Russia vs. Ukraine - Potential War?

 
Topic moved from The Lounge by dthead on 17 Feb 2022 16:36
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Source, or it didn’t happen! Just like the Russian cut off of gas!

I don’t go tracking down your ‘sources’.
Have you ever considered the fact that this information is buried away proves me right?
don_dunstan
No.

I only consider the fact that you have not presented it. This suggests to me that you're either making it up, getting it from click bait, or have misinterpreted something real - perhaps you've realised this and are too afraid to admit it? Don't be, you have no credibility to lose at this point.

You've admitted to falling for click bait before, I see no reason to not believe you've not done it since.

I also consider that if you were in possession of some secret facts that you must have read them somewhere, and a simple 'ctrl-c', 'ctrl-v' of the link would be both quicker and easier than typing out all of your assertions of truth and knowledge.

All of that totaled up leads me conclude that you're about as dim as a 25W lamp when viewed in broad daylight.

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  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA

Fixed it for you.
Yeah because it's much, much easier to gobble up the pre-digested news-bites saying he's a hero than to look beyond the official narrative and realise that Zelenesky is a crook who headed up a dysfunctional, broken country that was conducting an ethnic cleansing.
don_dunstan
Again, you have no info from after 2019.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Source, or it didn’t happen! Just like the Russian cut off of gas!

I don’t go tracking down your ‘sources’.
Have you ever considered the fact that this information is buried away proves me right? The fact that they don't want the public to know what the real narrative is behind this war shows that I'm on the money.

There was a pogrom going on against Russian speaking people and it accelerated after 2014. Twice Ukraine agreed to stop its pogrom and twice it failed.

don_dunstan
Do you realise how much of a joke you are becoming in this thread.

"The information hard to find, so this proves me right?"

You finished it with a question mark, which means you are asking the question and lack confidence what you are saying enough to make it a statement.

On other subjects, to apply your logic;

If I believe Aliens run our govt, I googled it, but its hard to find, so I must be right.

If I believe Atlas, son of Titan is holding up the Earth, but its hard to find, so I must be right.

etc
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
Source, or it didn’t happen! Just like the Russian cut off of gas!

I don’t go tracking down your ‘sources’.
Have you ever considered the fact that this information is buried away proves me right?
No.

I only consider the fact that you have not presented it. This suggests to me that you're either making it up, getting it from click bait, or have misinterpreted something real - perhaps you've realised this and are too afraid to admit it? Don't be, you have no credibility to lose at this point.

You've admitted to falling for click bait before, I see no reason to not believe you've not done it since.

I also consider that if you were in possession of some secret facts that you must have read them somewhere, and a simple 'ctrl-c', 'ctrl-v' of the link would be both quicker and easier than typing out all of your assertions of truth and knowledge.

All of that totaled up leads me conclude that you're about as dim as a 25W lamp when viewed in broad daylight.
Aaron
It was none other than the United Nations - they presented a comprehensive report about what had happened in eastern Ukraine after the Euromaidan revolution in 2014 and it was almost completely ignored by the West. They catalogued what Azov had done including evicting 700,000 ethnic Russians from their homes and killing many thousands of civilians - the use of cluster bombs in urban areas, detention and torture of suspects, punishments for whole towns and cities by cutting off water and power.

I wanted you to see if you could find it because of that very reason - it's ignored.

Anyway, believe what you want. You're an all-seeing all-knowing omnipotent God after all so you know what I'm going to write even before I write it.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
You've admitted to falling for click bait before, I see no reason to not believe you've not done it since.
It wasn't really click-bait, they said the pipeline had stopped and I concluded incorrectly (as they did at ZeroHedge) that sanctions had started. In fact Russia is pumping more gas than ever to a compliant Europe.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
Never heard a peep because these numbers are BS.
No, very much real. It's out there, but not well publicised, not well discussed because it's not the story they want to tell.

An innocent nation with a hero President is a much more romantically compelling story.
Don't hit Don with details, he's content with his own fantasies.
See the really funny thing is here that I keep pointing you people in the direction of where the pathogenisis of this war lies but none of you are interested in it because it might prove me right.

You're tying yourself in knots to NOT look up stuff that I've been talking about. "Oh geez, what if Don Dunstan is actually right?"
Don, I think the general view of your posts here are Pro-Putin and has nothing Putin says in Russia has any credibility, neither do you on anything Russia or Ukraine. You also have a history in this thread of getting so much wrong including even the year Zelensky was elected to govt.

