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Eleven Mile
Assistant Commissioner
Joined: Mar 22, 2006
Last Visited: Aug 6, 2006
Location: Appin
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 7:14 pm
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| DavidB wrote: | | Eleven Mile wrote: | | Yes, we all know that it isn't against the law at the moment as you have stated. |
You're missing the point. I'm not telling you what the law says, I'm telling you what ministers, police and CityRail management have said is the correct course of action.
| Eleven Mile wrote: | | However, suspicious activity will be investigated, as it should be, and as you no doubt would agree. If the official who approached the man taking photos said the he needed to ask permission first, why create a scene, just go with him and get permission, permmission that would have been granted. |
I am not going to go to the SM to get permission because CityRail has advised, in writing, that permission is not required unless the photographs are for a commercial purpose. I am not going to jump through the hoops made up by some employee.
| Eleven Mile wrote: | | People who start quoting laws and telling Railway officials that they are wrong probably will get the third degree, as it is not behaviour that would be expected from just a tourist taking pictures. |
The railway officials (CityRail management) told me, in writing, what I can and can't do and what to do if challenged by staff. It should therefore be up to the same officials to give their staff the same information.
| Eleven Mile wrote: | | If he requests that you ask permmission, ask it. |
I am not going to request permission because CityRail management, the Minister and police said, in writing, that I don't need to.
| Eleven Mile wrote: | | Remember, they were worried that you were up to no good |
If they are worried I'm up to no good, they are welcome to ask police to investigate. The police know the law.
| Eleven Mile wrote: | | We should all be thankfull that they are keeping a watch over what is going on. |
Correct, they do have a right and responsibility to keep an eye on things and to ask questions. But you are under no obligation to explain your actions beyond "I am a railway enthusiast". They do not have the right to prevent you taking photographs from public places.
| Eleven Mile wrote: | | I've had an AK 47 machine gun pointed at me overseas |
We're talking about Australia, not overseas.
| Eleven Mile wrote: | | Lighten up, and help keep us as safe as we can by helping these people, and if they say you need to see the SM, just go and tell him what you're up too, don't go quoting Hansard. |
The quote in Hansard was a direct result of an over officious transit employee claiming that photography was banned. The Minister was setting the record straight.
Cheers
David |
Technically, you are no doubt right on all counts, however it all gets back to the fact that if they ask you to go to the SM and get permission and you start an arguement quoting by-laws or reading hansard, you are going to get into hot water.
It is all a personal choice however, you can stand there and make a right old scene quoting whatever you like and telling them how stupid they are for not reading hansard , while i go to the SM and have a good old gas bag with him and probably walk out of there with him thinking he doesn't seem a bad sort of bloke.
Common courtesy, and show a little interest in the other person, a thing that is lacking in today's world!
Cheers, Edward.
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banko_boy
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Apr 11, 2006
Last Visited: Sep 3, 2006
Location: Near Banko
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 7:24 pm
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Geez you buggers like to rat on. We're all on the same side here so give it a rest guys. Or should I say girls, cause you're acting like a pack of school girls right now.
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doridori
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Sep 21, 2005
Last Visited: Nov 18, 2008
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 10:02 pm
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| banko_boy wrote: | | Geez you buggers like to rat on. We're all on the same side here so give it a rest guys. Or should I say girls, cause you're acting like a pack of school girls right now. |
here here
sad to say, yet some woud argue over the wrongful placement of an exclamation mark here !
sad when were all supposivelly adults or supervised by adults...
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biqua
Paper Tiger
Joined: May 10, 2005
Last Visited: Nov 23, 2008
Location: SRA Survey No. 14032
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Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 10:06 pm
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| doridori wrote: | | sad to say, yet some woud argue over the wrongful placement of an exclamation mark here ! |
Ah ... the exclaimation mark should be here   
Sorry, I couldn't resist. 
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WaterfallDJ
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Mar 17, 2005
Last Visited: Jun 20, 2006
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Posted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:24 am
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| biqua wrote: | | WaterfallDJ wrote: | | What would a terrorist do with them anyway? Get a voodoo doctor to stick pins in them after a sacred ritual? |
You never know ... maybe that's why some trains leak when it's raining. |
What do you mean, some? 
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chrisr001
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jan 22, 2003
Last Visited: Jun 3, 2008
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 4:19 pm
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hi all
well thanks for the info, but here is my story of central
was there on wednesday to take some shots before the IP left
started down the end of platform 1 and made my way up to the terminal.
passed a group of railcorp people (with orange vests) who gave me a werid look, but it was more of the 'why the hell is he taking photos of trains' than the terror look (i think being in a buisness shirt helped)
so went up to the top of P1, and saw a G set in P3.
without hiding anything, went to within 3mrt of the end white fence and took a shot, only to have the driver say 'you can't take shots without permission', and someone else (another driver) say 'sorry mate, he's right'
so to calm the situation, gave him a wave and said 'sorry bout that'
and then went for a walk round central, and got some food (that cafe at the end of the station is half decient food, though the prices are high)
on the way back, stoped off at the information desk, and spoke to the chap in there.
with camera clearly visable, i said
"hi
while i'm waiting for the IP, do you mind if i take some shots of the trains and the area"
he thought about it for a minute and said
"ah, should be alright mate"
so now i had my permission and hansard
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but the worst part about it is that then the IP came in, so i ran (yes ran) over to P1 and started aiming at the IP. at which point 2 security guards (the ones in black) went past SAYING NOTHING
then i went back and sat down on the end seats untill another train came into P3, so stood up and started shooting again. just as i sat down, another 2 guards went past, and as they had come down the terminal would have seen me the whole time, and they too SAID NOTHING
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and then when inside the IP, took another hundred shots with full protection of being inside the train 
******************
so after all of that, if they think that people with cameras are as dangerous as rubbish bins, then someone needs to tell them (railcorp and staff) that hansard have made taking photos LEGAL, as they don't know that you can
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biqua
Paper Tiger
Joined: May 10, 2005
Last Visited: Nov 23, 2008
Location: SRA Survey No. 14032
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 5:36 pm
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| chrisr001 wrote: | | so after all of that, if they think that people with cameras are as dangerous as rubbish bins ... |
Great comparison. 
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ned2306
Station Master
Joined: Apr 21, 2006
Last Visited: Jul 6, 2006
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 6:41 pm
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i dont see why there should be any problems taking photos if its legal to see it with your own eyes
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greenkayaker
Minister for Railways
Joined: Sep 20, 2005
Last Visited: Nov 20, 2008
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chrisr001
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jan 22, 2003
Last Visited: Jun 3, 2008
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biqua
Paper Tiger
Joined: May 10, 2005
Last Visited: Nov 23, 2008
Location: SRA Survey No. 14032
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:16 pm
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A remote controlled rubbish bin following staff around the concourse was an idea that sprung to mind after thinking about that one some more.  
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chrisr001
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jan 22, 2003
Last Visited: Jun 3, 2008
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Posted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:24 pm
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all i will say is this
there are still bins at central station
but they are in a bad location safety wise .......
(as you have to walk around tables and other people to get to them ....)
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chrisr001
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jan 22, 2003
Last Visited: Jun 3, 2008
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albert3801
Chief Commissioner
Joined: May 05, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 14, 2008
Location: Werrington, NSW
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Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:34 am
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| joe wrote: | | Olympic Park was a different story |
One thing to bear in mind is that Olympic Park and stations on the Aiport Line are are than your average CityRail stations and also have other sets of rules applying to them from their governing bodies (ie they are not under full control of Railcorp).
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albert3801
Chief Commissioner
Joined: May 05, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 14, 2008
Location: Werrington, NSW
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Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 4:42 am
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| chrisr001 wrote: | so went up to the top of P1, and saw a G set in P3.
without hiding anything, went to within 3mrt of the end white fence and took a shot, only to have the driver say 'you can't take shots without permission', and someone else (another driver) say 'sorry mate, he's right'
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There are restrictions on photography that include people - so make sure that the driver is not sitting in his cab when you take a close up of the train. Many drivers would not like to be in photos where they can be identified in case the photos are being taken to show to management.
I would say those drivers are not so much concerned with security but the possibility that those photos could be used against them by management etc.
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