The demise of the ALP in the next federal election

 
  BaysideManny Junior Train Controller



So tell us, how did the govt not order enough vaccines? Because many people still can't book appointment to get their first jab for another couple of months. And there's no lack of trying!

Rednecks, bigots and other conservatives are having a field day at the moment, blaming the outbreak in north and north west suburban Melbourne on Sudes et al, whereas a major contributing factor in the slow roll-out of vaccines in Hume (for example) is simply because of the low average age of residents there, who were not even eligible for a first jab until very recently.

It is also worth noting Morrison's own admission today that critics of his 'efforts' to secure enough vaccines are nothing more than Hindsight Heroes. In other words, with the benefit of hindsight, his shortcomings in getting enough doses has been exposed; he now acknowledges that but just wants the story to go away.

Anyway, stay safe in your gated community Shane, while the rest of us deal with real world problems.
DirtyBallast
Rednecks, bigots and other conservatives are having a field day at the moment, blaming the outbreak in north and north west suburban Melbourne on Sudes et al

Yep that will be the Liberal Party's campaign for the 2022 State election. That is why I want the ALP, whoever they are led by to win.


Mannie

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  303gunner Train Controller

Now, more and more evidence is coming to light. First we heard that Morrison & Hunt never spoke to Pfizer despite other heads of government from around the world personally sealing deals to acquire early access. Then we hear that Morrison & Hunt failed to act when Pfizer came to them mid way through last year.

So what happens every time more evidence comes to light to show how little Morrison and Co. actually did to precure vaccines? Morrison does his usual duck and hide act.
Gman_86
Entirely outside the Covid Pandemic and the procurement of vaccines, do we expect our Politicians of any Political Party at any level of Government to be involved in commercial negotiations?

We expect the Pollies to agree to the need to do something and find the funds to do it. We then expect that once that decision is made, the specifications or standards for what is to be bought is decided by the experts in the field, ie engineers, economists or health professionals. Once they decide on what it is that needs to be built or bought, other experts in contract procurement are bought in to negotiate the price, delivery and cost performance. We expect the whole process to be done at arms length in a professional and ethical way.

When Politician's get involved in every step of the process, we end up with Homer Simpson's car for every Taxpayer funded purchase in the country. Homer Simpson's Submarines, Homer Simpson's Fighter Jets, Homers Simpson's NBN. Utter rubbish and ten times over budget. Politicians try to appeal to every vested interest around and end up screwing up the task.

When Pollies ARE involved in the negotiations with Corporations, we cry out that they are corrupt, on the gravy train, taking backhanders and featherbedding their future. How loudly we cry when they won't reveal the secret deals due to "Commercial in Confidence" clauses? Are they "building a nation" or "in bed with the developers"?

Can you imagine the outcry if someone had let slip that Scott Morrison had personally intervened and was on the phone in a secret backroom deal with the head of Pfizer to spend Billions of our dollars? Headlines: "Corrupt deal to prop up Morrison Govt". Would we gladly approve of our Government intervening in a private call to the head of a corporation to bribe us to the head of the queue if it meant elbowing Brunei, Botswana or Bolivia out of the way? Do we want Australia to be known to be "personally sealing deals to acquire early access"? Or look at it from the other way, how would we view it if Xi Jinping personally called Pfizer to buy every dose available for China's use? Every time Australia has done something like this to further our commercial interests, it always ends up being described as a "Scandal". Grain sales to Iraq? Oil negotiations with East Timor? Trans Pacific Partnership Negotiations? Without fail, secret deals, regardless if they are good for Australia or not, always receive negative outcry.

