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ZoomRail
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Jan 31, 2007
Last Visited: Jun 6, 2008
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Posted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 11:56 pm
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Hi,
There are a lot of gimme pigs, etc... out there. People tell them to try and make their own models, routes, etc, for MSTS.
I'm thinking about making some Melbourne EMU's (/me gets chased by gimme pigs). I want to contribute to the community by releasing these and also get help on things I cannot do by my self (e.g. sounds)
I want to be sure that I am clear on who I must contact. If I was to make an X'Trapolis, my understanding is that I must contact the following entities and get written permission...
- Connex for their liveries
- Alstom for the train because it is a 'functional replica'
- Any one who records the sounds, etc...
Is this correct? Another question to Alltrains, if I was to release a MSTS X'Trap, what would you do? Would you ask me if I had obtained permission? Would you send inquiries to Connex and Alstom?
Thanks,
ZoomRail
Melbourne PT is finally improving. This Brumby guy seems to be doing a good job...
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steam4me
Deputy Commissioner
Joined: Mar 07, 2003
Last Visited: Jun 25, 2008
Location: Port Melbourne, Victoria
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Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 7:16 am
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| ZoomRail wrote: | If I was to make an X'Trapolis, my understanding is that I must contact the following entities and get written permission...
- Connex for their liveries
- Alstom for the train because it is a 'functional replica'
- Any one who records the sounds, etc...
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All this is on the assumption you wish to distribute the model. None of this applies for "personal use".
Unless the X'Trapolis is a registered design, one could argue that it is a product capable of being mass-produced and is therefore not subject to copyright protection. That is my reading of the various Acts.
Definition: A trade mark can be a word, phrase, letter, number, sound, smell, shape, logo, picture, aspect of packaging or a combination of these. A registered trade mark gives you the legal right to use, license or sell it within Australia for the goods and services for which it is registered.
Interestingly, and therefore confusingly, the name Connex is a registered trademark, but for a US telecommunications company, not for a transport service. And this particular Connex has sought registration under Class 9, the class concerned with computer hardware, software (including games downloadable from the internet). OTOH, transport service game simulation is not part of their business model, but they are registered under class 9. And anything you create is not going to diminish their likely income. See, nothing's simple.
If you're planning to distribute a model, contact Connex (by phone) and speak to their corporate identity and/or brand protection people. You'll most likely find them helpful and co-operative and probably even dismissive. But you've asked - that's the important thing: record details of date/time and to whom you spoke.
I've found some copyright holders just say "yeah, go ahead". Others have asked for screenshots of models to "run past our legal people" and have then given permission. And bear in mind that the various bits of copyright legislation all emphasise that you must not diminish the honour or reputation of the copyright holder of an image or mark.
If someone records the sounds for you, they own the copyright, which you probably should acknowledge in any accompanying documentation.
| ZoomRail wrote: | | if I was to release a MSTS X'Trap, what would you do? |
Wrong question. We've just alerted you to the necessary legislative provisions. You make the decisions on what you do and accept responsibility. No-one here is going to "dob you in".
In all probability, nothing will happen. I don't know. YMMV. I can say, however, that several of the companies I've spoken to, know me through my website and are aware of what was on the web: they were pleased I'd contacted them and have given permission for use of their logo. So don't necessarily think you can "fly under the radar".
The copyright legislation is a mongrel kowtow to the US companies seeking more aggressive copyright protection and IMHO has gone too far. But it's the law and you have to learn to deal with it.
Interesting article here: http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/index.php/authid;64929461
HTH.
Now my head hurts....... again.
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ZoomRail
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Jan 31, 2007
Last Visited: Jun 6, 2008
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Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 7:55 am
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Thank you very much, Steam4Me.
Melbourne PT is finally improving. This Brumby guy seems to be doing a good job...
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Alltrains
Train Controller
Joined: Aug 13, 2006
Last Visited: Jun 11, 2008
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Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 12:50 pm
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ZoomRail,
My job is not to go snooping around after every Tom, smeg and Harry to see if they have broken the law or not
I do not ask you if you obtained permission or send inquiries to Connex or Astrom.
What I do is wait for Connex or Alstrom to make a complaint about a breach of the law, then I investigate the complaint and if found that there is a breach of the legislation then I prepare a case for the prosecution.
With the new Free Trade Agreement with the USA there are going to be more prosecutions for breaches to the copyright and trademark act's.
People have to realise that they can no longer take and use what ever they like when ever they like without getting permission from the owner first.
Whether it be a car, TV, Design or a Trademark all these items are owned by someone and if you take any of them without permission it is theft and if you get caught then you are teated as a criminal and brought before the courts.
The last paragraph is about the simplest way I can explain how it works.
Cheers
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ZoomRail
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Jan 31, 2007
Last Visited: Jun 6, 2008
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Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 7:36 pm
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Thank you for your response, Alltrains. I will contact the appropriate people, if I choose to release.
Melbourne PT is finally improving. This Brumby guy seems to be doing a good job...
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sp762
Station Staff
Joined: Feb 11, 2003
Last Visited: May 1, 2008
Location: Canberra
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Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:11 pm
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Just for the record, Alltrains is entirely accurate.
It is not his job "...to go snooping around"
http://www.railpage.com.au/f-p1050496.htm#1050496 refers.
Yuri's explanation is entirely accurate, as far as I'm aware.
Weasel Works - Quality rolling stock for the connoisseur. Specialising in narrow gauge, military and industrial!
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PhilChorusch
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Dec 09, 2007
Last Visited: Jul 24, 2008
Location: Goulburn NSW
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Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 1:45 am
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I honestly have to agree here. Because I have once been hassled to build my route "AU_NSW_Regional_And_Intercity" in a hurry by gimmie pigs and the request was very much a pain in the "you know where" and I am also working on afew more projects witch I won't speak about until I get some great progress going. This is a message for the gimmie pigs out there:
Things will be released when we are ready Please try to understand that as we also have our lives to attend too...
Reguards PhilC...
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PavlovsDog
Station Master
Joined: Dec 10, 2007
Last Visited: Jul 24, 2008
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Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 8:31 am
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| PhilChorusch wrote: | This is a message for the gimmie pigs out there:
Things will be released when we are ready Please try to understand that as we also have our lives to attend too...
Reguards PhilC... |
You're joking, right?!?!?!
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michaelgreenhill
Patron Saint of Alcohol
Joined: Jan 17, 1985
Last Visited: Jul 24, 2008
Location: Lost Somewhere In Time
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Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 12:38 pm
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