Its not publicised because its complete BS. Prior to the latest invasion most of the world would not have even known who the Ukrainian President wa, what any internal conflict may have been about or even where Ukraine was.

The only funny thing here how much of a sad joke your comments in this thread have become.
Don pots, "Where did I say I'm a Putin Supporter"
Don then goes to post anti Zelensky / pro Putin material.

I'm sure you are just itching to sign off your posts with a 'Z'

No one is interested in what you have to say about this war because your views are clearly biased, you conviently ignore any hard posts against your propaganda, you have never opposed the invasion and you have never opposed the autrocities against the Ukrainian people which is now includes 10,000's of civilians dead, Over 1m displaced, over 100,000 forced to move to Russia. Even on the Russian side there is now close to 20,000 Russian soliders dead and many times more injuried and yet you for reasons you only know, support this.
RTT_Rules
You support a system that keeps people as slaves - that bashes, rapes and maims people from the developing world.

Do you have slaves come over to your house and clean it while you're at work? Probably don't even give it a second thought, do you.

Poor Filipino women who get raped and bashed by their employers and then deported for complaining - Indian men who are kept as indentured slaves and treated as utterly disposable.

But you're okay with all of that - right?

And you have the bald-faced hypocrisy to tell me that I'm morally wrong - you directly benefit from the exploitation of others in a really ruthless and immoral way.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
You've admitted to falling for click bait before, I see no reason to not believe you've not done it since.
It wasn't really click-bait, they said the pipeline had stopped and I concluded incorrectly (as they did at ZeroHedge) that sanctions had started. In fact Russia is pumping more gas than ever to a compliant Europe.
don_dunstan
It was you that called it click bait - not me.

Maybe that should tell you that you need to stop reading ZeroHedge...

I managed to tell you straight away that what ZeroHedge and you concluded was certainly not the case, even when confronted with a graph supplied by someone else showing a recent peak in gas flow to Europe from Russia you still tried to claim that the gas was cut off.

Like I said, you have zero credibility, and I am still not wasting my time looking for info that you cannot even be bothered copying into the thread.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
You support a system that keeps people as slaves - that bashes, rapes and maims people from the developing world.
don_dunstan
No Don, the only person here supporting Russia is ... you! What you are describing is what Russia is doing...
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
You support a system that keeps people as slaves - that bashes, rapes and maims people from the developing world.

Do you have slaves come over to your house and clean it while you're at work? Probably don't even give it a second thought, do you.

Poor Filipino women who get raped and bashed by their employers and then deported for complaining - Indian men who are kept as indentured slaves and treated as utterly disposable.

But you're okay with all of that - right?

And you have the bald-faced hypocrisy to tell me that I'm morally wrong - you directly benefit from the exploitation of others in a really ruthless and immoral way.
don_dunstan
What drugs are you on Don? and what the hell are you on about?
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Ukraine claims to have killed their ninth Russian General, now I don't know if that is true or not, but I do have an important question:

When did Kevin Rudd enlist with the Russian Army?



  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
What drugs are you on Don?
RTT_Rules
My guess, all of them.

what the hell are you on about?
RTT_Rules
Not even he knows.
  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

Ukraine claims to have killed their ninth Russian General, now I don't know if that is true or not, but I do have an important question:

When did Kevin Rudd enlist with the Russian Army?



Aaron
Kevinsky Ruddofsky?
  lsrailfan Minister for Railways

Location: Somewhere you're not
So then Don, where does it say that 700,000 people were cleansed??, I can't find it??
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
You've admitted to falling for click bait before, I see no reason to not believe you've not done it since.
It wasn't really click-bait, they said the pipeline had stopped and I concluded incorrectly (as they did at ZeroHedge) that sanctions had started. In fact Russia is pumping more gas than ever to a compliant Europe.
It was you that called it click bait - not me.

Maybe that should tell you that you need to stop reading ZeroHedge...

I managed to tell you straight away that what ZeroHedge and you concluded was certainly not the case, even when confronted with a graph supplied by someone else showing a recent peak in gas flow to Europe from Russia you still tried to claim that the gas was cut off.

Like I said, you have zero credibility, and I am still not wasting my time looking for info that you cannot even be bothered copying into the thread.
Aaron
ZeroHedge were 100% right about what was happening with Poland last week.

You can't be bothered looking for information because you don't want to prove me right.

And again, why would I care what a random from Railpage thinks, buddy?
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
You support a system that keeps people as slaves - that bashes, rapes and maims people from the developing world.
No Don, the only person here supporting Russia is ... you! What you are describing is what Russia is doing...
Aaron
I'm not supporting Russia, Aaron. RTT_Rules went on a fishing expedition to try and find where I'd written my love letters to Putin earlier in this thread and couldn't find a single thing.

If you think having an interest in the truth is the same thing as supporting Russia then that's your delusion.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
So then Don, where does it say that 700,000 people were cleansed??, I can't find it??
lsrailfan
Again - these things are BURIED. We don't hear about them in the West, the media didn't report on what was happening between 2014-2022. They just weren't interested.

It's like the drug war in Mexico that has claimed 350,000 lives since 2006 and the war in Yemen that has killed 140,000 people in the last ten years... we just don't hear about it. I'm very reluctant to post links on this one particular topic because I want people to realise that even in this day and age there's active censorship of what we see and hear.

Keep digging - search UNHCR reports on Ukraine and even the US State Department. They were publishing stuff during those eight years that spelt out exactly what was going on. And tell us what you find.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
You support a system that keeps people as slaves - that bashes, rapes and maims people from the developing world.

Do you have slaves come over to your house and clean it while you're at work? Probably don't even give it a second thought, do you.

Poor Filipino women who get raped and bashed by their employers and then deported for complaining - Indian men who are kept as indentured slaves and treated as utterly disposable.

But you're okay with all of that - right?

And you have the bald-faced hypocrisy to tell me that I'm morally wrong - you directly benefit from the exploitation of others in a really ruthless and immoral way.
What drugs are you on Don? and what the hell are you on about?
RTT_Rules
You support the keeping of indentured slaves. You use indentured labour. You are a human rights abuser.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
What drugs are you on Don?
My guess, all of them.

what the hell are you on about?
Not even he knows.
Aaron
It's not hard to work you out, Aaron. You constantly want to drag the argument back to where I made minor mistakes because that's where you can win - whereas talking about the behaviour of the Ukranian government between 2014-2022 is something you want to avoid like the plague because you know you can't win.

So you avoid all talk of the precise circumstances that led to the invasion - especially the failure of the Ukranian government to abide by Minsk I & II.
  lsrailfan Minister for Railways

Location: Somewhere you're not
So then Don, where does it say that 700,000 people were cleansed??, I can't find it??
Again - these things are BURIED. We don't hear about them in the West, the media didn't report on what was happening between 2014-2022. They just weren't interested.

It's like the drug war in Mexico that has claimed 350,000 lives since 2006 and the war in Yemen that has killed 140,000 people in the last ten years... we just don't hear about it. I'm very reluctant to post links on this one particular topic because I want people to realise that even in this day and age there's active censorship of what we see and hear.

Keep digging - search UNHCR reports on Ukraine and even the US State Department. They were publishing stuff during those eight years that spelt out exactly what was going on. And tell us what you find.
don_dunstan
I know about the drug war in Mexico, the gangs over there make Al Capone and his gangs look like toy men, I also know about the Houthi Militias over in Yemen.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
So then Don, where does it say that 700,000 people were cleansed??, I can't find it??
Again - these things are BURIED. We don't hear about them in the West, the media didn't report on what was happening between 2014-2022. They just weren't interested.

It's like the drug war in Mexico that has claimed 350,000 lives since 2006 and the war in Yemen that has killed 140,000 people in the last ten years... we just don't hear about it. I'm very reluctant to post links on this one particular topic because I want people to realise that even in this day and age there's active censorship of what we see and hear.

Keep digging - search UNHCR reports on Ukraine and even the US State Department. They were publishing stuff during those eight years that spelt out exactly what was going on. And tell us what you find.
I know about the drug war in Mexico, the gangs over there make Al Capone and his gangs look like toy men, I also know about the Houthi Militias over in Yemen.
lsrailfan
What's happening in Ukraine is very similar to the Balkans in the 1990's - horribly complicated, racist mass-expulsions of people on a huge scale and odd bit of attempted genocide. Political and religious based violence - the story of civilisation and settlement. Russia got a deep hatred of the Ukrainian leadership after the 2014 Odessa incident where a lot of Russian nationalists were killed.