So what do we actually expect from our Pollies in taypayer-funded projects? Should they negotiate these deals in secret personally, or should they let the Ministerial Departments handle it in a transparent way?
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
So what do we actually expect from our Pollies in taypayer-funded projects? Should they negotiate these deals in secret personally, or should they let the Ministerial Departments handle it in a transparent way?
"303gunner"
Normally the latter is preferable. However, vis-a-vis Pfizer; the government was invited by Pfizer to send a delegation. Other countries did. Hunt and Morrison failed to attend or to deputise someone to go. They were wrong because they did nothing.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
It's half way through September 2021 innitt and we're scouring the world for excess doses. A few here a few there. Because we didn't order enough or put a few eggs in other baskets, meanwhile the US,UK and numerous other countries had ordered and received hundreds of millions of doses. End of story. The rest of your boring monologue is just spin and deflection of LNP incompetence. Give it a rest it's embarrassing.

To see what the Australian people think, in regards to those communist leaders in  the states, the WA liberals were basically wiped out, 2 seats. Anna P increased here majority and I think she is now one of the longest serving Queensland Premiers, despite all the pooh flung by the Federal LNP and the Murdoch press. Dan Andrews is still holding his own, and Gladys is now the most hated person in Australia. Even Newspoll has the Federal ALP(who are about as inspiring as a nasal drip in a howling sou wester)leading the LNP 54/46,landslide territory. How that pans out in 6 months is anybodys guess, but it portrays Australians feelings at the present time  as to the predicament/mess we now find ourselves in and whose fault and incompetence caused it.
wobert
Oh god save us, more stupidity.

Is 140m doses across 4 suppliers enough and diversified for you? Please tell you you actually understood this this time? 2-3 others have said the same thing to you as well as links to the various offical websites ordering th.

Perhaps you might want to AGAIN, check on the restrictions placed on export of the likes of Moderna.

As for timing now, well it actualy started from at least 6-8 weeks ago according to the media as it became clear the jurisitictions that had those vaccines were not going to use them.

The rest of your rubbish is you playing your alter ego, Strawman.


Really, ok, there is only one democratic leader in the western world that I'm aware of that has lost power during CV and that was DT and rightly so. The Corona effect has been a boost to all regardless on how it was managed domestically. Even JA got record votes and she has followed a similar path to Australia expect its actually all the things your critise SCOMO for. Ordered just one supplier of Vaccine, limited and very slow roll out, uses hotel quarrantine.....However the longer this pans out the less support some are getting as people grow tied of restrictions, lock downs and potentially forced vaccines.

I am not surprised of the election results in the state elections to date. She, Anna P won 2 or 3 elections in a row, long way from longest.

I've mentioned more than once for some time I doubt LNP will win federally, but then my views at the time and the polls supported the same that the LNP shouldn't have one last time. On party level LNP have not polled well since within a few months of the election.

But again, what would have the ALP Fed's done differently? Answer, not alot regarding the vaccines and CV as they are hamstrung by both international forces and limitations in authroty domestically, however they would have kept Dan, Mark and Anna on a much shorter leash and we wouldn't have the same level of vaccine hesistacy.  

Right now, NSW right or wrong, is offering a pathway forward out of this mess. WA and Qld are not, this will not bode well if they are still locked down weeks after other states are moving around.
  DirtyBallast Chief Commissioner

Location: Standing at the limit of an endless ocean

Right now, NSW right or wrong, is offering a pathway forward out of this mess. WA and Qld are not, this will not bode well if they are still locked down weeks after other states are moving around.
RTT_Rules
It's a pathway alright, but not forward.

Explain Singapore. Despite more than 80% of the population being double vaxxed, the Delta strain is running rampant due to social gatherings. Restrictions have been reimposed as a consequence.

Palaszczuk and McGowan will look like heroes once people in NSW start dropping dead in the streets.
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
To be expected, dull and boring, have a look at this from the Marx Manifesto


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/12/in-hindsight-there-was-no-foresight-how-australia-bungled-its-pfizer-covid-deal


Funny how facts are such a left wing construct


In reply to Shane, not DB
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
Anyways I got a horse to saddle see yas in a week or so
  303gunner Train Controller

I've mentioned more than once for some time I doubt LNP will win federally, but then my views at the time and the polls supported the same that the LNP shouldn't have one last time. On party level LNP have not polled well since within a few months of the election.
RTT_Rules
Well, No, because the LNP (Liberal National Party) ONLY exists in Qld. In other States and Federally, the Liberal Party and the National Party are two different parties that form a Coalition.

