The corona virus COVID-19

 
  Mr. Lane Chief Commissioner

With all the talk about Sweden's approach to handling the Covid-19 pandemic, this makes for compelling reading, the article suggests that they may have accidently stumbled upon herd immunity, it also goes onto claim that those that have been infected with milder Coronaviruses, may have some immunity to covid-19 - https://reason.com/2020/08/14/did-sweden-accidentally-blunder-into-covid-19-herd-immunity/
lsrailfan
I am really not sure why Sweden's response gets on so many peoples nerves...it seems to me that people just want lock-downs regardless if they are effective or not because they feel safer if "something is being done."

I still think the Swedes probably got it right, aside from not adequately protecting the old early on...but many lock-down countries also messed that up. If you look at the stats in the EU countries it isn't exactly clear that one approach resulted in better results than another. There is still a lot to play out here.

It should be noted again that despite increasing cases, the number of daily deaths in the EU is still very low. This really was a March-April event for them, the number of daily deaths well and truly has fallen away.

Sponsored advertisement

  ANR Deputy Commissioner

I can't quote you Carnot regarding your cash stash post.

But I want to add that proposed legislation to limit the value of a cash transaction and to lock people into a banking system that could potentially charge negative interest rates adds to the mattress stuffing beyond what Covid is doing.

It won't be long now before the big banks call in their loans with the ending of the Covid repayment holiday for borrowers. What will happen if their are too many defaults? The property market will take a hit, and the banks themselves will start to look suspect. Will there be a small limit on daily withdrawals?

The cash stash will continue because cash will always be king. As a backup, people are buying up gold and the price if silver has shot up by almost 40% in recent months (if I am reading a chart correctly).

Broken Hill could see some mines reactivated.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Talking of gold, the Fosterville mine near Bendigo produced $1.7 billion worth in the first 6 months of 2020. One of the few boom industries in the State at present.  (Owned by a Canadian company though)

One thing that I hope is overhauled asap is our Aged Care system. It's a disgrace.

Incidentally, one of the quietest flu seasons ever this winter. Virtually nil hospital admissions due to flu:
https://www1.health.gov.au/internet/main/publishing.nsf/Content/cda-surveil-ozflu-flucurr.htm/$File/flu-09-2020.pdf
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Talking of gold, the Fosterville mine near Bendigo produced $1.7 billion worth in the first 6 months of 2020. One of the few boom industries in the State at present.  (Owned by a Canadian company though)
Carnot
I had a look at the mine's website, with its collection of interesting facts and figures. The only bit that worries me is that the "teardrop" location pointer on the map shows the mine as being just immediately west of Echuca - hardly the 20 km from Bendigo that's shown in the text!
The 2019 production is shown as 619,366 ounces. At today's rate of AUD 2,710 per ounce, that represents a very tidy sum
indeed.

(Apologies for digressing from the topic but Carnot's comment was just too interesting to ignore.)
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Yep. Fosterville produced 660000 in just 6 months. On track to produce over 1.2 million ounces in 2020. A second gold rush!

Today's Vic figures show a slight decline:
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction


The virus was apparently found on chicken wings being imported TO China FROM Brazil.
The latest investigation is if there is a link between the Cold store in Auckland where the first of the latest cases developed and a cold store in Melbourne owned by the same company Americold  which has also had cases.
Brianr
As I understand it they don't suspect the NZ outbreak came from Melbourne but they are trying to establish if the 2 outbreaks at Americold facilities in Melbourne and Auckland are the same strain. This will be done by comparing the genome sequencing of both outbreaks.

