South Australian Government moves to remove access to Barossa Valley Rail Line

 
Topic moved from News by bevans on 18 Oct 2021 16:58
  bevans Site Admin

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  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Disappointing.

South Australian Government moves to remove access to Barossa Valley Rail Line
bevans
Blah, blah, blah, struggling with 'region struggling with covid' and now they have no train service, they did just fine for the 15-16 years before Covid was even a known thing without a train line and they will do just as well now without a train service too.

No one 'needed' to catch a catch a train in the last 18 years, and not a lot apparently 'needed' or 'chose to' catch a train in the years before that - after all, businesses rarely cease altogether because they're viable.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Correct decision.

In the event of there existing a legitimate plan to use the Barossa line again and the proponent handling the restoration of the rest of the route, the government can reinstate the crossing and it will be one of the smallest hurdles to overcome. Same goes for the Kroemer Crossing roundabout, which was built at track level to cater for future railway use.

Perhaps the most suitable use for the corridor could be as a showpiece Special Stage if the World Rally Championships ever hosted in SA. It would be a suitable tribute to its history as a railway so rough that the old stone train was arriving with the cargo pre-crushed.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
I saw someone quip that the stonie line never needed ballasting, enough stones were shaken out of the train as it travelled that it effectively self ballasted the line.
  Cato56 Station Master


Wonder if Piccolo and his photographer had Network Access and appropriate competencies to be working in the corridor taking photos, or is old mate above the law?
  8502 Chief Train Controller

Regardless of the situation of the track in doing what they are doing is not a great look and does show the public how they treat rail in that state which is quite poorly.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
The public have treated that line with great indifference, there is little reason to treat it better than it has been.
  Rossco T Chief Train Controller

Location: Camberwell, Victoria
The public have treated that line with great indifference, there is little reason to treat it better than it has been.
Aaron
This article makes reference to Red Hen carriages recently being purchased to be transported back to Adelaide from Victoria to operate on the Barossa Line.

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/from-korumburra-to-adelaide-the-final-journey-of-the-last-red-hens

That sounds like a lot of money to be spending on something that may not eventuate when the SA Government is removing sections of the line.

Ross
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
The public have treated that line with great indifference, there is little reason to treat it better than it has been.
This article makes reference to Red Hen carriages recently being purchased to be transported back to Adelaide from Victoria to operate on the Barossa Line.

https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/from-korumburra-to-adelaide-the-final-journey-of-the-last-red-hens

That sounds like a lot of money to be spending on something that may not eventuate when the SA Government is removing sections of the line.

Ross
Rossco T
Sometimes investments are a smeg, and people like to forget (especially when it suits them) that just because you make an investment doesn’t mean you’re entitled to a return on it.

Every little article says ‘Oooh, it’s a step closer’, ‘Oooh, it’s another small step closer’ - yeah and every school shooting in the US is a step closer to them having decent gun control/ownership laws, it’s never going to happen.

The train to the Barossa was barely a thing for nearly all of my adult life, and in my adult life you can be assured that I have done well more than my fair share of drinking and wine tours in the Barossa and not once have I considered that the trip/tour would have been enhanced by train.

The BWT doesn’t work for one good reason, it’s just too impractical! Even if you could be bothered driving to the city and paying for parking. Then taking too long to ride the train from Adelaide to Chateau Cardboard you still need to book a tour from there, because you already know you don’t want to stay there for longer than it takes to walk (briskly) from the platform to your waiting tour vehicle, and you need to time your subsequent visits to get back to the cardboard platform for your slow train home, then be assuredly sober enough to find your car and drive home again.

Far easier just to book an end to end tour from your home, my friends and I must have done it near fifty of times. 20 odd friends, one charter bus, no timetable to speak of, and at least one of my friends can drink so much she forgets where she lives (she was going through a tough time). Want an unscheduled, unbooked and unannounced dinner at your friend’s restaurant in the city? Ask the driver, give him a $200 tip, shout him his meal and everyone is happy.
  Yappo Locomotive Fireman

Correct decision.

In the event of there existing a legitimate plan to use the Barossa line again and the proponent handling the restoration of the rest of the route, the government can reinstate the crossing and it will be one of the smallest hurdles to overcome. Same goes for the Kroemer Crossing roundabout, which was built at track level to cater for future railway use.

Can't really say it is a correct decision as it really makes no difference to leave it there.

However, I agree that it is a minor issue should the suburban line ever be extended a couple of stations to Gawler East and Concordia in the next 20 years. Perhaps, thereafter onwards to Lynton as the pop grows? Housing price pressures elsewhere in Adelaide will result in political pressure to open up new, more affordable housing sites around greater Gawler regardless of the current planning restrictions thus creating greater demand for PT.

Such an extension to Concordia would not be dissimilar to the Seaford line being extended to Aldinga which should happen in around 10 years. Eventually, in the next 20-30 years it makes a lot of sense to have alternating services via Gawler to both Roseworthy and Concordia running semi express to/from Adelaide.
  theanimal Chief Commissioner


Wonder if Piccolo and his photographer had Network Access and appropriate competencies to be working in the corridor taking photos, or is old mate above the law?
Cato56
Standing on a pedestrian level crossing so all the photo tells us is that you do not know what you are talking about.
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
The photographer(s) is not on the crossing.
  Cato56 Station Master


Wonder if Piccolo and his photographer had Network Access and appropriate competencies to be working in the corridor taking photos, or is old mate above the law?
Standing on a pedestrian level crossing so all the photo tells us is that you do not know what you are talking about.
theanimal

1) The photographer is not on the crossing

2) Pedestrians are allowed to cross the corridor at designated points - this does not mean individuals are allowed to work in the rail corridor at these points i.e. undertaking a photoshoot. The fact that you think you can work at a pedestrian crossing (even from a place of safety, which this is not!) shows you have zero experience working in the rail corridor or understanding of safeworking.
  theanimal Chief Commissioner


Wonder if Piccolo and his photographer had Network Access and appropriate competencies to be working in the corridor taking photos, or is old mate above the law?
Standing on a pedestrian level crossing so all the photo tells us is that you do not know what you are talking about.

1) The photographer is not on the crossing

2) Pedestrians are allowed to cross the corridor at designated points - this does not mean individuals are allowed to work in the rail corridor at these points i.e. undertaking a photoshoot. The fact that you think you can work at a pedestrian crossing (even from a place of safety, which this is not!) shows you have zero experience working in the rail corridor or understanding of safeworking.
Cato56
I have recently retired after 46 years in the rail industry, across Australia, including working in South Australia. Some of the roles I have had has been as a Train Control Supervisor, Safeworking Rules Manager, represented NSW on the National Rules Committee, A Senior Rail Safety Officer for the Rail Regulator, operational specialist for the Sydney Metro,   So your assumption is incorrect.

The line beyond Gawler was booked out of use in June 2014. Prior to that the Train Control Function was under GWA accreditation.

With the line under engineering control and ergo no passenger traffic to Gawler what is the risk you are trying to invent?

If you feel that strongly, have you reported this risky behaviour?

Is your name Karen?
  Cato56 Station Master


Wonder if Piccolo and his photographer had Network Access and appropriate competencies to be working in the corridor taking photos, or is old mate above the law?
Standing on a pedestrian level crossing so all the photo tells us is that you do not know what you are talking about.

1) The photographer is not on the crossing

2) Pedestrians are allowed to cross the corridor at designated points - this does not mean individuals are allowed to work in the rail corridor at these points i.e. undertaking a photoshoot. The fact that you think you can work at a pedestrian crossing (even from a place of safety, which this is not!) shows you have zero experience working in the rail corridor or understanding of safeworking.
I have recently retired after 46 years in the rail industry, across Australia, including working in South Australia. Some of the roles I have had has been as a Train Control Supervisor, Safeworking Rules Manager, represented NSW on the National Rules Committee, A Senior Rail Safety Officer for the Rail Regulator, operational specialist for the Sydney Metro,   So your assumption is incorrect.

The line beyond Gawler was booked out of use in June 2014. Prior to that the Train Control Function was under GWA accreditation.

With the line under engineering control and ergo no passenger traffic to Gawler what is the risk you are trying to invent?

If you feel that strongly, have you reported this risky behaviour?

Is your name Karen?
theanimal

It's not up to individuals accessing the corridor to decide whether they need to apply for access or not.

This is like saying SAPTA or KDA workers can elect to not apply for network access in situations they deem to be low risk, which is simply ridiculous.

Edit -  Like seriously, what an absolutely stupid assertion that because there are controls in place, which the Honourable Member for Light and his photographer would have zero knowledge of, that he and photographer aren't required to abide by the network rules and procedures on the basis of the level of (perceived) risk.
  62430 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Metro Adelaide

Wonder if Piccolo and his photographer had Network Access and appropriate competencies to be working in the corridor taking photos, or is old mate above the law?
Standing on a pedestrian level crossing so all the photo tells us is that you do not know what you are talking about.

1) The photographer is not on the crossing

2) Pedestrians are allowed to cross the corridor at designated points - this does not mean individuals are allowed to work in the rail corridor at these points i.e. undertaking a photoshoot. The fact that you think you can work at a pedestrian crossing (even from a place of safety, which this is not!) shows you have zero experience working in the rail corridor or understanding of safeworking.
I have recently retired after 46 years in the rail industry, across Australia, including working in South Australia. Some of the roles I have had has been as a Train Control Supervisor, Safeworking Rules Manager, represented NSW on the National Rules Committee, A Senior Rail Safety Officer for the Rail Regulator, operational specialist for the Sydney Metro,   So your assumption is incorrect.

The line beyond Gawler was booked out of use in June 2014. Prior to that the Train Control Function was under GWA accreditation.

With the line under engineering control and ergo no passenger traffic to Gawler what is the risk you are trying to invent?

If you feel that strongly, have you reported this risky behaviour?

Is your name Karen?
theanimal
The photo under discussion must be several years old as evidenced by the yellow front to the DEMU in the background, which was presumably in passenger service.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
I think that image might have been from 2013 when he was doing a shoot for the Gawler and Munno Para upgrades, ahead of the 2014 election campaign.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Can't really say it is a correct decision as it really makes no difference to leave it there.

However, I agree that it is a minor issue should the suburban line ever be extended a couple of stations to Gawler East and Concordia in the next 20 years.
Yappo
I believe the track is rooted (it had a 15 km/h “temporary” speed restriction last time it was in use) and would therefore need to be rebuilt if the railway was to be rebuilt to allow for through traffic from the DIT network, so no point keeping it there when it can’t be used.

The pedestrian gates are an unnecessary imposition on the movement of locals and should definitely be removed.

Worth noting that the last “plan” for the railway wasn’t actually a plan for the railway but just an attempt by a particular business owner (whose name I won’t publicise unless I am paid for my advertising services) to hinder transport upgrades that would be beneficial to his competitors.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
What a storm In a shot glass, whinging and moning about a photographer possibly standing a couple of metres away from a pedestrian crossing on a disused track.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
I don’t care in general, but that photo was taken ahead of the 2014 state election, that election occurred whilst the line was ‘operational’, ergo, he shouldn’t have been there.
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville
I don’t care in general, but that photo was taken ahead of the 2014 state election, that election occurred whilst the line was ‘operational’, ergo, he shouldn’t have been there.
Aaron

Unless he had an accredited safeworking officer accompanying him and the photographer.

But you weren't there, and most likely neither was anyone else from RP.

We'll never know, but the self appointed guardians of the permanent away can always arrange a lynch mob if it will make them feel any better Razz
  Yappo Locomotive Fireman

Can't really say it is a correct decision as it really makes no difference to leave it there.

However, I agree that it is a minor issue should the suburban line ever be extended a couple of stations to Gawler East and Concordia in the next 20 years.
I believe the track is rooted (it had a 15 km/h “temporary” speed restriction last time it was in use) and would therefore need to be rebuilt if the railway was to be rebuilt to allow for through traffic from the DIT network, so no point keeping it there when it can’t be used.

The pedestrian gates are an unnecessary imposition on the movement of locals and should definitely be removed.
justapassenger
No. Don't remove the pedestrian crossing or the rail. Leaving it reminds people that trains used to pass here, the more infastructure that is removed the more people forget this fact. Keeping remnants of previous active lines helps to pyschologically build the case for reopening rather than stripping everything away.  No matter how seemingly insignificant it is, that "unnecessary imposition" reminds people everytime they cross here that trains could return.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
I don’t care in general, but that photo was taken ahead of the 2014 state election, that election occurred whilst the line was ‘operational’, ergo, he shouldn’t have been there.

Unless he had an accredited safeworking officer accompanying him and the photographer.

But you weren't there, and most likely neither was anyone else from RP.

We'll never know, but the self appointed guardians of the permanent away can always arrange a lynch mob if it will make them feel any better Razz
bingley hall
Like I said, I don’t much care, maybe I should have better emphasised the first words in my post, but I also don’t think the disused/closed line justification is a good one.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Can't really say it is a correct decision as it really makes no difference to leave it there.

However, I agree that it is a minor issue should the suburban line ever be extended a couple of stations to Gawler East and Concordia in the next 20 years.
I believe the track is rooted (it had a 15 km/h “temporary” speed restriction last time it was in use) and would therefore need to be rebuilt if the railway was to be rebuilt to allow for through traffic from the DIT network, so no point keeping it there when it can’t be used.

The pedestrian gates are an unnecessary imposition on the movement of locals and should definitely be removed.
No. Don't remove the pedestrian crossing or the rail. Leaving it reminds people that trains used to pass here, the more infastructure that is removed the more people forget this fact. Keeping remnants of previous active lines helps to pyschologically build the case for reopening rather than stripping everything away.  No matter how seemingly insignificant it is, that "unnecessary imposition" reminds people everytime they cross here that trains could return.
Yappo
A psychological case? Yeah, I’d rather it be an engineering and economic case than a psychological case. There are already enough ‘psychological cases’ flogging dead horses in rail, just a few of them are in SARRA or whatever they call themselves, others are at Tanunda or are buying rail cars they don’t have a business case for.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

If the pedestrian chicanes are to be kept as a monument to a bygone era, they can be relocated off to the side of the footpath. You can have both your monument to the railway and convenient pedestrian access for Gawler locals.

And as a bonus, these pedestrian chicanes are the old narrow type so they can also double as a monument to the age when people with physical disabilities were held in institutions and their participation in society outlawed. Perhaps the set off to one side of the crossing could have a plaque attached memorialising the railway, and the other have plaques attached memorialising the victims of institutional abuse.

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