In NSW, in both the latest State and Federal elections the National Party won more territory than the Libs, Labor or the Greens combined, and Federally Labor was only able to win 2 seats outside of Metro Newc-Syd-Woll, as did the Liberals.

Politically, it might be co-incidental to compare the Lib v Lab distribution of seats in Sydney (https://www.aec.gov.au/Elections/federal_elections/2019/files/maps/2019-aec-A3-NSW-maps.pdf (this is the Federal election, but broadly mirrors the State results)) with the map of the Local Government Areas with the heaviest restrictions (https://www.nsw.gov.au/covid-19/rules/affected-area). Some might say there is a correlation! The outcome of that may be that the electorates that last voted Labor will be the most upset with the harsh restrictions and again vote Labor, but the Liberal electorates have had lighter restrictions and may still vote Liberal again.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
I've mentioned more than once for some time I doubt LNP will win federally, but then my views at the time and the polls supported the same that the LNP shouldn't have one last time. On party level LNP have not polled well since within a few months of the election.
Well, No, because the LNP (Liberal National Party) ONLY exists in Qld. In other States and Federally, the Liberal Party and the National Party are two different parties that form a Coalition.

In NSW, in both the latest State and Federal elections the National Party won more territory than the Libs, Labor or the Greens combined, and Federally Labor was only able to win 2 seats outside of Metro Newc-Syd-Woll, as did the Liberals.

Politically, it might be co-incidental to compare the Lib v Lab distribution of seats in Sydney (https://www.aec.gov.au/Elections/federal_elections/2019/files/maps/2019-aec-A3-NSW-maps.pdf (this is the Federal election, but broadly mirrors the State results)) with the map of the Local Government Areas with the heaviest restrictions (https://www.nsw.gov.au/covid-19/rules/affected-area). Some might say there is a correlation! The outcome of that may be that the electorates that last voted Labor will be the most upset with the harsh restrictions and again vote Labor, but the Liberal electorates have had lighter restrictions and may still vote Liberal again.
303gunner

Not disagreeing, however I think most would agree that LNP or Coalition is pretty much the same thing as a vote for Lib or Nats is a vote for a effectively L-NP coalition govt, hence to save time I put them in the same boat.

Is it me, or is there some irony that the word "coal" makes up the first part of the word Coalition.

The rest of your post is interesting and I tend to agree the lockdowns may not have the impact on future elections in NSW or Federally as we think. Friends of mine in Qld who would normally lean right are happy with both Anna P and SCOMO performance and blame NSW for all their woes of not being able to crossing the border.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE

Right now, NSW right or wrong, is offering a pathway forward out of this mess. WA and Qld are not, this will not bode well if they are still locked down weeks after other states are moving around.It's a pathway alright, but not forward.

Explain Singapore. Despite more than 80% of the population being double vaxxed, the Delta strain is running rampant due to social gatherings. Restrictions have been reimposed as a consequence.

Palaszczuk and McGowan will look like heroes once people in NSW start dropping dead in the streets.
DirtyBallast
Yes, its foreward.

Sinagpore is +80% with Pfizer and Moderna and while their cases are around 500 / dy, their deaths for last 30 days is 14. I don't know if they were or were not vaccinated, but I'm sure the govt does and potentially what underlying issues they may have had.

A quick google

  • 367 children have been infected with COVID-19 to date, accounting for 0.6 per cent of all local infections
  • 172 children have been infected with the Delta variant
  • None of them developed severe illness requiring oxygen supplementation or ICU care
...and isn't this what the vaccine was all about?