If they are found to be the same and no direct link can be established between the 2 sites then that would lend weight to the theory that the virus could be transported thousands of miles on food packaging or even on the inside surfaces of a container which would not be good for world trade.
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
With all the talk about Sweden's approach to handling the Covid-19 pandemic, this makes for compelling reading, the article suggests that they may have accidently stumbled upon herd immunity, it also goes onto claim that those that have been infected with milder Coronaviruses, may have some immunity to covid-19 - https://reason.com/2020/08/14/did-sweden-accidentally-blunder-into-covid-19-herd-immunity/
I am really not sure why Sweden's response gets on so many peoples nerves...it seems to me that people just want lock-downs regardless if they are effective or not because they feel safer if "something is being done."

I still think the Swedes probably got it right, aside from not adequately protecting the old early on...but many lock-down countries also messed that up. If you look at the stats in the EU countries it isn't exactly clear that one approach resulted in better results than another. There is still a lot to play out here.

It should be noted again that despite increasing cases, the number of daily deaths in the EU is still very low. This really was a March-April event for them, the number of daily deaths well and truly has fallen away.
Mr. Lane
I was not making that claim at all M.R Lane, I was just giving some information about the article in question.
  Mr. Lane Chief Commissioner

With all the talk about Sweden's approach to handling the Covid-19 pandemic, this makes for compelling reading, the article suggests that they may have accidently stumbled upon herd immunity, it also goes onto claim that those that have been infected with milder Coronaviruses, may have some immunity to covid-19 - https://reason.com/2020/08/14/did-sweden-accidentally-blunder-into-covid-19-herd-immunity/
I am really not sure why Sweden's response gets on so many peoples nerves...it seems to me that people just want lock-downs regardless if they are effective or not because they feel safer if "something is being done."

I still think the Swedes probably got it right, aside from not adequately protecting the old early on...but many lock-down countries also messed that up. If you look at the stats in the EU countries it isn't exactly clear that one approach resulted in better results than another. There is still a lot to play out here.

It should be noted again that despite increasing cases, the number of daily deaths in the EU is still very low. This really was a March-April event for them, the number of daily deaths well and truly has fallen away.
I was not making that claim at all M.R Lane, I was just giving some information about the article in question.
lsrailfan
Actually my response wasn't specifically targeted at you, I was referring to the general backlash against the Sweden approach from the pro-lockdown people. I probably should have made that clear.
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
With all the talk about Sweden's approach to handling the Covid-19 pandemic, this makes for compelling reading, the article suggests that they may have accidently stumbled upon herd immunity, it also goes onto claim that those that have been infected with milder Coronaviruses, may have some immunity to covid-19 - https://reason.com/2020/08/14/did-sweden-accidentally-blunder-into-covid-19-herd-immunity/
I am really not sure why Sweden's response gets on so many peoples nerves...it seems to me that people just want lock-downs regardless if they are effective or not because they feel safer if "something is being done."

I still think the Swedes probably got it right, aside from not adequately protecting the old early on...but many lock-down countries also messed that up. If you look at the stats in the EU countries it isn't exactly clear that one approach resulted in better results than another. There is still a lot to play out here.

It should be noted again that despite increasing cases, the number of daily deaths in the EU is still very low. This really was a March-April event for them, the number of daily deaths well and truly has fallen away.
I was not making that claim at all M.R Lane, I was just giving some information about the article in question.
Actually my response wasn't specifically targeted at you, I was referring to the general backlash against the Sweden approach from the pro-lockdown people. I probably should have made that clear.
Mr. Lane
No problem.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
That escalated quickly

  doyle Assistant Commissioner

And now for the obvious
Who said pigs don't fly

Disclaimer, no one should be subjected to this type of behaviour
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

If the driver is let out on bail, I hope that the car is held by police as it may be useful evidence at trial.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
That escalated quickly

bevans
This is where I support the use of deadly force.

Driver should see the inside a jail cell for min of 5 years for attempted murder using a motor vehicle and the car confiscated and sold by the state to pay for the damage to the other vehicles.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
A family of four returned overseas travellers, two of whom tested positive to COVID-19 before being moved to Rydges Hotel, are genomically the source of thousands of Victorian cases in the second wave of coronavirus.

