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tasrail2100
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jul 24, 2004
Last Visited: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Brisbane, Queensland.
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Posted: Sat Jul 24, 2004 12:20 pm
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does anybody know if pacific national are going to continue updating the current fleet of locomotives in tasmania?
the situation has been a joke for a very long time with many locomotives not being compatible with other classes.
wisconsin took a small step towards rectifying the problem with the D's and DC's, DQ's etc from qld, NZ and WA, but they were not around long enough to finish the job.
i have two different stories on what PN will do in regards to new locomotives, they are
-that PN is going to place an order for some high powered narrow gauge locomotives for their queensland operation, and send some of the units down
-or that PN is considering gauge converting the old AN/NR DL class locomotives. i am not sure if this would be much help seeing as the locomotives are not exactly new, and i would have to question their ability to fit through the tunnel on the south line. if they were unable to do this and PN was to go ahead, this would only add to the incompatibility of the locomotive fleet, correct?
if anyone could confirm or otherwise these stories or maybe have heard other ones as to what PN is going to do with the tasmanian fleet, it would be interesting to know.
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Vulcan Foundry
Assistant Commissioner
Joined: Jan 24, 2003
Last Visited: Apr 18, 2006
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Posted: Sun Jul 25, 2004 10:27 am
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| tasrail2100 wrote: | does anybody know if pacific national are going to continue updating the current fleet of locomotives in tasmania?
the situation has been a joke for a very long time with many locomotives not being compatible with other classes.
wisconsin took a small step towards rectifying the problem with the D's and DC's, DQ's etc from qld, NZ and WA, but they were not around long enough to finish the job.
i have two different stories on what PN will do in regards to new locomotives, they are
-that PN is going to place an order for some high powered narrow gauge locomotives for their queensland operation, and send some of the units down
-or that PN is considering gauge converting the old AN/NR DL class locomotives. i am not sure if this would be much help seeing as the locomotives are not exactly new, and i would have to question their ability to fit through the tunnel on the south line. if they were unable to do this and PN was to go ahead, this would only add to the incompatibility of the locomotive fleet, correct?
if anyone could confirm or otherwise these stories or maybe have heard other ones as to what PN is going to do with the tasmanian fleet, it would be interesting to know. |
I would imagine that a fleet upgrade or new additions will happen at some stage, but when is anybody's guess. As far as the D's, DC's and DQ's not being around long enough to do the job, the two D's still operate as do many of the DQ's although the DC died a couple of years ago and is yet to see the mainline since that time.
The locomotives would not have to be new, just reliable with minimum compatability problems and of course clearance issues would have to also be taken into account. The locomotives that PN have ordered for Qld are far too big to operate here I would imagine, so any motive power moved here may be along the lines of the 48 class or of models of a slightly larger size.
Time will tell. 
"To err is human. To blame somebody else for it shows managerial potential"
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tasrail2100
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jul 24, 2004
Last Visited: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Brisbane, Queensland.
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Posted: Sun Jul 25, 2004 12:15 pm
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sorry i should have said that little bit differently, i meant that wisconsin were not around long enough to finish the job of replacing the locomotive fleet.
also, dont you think that the fact that tasmania does not get new locomotives puts our railways behind?
most of my mates simply can not believe that trains on the mainland can travel in excess of 100km/h. i know this is mostly to do with the poor quality of the track but it does go to show the poor image most tasmanians have of their railways.
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d1565
Assistant Commissioner
Joined: Jul 31, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 23, 2008
Location: Perth
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Posted: Mon Jul 26, 2004 12:57 pm
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If you guy's don't want them, we'll have our D class loco's back anytime! 
Craig Belcher
Castledare Miniature Railway
Committee Member,
Per-Way super,
and an enthusiast of big loco's.
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awsgc24
Minister for Railways
Joined: Feb 18, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 23, 2008
Location: Sydney, NSW
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Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:12 pm
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| tasrail2100 wrote: | Does anybody know if pacific national are going to continue updating the current fleet of locomotives in tasmania?
The situation has been a joke for a very long time with many locomotives not being compatible with other classes.
Wisconsin took a small step towards rectifying the problem with the D's and DC's, DQ's etc from qld, NZ and WA, but they were not around long enough to finish the job.
I have two different stories on what PN will do in regards to new locomotives, they are:
-that PN is going to place an order for some high powered narrow gauge locomotives for their Queensland operation, and send some of the units down
-or that PN is considering gauge converting the old AN/NR DL class locomotives. I am not sure if this would be much help seeing as the locomotives are not exactly new, and I would have to question their ability to fit through the tunnel on the south line. If they were unable to do this and PN was to go ahead, this would only add to the incompatibility of the locomotive fleet, correct?
if anyone could confirm or otherwise these stories or maybe have heard other ones as to what PN is going to do with the tasmanian fleet, it would be interesting to know. |
The Risdon (?) tunnel in Tasmania was widened out in the 1970's for 8' high containers, but as 9' 6" high shipping containers become popular, it might be desirable to widen out the tunnel again. The widening should also be made to suit bigger engines.
Low axle load locomotives are also needed in NSW for many branch lines with light 30kg/m track.
What might be useful is a light locomotive that can increase and decrease its axle load at will by pumping a suitable fluid to and from an adjoining wagon.
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Riccardo
Minister for Railways
Joined: Aug 20, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 22, 2008
Location: Elsewhere
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Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:25 pm
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| awsgc24 wrote: |
What might be useful is a light locomotive that can increase and decrease its axle load at will by pumping a suitable fluid to and from an adjoining wagon. |
They used to have them. They actually also used that liquid to generate steam, which was created by burning coal. It was not a good system though, with 2 staff members required to operate the locomotive, multiple unit operation did not help, and the stops to replenish liquid added to the journey time.
But the thought counts!
If you need to get in touch, drop a comment at the Transport Textbook or on my blog.
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tasrail
Moderator
Joined: Jan 14, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 23, 2008
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
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Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:42 pm
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| awsgc24 wrote: | | The Risdon (?) tunnel in Tasmania was widened out in the 1970's for 8' high containers, but as 9' 6" high shipping containers become popular, it might be desirable to widen out the tunnel again. The widening should also be made to suit bigger engines. |
Lots of rumors re locos, but they are not the priority for Tasrail from what I've heard.
Rhyndaston Tunnel can easily take 10'6" high containers (remember SeaPack anyone?) on any type of flatwagon, and has done since the late 70s when they first tried it. I think these containers are still in use in Toll Tasmania colours with domestic only markings.
I think (relatively) powerful/heavy locos are needed for the long distance service's, not more branchline locos like the DQs or 48s. The stored ZB locos should have been slowly converted to more ZRs rather than selling them whole or letting them go down hill like ZB4/ZA4 (the hi-ad bogies on this loco would make this an excellent loco with traction control).
Stuart
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awsgc24
Minister for Railways
Joined: Feb 18, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 23, 2008
Location: Sydney, NSW
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Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:51 pm
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| Riccardo wrote: | | awsgc24 wrote: |
What might be useful is a light locomotive that can increase and decrease its axle load at will by pumping a suitable fluid to and from an adjoining wagon. |
They used to have them. They actually also used that liquid to generate steam, which was created by burning coal. It was not a good system though, with 2 staff members required to operate the locomotive, multiple unit operation did not help, and the stops to replenish liquid added to the journey time.
But the thought counts! |
Ah! but the old trick using water to vary the axle load never worked terribly well, since the weight of water on the axles depended on how the engine was steaming and not what axle load need to be. Also, water is possibly (1 tonne per cubic metre) a bit light and requires large tanks. What is needed is a heavier fluid which then needs only small tanks.
What is the density of barites, mercury, and other materials?
The problem of giving lightweight engines lots of power is not easy, particular in the steam era, and it still causes problems it the diesel era, where there are still light tracks.
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DavidB
Site Admin
Joined: Jan 11, 2003
Last Visited: Jan 25, 2007
Location: Canberra
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Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2004 11:17 am
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| tasrail2100 wrote: | | does anybody know if pacific national are going to continue updating the current fleet of locomotives in tasmania? |
Rumours abound that the ex-ATN 830s and some 48s will go to Tasrail. Also possibly some NHTF coal hoppers.
Cheers
David
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Vulcan Foundry
Assistant Commissioner
Joined: Jan 24, 2003
Last Visited: Apr 18, 2006
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Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:13 pm
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| DavidB wrote: | | tasrail2100 wrote: | | does anybody know if pacific national are going to continue updating the current fleet of locomotives in tasmania? |
Rumours abound that the ex-ATN 830s and some 48s will go to Tasrail. Also possibly some NHTF coal hoppers.
Cheers
David |
Gee that'll impress the drivers and workshop boys. They never really liked the 830 class.
"To err is human. To blame somebody else for it shows managerial potential"
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tasrail2100
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jul 24, 2004
Last Visited: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Brisbane, Queensland.
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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2004 6:57 pm
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the 830's would be somewhat of a backward step for tasmania dont u think? seeing as they phased them out in the early 90's. not that there is anythign wrong with an alco, full marks in the sound and smoke department.
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Vulcan Foundry
Assistant Commissioner
Joined: Jan 24, 2003
Last Visited: Apr 18, 2006
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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:33 pm
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| tasrail2100 wrote: | | the 830's would be somewhat of a backward step for tasmania dont u think? seeing as they phased them out in the early 90's. not that there is anythign wrong with an alco, full marks in the sound and smoke department. |
Not to mention that they aren't big on power and would struggle to pull the skin off a custard. 
"To err is human. To blame somebody else for it shows managerial potential"
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mjja
Sir Nigel Gresley
Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 17, 2008
Location: Mount Waverley, Melbourne
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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:38 pm
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They're not bad really. They just keep on going.
But some new locos wouldn't go amiss. How long since Tas got new locos - the ZAs would have been the last I think? That's rather a long time to be subsisting on secondhand motive power.
Happy Gunzelling and remember, "Go by rail!"
Michael Angelico
President, Smart Passengers Inc
(My opinions are my own unless specifically stated.)
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tasrail2100
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jul 24, 2004
Last Visited: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Brisbane, Queensland.
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Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2004 8:25 pm
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lol, lucky we hide behind alias' on this website vulcan, one of my dad's mates owns an 830, i reckon that custard line would make him see red.
yeah i think the ZA's would have been the last new locomotives purchased by tasmania. i think the TGR might have been the first government railway in australia to start upgrading from steam to diesel, can anyone confirm that?
either way it has been a while since their last new purchase.
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mjja
Sir Nigel Gresley
Joined: Jan 13, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 17, 2008
Location: Mount Waverley, Melbourne
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Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:03 pm
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Yes, Tas were the first to dieselise on the main line. SAR and CR were neck-and-neck for first on the North Island.
Happy Gunzelling and remember, "Go by rail!"
Michael Angelico
President, Smart Passengers Inc
(My opinions are my own unless specifically stated.)
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