At some point we need to stop focusing on cases and some countries are starting to move that way, people are still being infected, yes, we all knew this would happen, no surprise, but the win was keeping the hospitals operating normally.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pfizer%E2%80%93BioNTech_COVID-19_vaccine

Look under effectiveness - 96% effective at reducing hospitalisation. Only 83% effective of eliminating symptoms.

EU and USA is opening up as vaccination rates rise and the load decreases on hospitals. In the Southern parts of the USA its now up to you to save your own skin, no more masks, lockdowns etc. Vaccine is there, it works, its fully approved, (quoting Joe)

As for dropping dead like flys in NSW, hardly. The infection rate in Vic is now similar to last year, yet barely any deaths.

Qld and WA have done the right thing to date, the argument is when to pull the plug. WA Preimer today 80% isn't good enough, wants 90%, building quarrantine facilities etc is the maddness and now threating SA not to open up to NSW "or else".

Dan's language on all this changed and now saying he will release a plan on Sunday, Anna P has started to show the signs of change.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
To be expected, dull and boring, have a look at this from the Marx Manifesto


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/12/in-hindsight-there-was-no-foresight-how-australia-bungled-its-pfizer-covid-deal


Funny how facts are such a left wing construct


In reply to Shane, not DB
wobert
You might need to read the article again, fully. Actually explains the numerous logicitics and approvals issues faced along the way.

- Australia chose a four vaccine strategy, two later failed to seek approval for trial. Months after it Pfizer was supposedly pushing Australia to sign up
- Australia ordered 140 m vaccines
- Still in its untested phase, Pfizer was the least desirable due to issues in local manufacture and transport away from major centres

NZ did a similar approach, but wait, which party is ruling there?

Why do we have to repeat this over and over again? I quoted from this same article (not that the Guardian should be considered as reliable source) to you previously correcting your politically driven statements and refereces to your Socialist guide for Dummies Daily.
  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

To be expected, dull and boring, have a look at this from the Marx Manifesto


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/12/in-hindsight-there-was-no-foresight-how-australia-bungled-its-pfizer-covid-deal


Funny how facts are such a left wing construct


In reply to Shane, not DB
You might need to read the article again, fully. Actually explains the numerous logicitics and approvals issues faced along the way.

- Australia chose a four vaccine strategy, two later failed to seek approval for trial. Months after it Pfizer was supposedly pushing Australia to sign up
- Australia ordered 140 m vaccines
- Still in its untested phase, Pfizer was the least desirable due to issues in local manufacture and transport away from major centres

NZ did a similar approach, but wait, which party is ruling there?

Why do we have to repeat this over and over again? I quoted from this same article (not that the Guardian should be considered as reliable source) to you previously correcting your politically driven statements and refereces to your Socialist guide for Dummies Daily.
RTT_Rules
Many politically driven opinions here, yours is one of the loudest.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
To be expected, dull and boring, have a look at this from the Marx Manifesto


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/12/in-hindsight-there-was-no-foresight-how-australia-bungled-its-pfizer-covid-deal


Funny how facts are such a left wing construct


In reply to Shane, not DB
You might need to read the article again, fully. Actually explains the numerous logicitics and approvals issues faced along the way.

- Australia chose a four vaccine strategy, two later failed to seek approval for trial. Months after it Pfizer was supposedly pushing Australia to sign up
- Australia ordered 140 m vaccines
- Still in its untested phase, Pfizer was the least desirable due to issues in local manufacture and transport away from major centres

NZ did a similar approach, but wait, which party is ruling there?