Department of Health and Human Services epidemiologist Dr Charles Alpren told the hotel quarantine scheme inquiry it was “very highly likely” that all cases linked to the Rydges Hotel could be traced to that family.

He said genomic sequencing had been successfully performed on 4981 cases in Victoria, of which 3594 clustered genomically with Rydges associated genomic clusters.

Of cases sequenced within the past month, 3183 of the 3234 cases were linked to the Rydges associated cluster.
“I am satisfied that in my opinion it is likely that a high proportion, approximately 99 per cent of current cases of COVID-19 in Victoria have arisen from Rydges or Stamford,” Dr Alpren said.

He said approximately 90 per cent or more of the COVID-19 infections in Victoria could be traced to the Rydges Hotel.
In his witness statement, Dr Alpren said there was a high level of certainty that almost all current Victorian COVID-19 cases could be traced to the transmission events and locations relating to Rydges and Stamford Plaza Hotels.

The family of four moved into quarantine at Rydges Hotel on May 15, the day after two of the family tested positive.
The two remaining family members then tested positive on 17 and 18 of May and three staff members became symptomatic on 25 May and subsequently tested positive.

Between 26 May and 18 of June, 17 people linked to Rydges tested positive in Victoria and one household contact of a staff member tested positive in Queensland.

“All other outbreaks active when cases from the Rydges outbreak first appeared have now ceased,” Dr Alpren said.

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/coronavirus-australia-live-news-three-sources-to-blame-for-99pc-of-victoria-cases/news-story/b23fe16abd8379ba36dfb89b6b7fa8c0
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

A family of four returned overseas travellers, two of whom tested positive to COVID-19 before being moved to Rydges Hotel, are genomically the source of thousands of Victorian cases in the second wave of coronavirus.

bevans
That's interesting, but only actually useful as an intermediate step in the process of reconstructing how and why the virus spread from this quarantined family to staff/contractors at the hotel and then on to start the whole Sicktoria wave.

Unless it gets proven to criminal law 'beyond all reasonable doubt' standard that they knowingly took actions which caused the onward transmission, I hope that the identity and privacy of the family is carefully protected.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
A family of four returned overseas travellers, two of whom tested positive to COVID-19 before being moved to Rydges Hotel, are genomically the source of thousands of Victorian cases in the second wave of coronavirus.

That's interesting, but only actually useful as an intermediate step in the process of reconstructing how and why the virus spread from this quarantined family to staff/contractors at the hotel and then on to start the whole Sicktoria wave.

Unless it gets proven to criminal law 'beyond all reasonable doubt' standard that they knowingly took actions which caused the onward transmission, I hope that the identity and privacy of the family is carefully protected.
Why were they at large in the community prior to quarantine?
Why were they not taken to quarantine straight off the plane immediately they arrived?
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Yes, the government should be made to answer those questions as well. I bet they'll find a way of dodging them.

There hasn't been any sign of them having transmitted it before going into hotel quarantine, so it would seem they were isolating correctly up to that point and weren't out in the community.

So it seems they were trustworthy - but what about others who were exempted from hotel quarantine? How many exemptions have been given and how well have others complied with the directives?
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Yes, the government should be made to answer those questions as well. I bet they'll find a way of dodging them.

There hasn't been any sign of them having transmitted it before going into hotel quarantine, so it would seem they were isolating correctly up to that point and weren't out in the community.

So it seems they were trustworthy - but what about others who were exempted from hotel quarantine? How many exemptions have been given and how well have others complied with the directives?
justapassenger
Even now one only has to look at those not complying with the compulsory wearing of masks. There is a walking track/bike path adjacent to our house. Since COVID there has been a marked increase in walkers on this path.

I walked about a km of this path yesterday and only about 70% of people were wearing masks properly.

There were a couple of so called runners and a cyclist who are, apparently, exempt from masks. I will never understand why as if anyone is going to be breathing 'dog germs' they are the ones. I liken to these people to 'Pig Pen' in the Charlie Brown comics.