Estimates vary of how many Russian speakers/loyalists were forced to go to Russia as refugees but UNHCR said in 2016 it was at least 700,000 and maybe a million. I find it astonishing that an ethnic cleansing on that scale was hardly reported at all in the Western media - where was it? These are people who have to move cross border to ensure their own protection and are not doing it voluntarily, lucky they had someone friendly to go right next door or we could have been dealing with an attempted genocide.

Northern Ireland, Yugoslavia, the India/Pakistan division, Israel/Palestine, the Armenian genocide... human history in the 20th and (unfortunately) 21st century is still about attempted genocides and ethnic hatreds. I'm glad you've been following other more recent stuff but you have to see the conflict in Ukraine through the lens of lots of other civil/religious wars, it's an extension of other stuff that's been going on for centuries in that region - it's difficult to assign 'right' and 'wrong' notions to the different sides.

You have an open mind and I know we've clashed on lots of other things but I think you know what I'm saying is right - the complete lack of moral authority of the Ukrainian government is at the core of the problem here. If the rule of law worked in Ukraine then those people should have been afforded the protection of the law. But Ukraine failed - and we're seriously sending them weapons?

C'mon, man!
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
You support a system that keeps people as slaves - that bashes, rapes and maims people from the developing world.

Do you have slaves come over to your house and clean it while you're at work? Probably don't even give it a second thought, do you.

Poor Filipino women who get raped and bashed by their employers and then deported for complaining - Indian men who are kept as indentured slaves and treated as utterly disposable.

But you're okay with all of that - right?

And you have the bald-faced hypocrisy to tell me that I'm morally wrong - you directly benefit from the exploitation of others in a really ruthless and immoral way.
What drugs are you on Don? and what the hell are you on about?
You support the keeping of indentured slaves. You use indentured labour. You are a human rights abuser.
don_dunstan
Another stupid comment from the back blocks of SA keyboard warrior. Where did I say that?

As far as Human Rights are concerned your ongoing support for the Russian Invasion is clear that we know where your support for the preservation of human right is and its not good.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
You support a system that keeps people as slaves - that bashes, rapes and maims people from the developing world.
No Don, the only person here supporting Russia is ... you! What you are describing is what Russia is doing...
I'm not supporting Russia, Aaron. RTT_Rules went on a fishing expedition to try and find where I'd written my love letters to Putin earlier in this thread and couldn't find a single thing.

If you think having an interest in the truth is the same thing as supporting Russia then that's your delusion.
don_dunstan
No need to go into a fishing expedition Don. If you are the fish, you jumped into the boat.

Your Putin worship is never ending posts supporting the invasion or anything proactive to bring it to an end. You have never denouced what Russia is doing as wrong or should they immediately stop.

The truth is no where you are sitting Don.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
So then Don, where does it say that 700,000 people were cleansed??, I can't find it??
Again - these things are BURIED.
don_dunstan
Well you claim to have found it once, DIG IT BACK OUT and post it!

You will not do that, because you cannot do that, because your source is either non existent, click bait, or misinterpreted by you.

That which is asserted without evidence MUST be dismissed without evidence.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
ZeroHedge were 100% right about what was happening with Poland last week.
don_dunstan
Doesn't absolve them, or YOU, from being 100% wrong a week or two ago.

Maybe they learned their lesson (which you have not) and republished info from a decent source, instead of trying to draw their own conclusions.

You can't be bothered looking for information because you don't want to prove me right.
don_dunstan
Fixed.

It is YOUR job to post YOUR 'evidence' - it is not up to the rest of us to verify your fantasy world.

It is up to YOU to prove yourself right, nobody else.

Do you recall your dumb little picture highlighting all of the things you thought Zelenskyy was responsible for? I looked up all of that (well, already knew much of it) and showed you line by line how you were wrong. Do you remember when you told us Zelenskyy had fled Ukraine?

I am not looking anything up for you, you either post legitimate links for us investigate or accept that we will not believe you.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
And again, why would I care what a random from Railpage thinks, buddy?
don_dunstan
Well, there's 25 pages in this thread alone, most (possibly all) of those pages would contain a post from you, most of those posts contain you trying to defend your own smeg.

I am not a psychologist, (and I think you need psychiatrist) but to attempt a layperson's answer to your question, I would say 'You want to appear as though you're clever or smart, but you aren't, so now you have to keep going, trying to appear as though you know something', additionally, in addition to the clear evidence that you do care, 'You appear to care quite a lot!'

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