Why do we have to repeat this over and over again? I quoted from this same article (not that the Guardian should be considered as reliable source) to you previously correcting your politically driven statements and refereces to your Socialist guide for Dummies Daily.
Many politically driven opinions here, yours is one of the loudest.

michaelgm
Oh comon Mic, Wobert and some others here are making more often than not complete BS statements on vaccine availability, approvals and delivery etc, more often than not backed by nothing than personal opinion or taking a stab at Feds. If nothing else I'm replying to your unqualified statements quoting references.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Apropos the next election, the Therapeutic Goods Administration has issued a "cease and desist" letter to Craig Kelly, ostensibly on the grounds of breach of copyright, over his public comments about anti-vaccination. Kelly has responded with a threat to sue the TGA for defamation.
Now, I have a problem with this. How is it possible to defame a blockhead like Kelly when he's already doing a good job of making an idiot of himself?
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
To be expected, dull and boring, have a look at this from the Marx Manifesto


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/12/in-hindsight-there-was-no-foresight-how-australia-bungled-its-pfizer-covid-deal


Funny how facts are such a left wing construct


In reply to Shane, not DB
wobert
Before early this year Australia (me and a few others aside) didn't want Pfizer, it was too hard (logistically) to get.

The US has access to 'plenty' of Pfizer, because, this may be a shock to you, they make it in downtown Kalamazoo, Michigan. Even so, to 12/2/21 the US had 300 million doses of Pfizer on order, you might think they're doing better than Australia for it (and they are, but not by the margin you think), because the US has issued 382 million vaccinations TOTAL, so that might tell you that possibly most of those 'orders' have not been delivered yet.

The Guardian article is BS, Pfizer write the PM on 30/6/20? Our PM didn't sign up right away? Why? Gosh, what an inexplicable error!

The truth is that Pfizer didn't even enter phase 3 trials until 27/7/20, so it's pretty hard to suggest that we missed the boat by not signing up to a potentially non functioning product. Pfizer didn't publish their phase 3 trial data until about 18/11/20, and by this time we had about 10 million doses on order. Our own UQ vaccine* didn't fail until early December 20 (that's 51 million doses right there lost), who was to say at the end of June that it wouldn't have been a mistake to order Pfizer and have it not pass phase 3?

Don't forget, a vaccine you've probably not heard of, Novavax is also on order (11+ million doses), has been since even before UQ failed, still with none delivered to Australia, due to manufacturing and materials shortfalls.


*I'll declare an interest in this, I donated time and resources towards this project.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Apropos the next election, the Therapeutic Goods Administration has issued a "cease and desist" letter to Craig Kelly, ostensibly on the grounds of breach of copyright, over his public comments about anti-vaccination. Kelly has responded with a threat to sue the TGA for defamation.
Now, I have a problem with this. How is it possible to defame a blockhead like Kelly when he's already doing a good job of making an idiot of himself?
Valvegear
How are 'comments about anti-vaccination' a copyright infringement? I don't disagree with your general sentiments, I presume Kelly's return suit is in relation to reputation or character, and it strikes me as quite apparent that he has no reputation or character to defend.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
How are 'comments about anti-vaccination' a copyright infringement? I don't disagree with your general sentiments, I presume Kelly's return suit is in relation to reputation or character, and it strikes me as quite apparent that he has no reputation or character to defend.
Aaron
From what I read, it seems that a copyright infringement is either the easiest or only available grounds on which to issue a "cease and desist" . . . one of the great mysteries of the law. Obviously they can't go at him for his idiotic ideas.
  303gunner Train Controller

How are 'comments about anti-vaccination' a copyright infringement? I don't disagree with your general sentiments, I presume Kelly's return suit is in relation to reputation or character, and it strikes me as quite apparent that he has no reputation or character to defend.
From what I read, it seems that a copyright infringement is either the easiest or only available grounds on which to issue a "cease and desist" . . . one of the great mysteries of the law. Obviously they can't go at him for his idiotic ideas.
Valvegear
The TGA is asserting the Kelly is hen-pecking information from their reports and studies to present information out of context in a way that supports his contentions. The TGA can't disprove his data as wrong, because it is their own supplied information, but to prevent him from twisting the conclusions, they are trying to stop him from copying the data from their published documents.

How Kelly thinks that is defamatory, I don't know
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
To be expected, dull and boring, have a look at this from the Marx Manifesto


https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/12/in-hindsight-there-was-no-foresight-how-australia-bungled-its-pfizer-covid-deal


Funny how facts are such a left wing construct


In reply to Shane, not DB
Before early this year Australia (me and a few others aside) didn't want Pfizer, it was too hard (logistically) to get.

The US has access to 'plenty' of Pfizer, because, this may be a shock to you, they make it in downtown Kalamazoo, Michigan. Even so, to 12/2/21 the US had 300 million doses of Pfizer on order, you might think they're doing better than Australia for it (and they are, but not by the margin you think), because the US has issued 382 million vaccinations TOTAL, so that might tell you that possibly most of those 'orders' have not been delivered yet.

The Guardian article is BS, Pfizer write the PM on 30/6/20? Our PM didn't sign up right away? Why? Gosh, what an inexplicable error!

The truth is that Pfizer didn't even enter phase 3 trials until 27/7/20, so it's pretty hard to suggest that we missed the boat by not signing up to a potentially non functioning product. Pfizer didn't publish their phase 3 trial data until about 18/11/20, and by this time we had about 10 million doses on order. Our own UQ vaccine* didn't fail until early December 20 (that's 51 million doses right there lost), who was to say at the end of June that it wouldn't have been a mistake to order Pfizer and have it not pass phase 3?

Don't forget, a vaccine you've probably not heard of, Novavax is also on order (11+ million doses), has been since even before UQ failed, still with none delivered to Australia, due to manufacturing and materials shortfalls.


*I'll declare an interest in this, I donated time and resources towards this project.
Aaron
So according to you the Guardian article is BS, you and your alternative facts, you old snake in the grass you. Numerous articles have been written and reports in the live media about the Pfizer stuff up, so live with it.  As for the supply constraints early on from Europe, 3 million  or so is what was argued over, and there's two lots of facts with that, Morrisons and every body else.  Here's a little read from the Liberal Parties own mouth piece     https://www.theaustralian.com.au/inquirer/where-the-bloody-hell-are-the-vaccines/news-story/75b9fc2e78f3220e69b0187cb33c3638  

I'll declare an interest in CSL, bully for us.   oops Paywall
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
And I can't find a link to the article anywhere else, but when the Oz bags out the LNP over the vaccine strollout, you know things must be crook.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Hang on, the June deal the PM wouldn’t sign came from your own article; the 27/7 phase 3 trial start date for Pfizer and trial data date of publish being 10/12 is internationally recognised.

Those are not by any definition alternate facts - not unless you live in a world with an alternately numbered calendar.

No rational person could or would be in dispute - oh, I see, I know why you are now.

Signing up with real dollars (because make no mistake, that’s what Pfizer were seeking) for for an incompletely tested vaccine is not a great decision.
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
Really, yet the UK  and other nations  took a punt and signed up on July 8, fast tracked their approval processes and first jab was done in the UK on Dec 8.  In Oz, we signed up when, for 10 Mil in November

from the SMH

"Legal representatives from Pfizer and the Commonwealth were still hashing out the non-disclosure agreement when a company representative noted in an email on July 23 that the US and UK had already signed deals for doses. The US ordered an initial 100 million doses on July 22, and the UK signed a deal for 30 million doses on July 20"

So it wasn't  for another nigh on 4 months that Australia signed an agreement for 10 million doses, front of the queue to the far queue, and that's all they could get because the UK, US and other governments weren't as incompetent  as ours.