Apart from the runners there were many walkers:

Not wearing masks - but carrying them just in case I assume .......
Wearing masks covering the mouth (carelessly) but not the nose
Wearing a mask round their neck

The main culprits in both groups were either 30-ish females or males of a certain origin.

Only mugs obey the law in Victoria ..........................
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
One question I must ask tonight, have Australian leaders gone to far when it comes to lockdowns? I don't think they have myself, , judging by all the info we have on this virus from overseas countries, I am merely asking for my own clarification, I note that QLD/TAS will remain shut until at least Xmas? really?!, any thoughts on this?
  doyle Assistant Commissioner

Unfortunately our governments had all the information and still failed us, how many nursing home outbreaks do you need to work out that the federal government needed to be prepared in Victoria after the newmarch house debacle
If this gets away from us do you think the other states SA WA tas QLD and the commonwealth will have a lid on it?

I don't think they are prepared at all sounds like apology will be their preparation
  doyle Assistant Commissioner

Israilfan
No lockdowns are necessary if we have numbers in the hundreds, just look at the growth in NZ. but lockdowns cannot keep happening I personally think the states borders should be closed until the numbers can be handled as 'spot fires' very low numbers, and return travellers should of been (even now) put in immigration detention centres from the beginning with compulsory swabs on day 3 and day 15
  ANR Deputy Commissioner

One question I must ask tonight, have Australian leaders gone to far when it comes to lockdowns? I don't think they have myself, , judging by all the info we have on this virus from overseas countries, I am merely asking for my own clarification, I note that QLD/TAS will remain shut until at least Xmas? really?!, any thoughts on this?
lsrailfan
For lockdowns, they just need to shut down pubs/clubs/restaurants/cafes and life is good to return to normal.

Are they going too far stating that a vaccine for covid-19 will be compulsory for every single one of us?
  ANR Deputy Commissioner

One question I must ask tonight, have Australian leaders gone to far when it comes to lockdowns? I don't think they have myself, , judging by all the info we have on this virus from overseas countries, I am merely asking for my own clarification, I note that QLD/TAS will remain shut until at least Xmas? really?!, any thoughts on this?
For lockdowns, they just need to shut down pubs/clubs/restaurants/cafes and life is good to return to normal.

Are they going too far stating that a vaccine for covid-19 will be compulsory for every single one of us?
  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

One question I must ask tonight, have Australian leaders gone to far when it comes to lockdowns? I don't think they have myself, , judging by all the info we have on this virus from overseas countries, I am merely asking for my own clarification, I note that QLD/TAS will remain shut until at least Xmas? really?!, any thoughts on this?
For lockdowns, they just need to shut down pubs/clubs/restaurants/cafes and life is good to return to normal.

Are they going too far stating that a vaccine for covid-19 will be compulsory for every single one of us?
ANR
Don’t be too concerned about a vaccine being compulsory, there isn’t one as yet.
Scumo has a letter of intent only with AstraZenetica, to supply this fictional product.

Must be one of those notional things, core promise non core promise, just pesky semantics.
  KRviator Moderator

Location: Up the front
One question I must ask tonight, have Australian leaders gone to far when it comes to lockdowns? I don't think they have myself, , judging by all the info we have on this virus from overseas countries, I am merely asking for my own clarification, I note that QLD/TAS will remain shut until at least Xmas? really?!, any thoughts on this?
lsrailfan
IMHO, yes, they have.

I work in WA and live on the east coast. I can't get to work - I haven't been since March - and can name at least 20 other Driver's in the same boat. They are either trapped in NSW/Vic or trapped in WA unable to return home to their families lest they be locked out of WA on their return.

We are but one country (except at Origin time) and we need to face it together. I have no problem with quarantine on arrival if you want to travel interstate, but to be prohibited from entering an Australian state doesn't sit well with me.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from: