for 3265 would be able to still do similar works and even for larger boilers.
Certainly the company at Glbn should also be part of a local consortium that can provide efficient boilers and who knows what else they could do.
I have a question, did anyone even consider Ainsworth Engineering at the original time of tender for the Boiler? or weren't they even thought of?The question would be could Ainsworth have built the boiler from scratch. I understand that Ipswich shops tendered for the new boiler.
Unfortunately on the advice of certain experts ORH/RailCorp bypassed all local tenders to go with the proven (??????) track record (pun intended) of DB Meiningen who had just completed (with known defects) the new boiler for A1 Tornado. Much to our later regret and horror.I have a question, did anyone even consider Ainsworth Engineering at the original time of tender for the Boiler? or weren't they even thought of?The question would be could Ainsworth have built the boiler from scratch. I understand that Ipswich shops tendered for the new boiler.
Unfortunately on the advice of certain experts ORH/RailCorp bypassed all local tenders to go with the proven (??????) track record (pun intended) of DB Meiningen who had just completed (with known defects) the new boiler for A1 Tornado. Much to our later regret and horror.I belive that the "German" Boiler is sitting at Broadmeadows and as a asset of the NSW Government it is a wasted asset ! Why can it not be assessed by a representative from Ainsworths in Goulburn with a view towards rectifing the known defects ??
The defects in Tornado's boiler were largely confined to the rigid stays in the firebox. These did not stop the boiler being used and these were replaced during two separate occasions when the boiler was returned to the factory. These defective stays were also present in the 3801 boiler, but were replaced by Meiningen when the boiler was returned to the factory.
These were actual defects which the Germans were happy to replace at no cost. Sadly they were unable to correct the incorrect basic design due to the German boiler design not being checked against our actual requirements.
I understand that it was assumed that the boiler on 3801 would be too expensive to repair, partly due to difficulties experienced in constructing the new inner firebox fitted in 1986.
Peter
If it's too big or small, what are they going to do? Build an all new 38 that's sized to match?I belive that the "German" Boiler is sitting at Broadmeadows and as a asset of the NSW Government it is a wasted asset ! Why can it not be assessed by a representative from Ainsworths in Goulburn with a view towards rectifing the known defects ??
If it's too big or small, what are they going to do? Build an all new 38 that's sized to match?Sell it to some company that needs a stationary boiler.
Wasn't there plans put in place once the decision was made to go ahead and rebuild the old boiler off 3801, and once its running to then look at the boilers of 3820, 30 and the German one to evaluate the feasibility of having one more 38cl running, likewise having the required alterations to the German boiler gives a spare?If it's too big or small, what are they going to do? Build an all new 38 that's sized to match?Sell it to some company that needs a stationary boiler.
Not too long ago THNSW said that the German built boiler would be fixed up to Australian standards as a spare boiler, from what I know that process will probably start once 3801 is finishedThanks David.
Not too long ago THNSW said that the German built boiler would be fixed up to Australian standards as a spare boiler, from what I know that process will probably start once 3801 is finishedHas anyone any real idea of just what is wrong with it? Or is it still Too Soon?
'Has anyone any real idea of just what is wrong with it?Not too long ago THNSW said that the German built boiler would be fixed up to Australian standards as a spare boiler, from what I know that process will probably start once 3801 is finishedHas anyone any real idea of just what is wrong with it? Or is it still Too Soon?
That sort of comment does not get us far. For instance, could parts of the German boiler be used with an existing boiler? For that to occur, we really need to know where the new boiler does not fit. I have heard all sorts of theories, such as the barrel is out of round or that the firebox is out of dimension.'Has anyone any real idea of just what is wrong with it?Not too long ago THNSW said that the German built boiler would be fixed up to Australian standards as a spare boiler, from what I know that process will probably start once 3801 is finishedHas anyone any real idea of just what is wrong with it? Or is it still Too Soon?
Good question to which an honest, accurate and detailed answer free of lies, spin and half-truths would be nice.
I believe (rightly or wrongly) that it has been said many times that it 'doesn't fit' ?
How German, Australian or Martian Standards relates to this fact eludes me - 'if it doesn't fit it doesn't fit' - regardless of whether you measure it in millimetres, inches, jumbo jets, Eiffel Towers, Statues of Liberties or bees' dicks.