So with all the announcements from Scotty the announcer, 140 Mill, a couple of million  of AZ disappeared, the Queensland lot of apparently 50 mill, leaves us with 70 mill give or take, then why have they been scouring the world scrounging a million  here a couple of million there? Let me guess, the FOI docs are a fabrication, the timelines for Pfizer, which have been in damn near every media publication are wrong , or Morrison and the Truculent Runt have been telling us porkies.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Really, yet the UK  and other nations  took a punt and signed up on July 8, fast tracked their approval processes and first jab was done in the UK on Dec 8.  In Oz, we signed up when, for 10 Mil in November

from the SMH

"Legal representatives from Pfizer and the Commonwealth were still hashing out the non-disclosure agreement when a company representative noted in an email on July 23 that the US and UK had already signed deals for doses. The US ordered an initial 100 million doses on July 22, and the UK signed a deal for 30 million doses on July 20"

So it wasn't  for another nigh on 4 months that Australia signed an agreement for 10 million doses, front of the queue to the far queue, and that's all they could get because the UK, US and other governments weren't as incompetent  as ours.

So with all the announcements from Scotty the announcer, 140 Mill, a couple of million  of AZ disappeared, the Queensland lot of apparently 50 mill, leaves us with 70 mill give or take, then why have they been scouring the world scrounging a million  here a couple of million there? Let me guess, the FOI docs are a fabrication, the timelines for Pfizer, which have been in damn near every media publication are wrong , or Morrison and the Truculent Runt have been telling us porkies.
wobert
If the timelines in damn near every media publication are substantially different to the dates I have given, then - YES! They are wrong, 100% sure of it.

Trial dates are absolutely documented Pfizer didn't start phase 3 until late July and they didn't end until after the middle of November, with published results in December, any media that reports different is lying, it's just not even in question.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
So according to you the Guardian article is BS, you and your alternative facts, you old snake in the grass you. Numerous articles have been written and reports in the live media about the Pfizer stuff up, so live with it.  As for the supply constraints early on from Europe, 3 million  or so is what was argued over, and there's two lots of facts with that, Morrisons and every body else.  Here's a little read from the Liberal Parties own mouth piece     https://www.theaustralian.com.au/inquirer/where-the-bloody-hell-are-the-vaccines/news-story/75b9fc2e78f3220e69b0187cb33c3638  

I'll declare an interest in CSL, bully for us.   oops Paywall
wobert
Its not just Aaron, there is so many technical/factual, not political holes in that article its not funny, yet for god knows why you still keep flogging the dead horse. Spolier alert, your horse died months ago.

Most of your so called articles from your socialist weekly and other are nothing more than political agenda propaganda. Remember you keeping telling us no vacinnes were ordered, yet we keep telling you there is clear documented hiostory of the 140 m doses that were ordered. This is not about politics. You said nothing or insufficent was ordered, yet it was. Its documeneted on the Department of Health website, its in the media.

You also stated at one point there was no plan for 2022 boosters, yet again in the ABC, both PR by Pfizer and govt, X many million ordered. Again these responses are not politically motivated. Its simply response to your incorrect politically motivated statements.

You also keep telling us the govt didn't get sufficent supplier diversification, yet the clear, docuemented history stated and know back then and in the media was there was.

If I recall correctly and can check if you really want to debate it, the projected timeframe in Jan 2021 for vaccine rollout was 9-10 months, ie Oct 2021, but I believe that was 70%, not 80% which is now being the new standard globally as country's with these numbers appears to have few hospitalisations.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Really, yet the UK  and other nations  took a punt and signed up on July 8, fast tracked their approval processes and first jab was done in the UK on Dec 8.  In Oz, we signed up when, for 10 Mil in November

from the SMH

"Legal representatives from Pfizer and the Commonwealth were still hashing out the non-disclosure agreement when a company representative noted in an email on July 23 that the US and UK had already signed deals for doses. The US ordered an initial 100 million doses on July 22, and the UK signed a deal for 30 million doses on July 20"

So it wasn't  for another nigh on 4 months that Australia signed an agreement for 10 million doses, front of the queue to the far queue, and that's all they could get because the UK, US and other governments weren't as incompetent  as ours.

So with all the announcements from Scotty the announcer, 140 Mill, a couple of million  of AZ disappeared, the Queensland lot of apparently 50 mill, leaves us with 70 mill give or take, then why have they been scouring the world scrounging a million  here a couple of million there? Let me guess, the FOI docs are a fabrication, the timelines for Pfizer, which have been in damn near every media publication are wrong , or Morrison and the Truculent Runt have been telling us porkies.
If the timelines in damn near every media publication are substantially different to the dates I have given, then - YES! They are wrong, 100% sure of it.

Trial dates are absolutely documented Pfizer didn't start phase 3 until late July and they didn't publish until after the middle of November, any media that reports different is lying, it's just not even in question.
Aaron
From Wiki
The Pivotal Phase II–III Trial with the lead vaccine candidate "BNT162b2" began in July. Preliminary results from Phase I–II clinical trials on BNT162b2, published in October 2020, indicated potential for its safety and efficacy.[24] During the same month, the European Medicines Agency (EMA) began a periodic review of BNT162b2.[149]

The study of BNT162b2 is a continuous-phase trial in Phase III as of November 2020.[25] It is a "randomized, placebo-controlled, observer-blind, dose-finding, vaccine candidate-selection, and efficacy study in healthy individuals".[25] The study expanded during mid-2020 to assess efficacy and safety of BNT162b2 in greater numbers of participants, reaching tens of thousands of people receiving test vaccinations in multiple countries in collaboration with Pfizer and Fosun.[27][94]

Wobert
One more time

Of the 140m doses ordered
~ 51 m doses were Novovax
https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/covid-19-vaccine-government-response/australias-vaccine-agreements#novavax

~ 50 m doses were UQ
The University of Queensland vaccine was abandoned in December 2020 after trials revealed that, while it was safe, it triggered false positives on HIV tests

~ Pfizer, original order was around 10m doese
The Therapeutic Goods Administration (TGA) provisionally approved the Pfizer vaccine in January 2021.[179] The Australian government ordered 10 million doses, with the first 80,000 to be delivered in February 2021, but production problems and the imposition of export controls by the European Union (EU) onto deliveries to countries outside Europe made meeting the delivery schedule problematic.[180]
- AZ - The below explains why AZ was heavily favoured over Pfizer.
Delivery issues also affected deliveries of the Oxford–AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine, which was provisionally approved by the TGA in February,[181] and received final approval in March.[182] Orders were reduced from 3.8 million to 1.2 million doses of this vaccine, which was manufactured in Belgium,[180][183] and arrival was pushed back to March 2021.[184] CSL Limited began manufacturing 50 million doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine in Melbourne in November 2020. Deliveries were expected to commence in March.[185] The AstraZeneca vaccine could be stored at normal refrigeration temperatures of 2 to 8 °C (36 to 46 °F), whereas the Pfizer vaccine required storage at −70 °C (−94 °F).[184] However, concerns were raised about the efficacy of the AstraZeneca vaccine.[186][187] The Australian and New Zealand Society for Immunology called for a pause in its rollout, as the efficacy of the vaccine reported by trials was insufficient to achieve the desired herd immunity effect.[188] CSL management declined an invitation to appear before an Australian Senate inquiry.[189]

in addition, Australia is also ordering vaccines for Pacific Islands. I have no idea if these are counted as part of Australia's overall quota
Australia has committed $623.2 million over three years to assist countries in the Pacific and Southeast Asia to access COVID-19 vaccines:
  • This includes $523.2 million for our regional Vaccine Access and Health Security Initiative, which commenced on 23 March 2021 and will fund the provision of vaccines to our neighbouring countries at a current rate of 120,000 doses a week and providing technical support for vaccine roll outs;


If you still want to play politics after reading all this, then good luck to you. Its worth noting that the ALP have never denied any of the above.

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