First FMG ore train

 
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
At 0230 this morning 8/4 a physical rail connection between Cloud Break and the Car Dumper at Anderson Point was completed. There is still some ballasting etc to do but the rails are connected and a train could run from Cloud Break to Anderson Point. Bounce

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  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
The FMG trains are fitted with ECP (Electronically Controlled Pneumatic) Brakes.

* Which Make?

* Power by wire from the loco or axle generators?

* If powered by wire, what do the intercar connectors look like?

* Do they use the same setup as other Pilbara railways?
  M636C Minister for Railways

The FMG trains are fitted with ECP (Electronically Controlled Pneumatic) Brakes.

* Which Make?

* Power by wire from the loco or axle generators?

* If powered by wire, what do the intercar connectors look like?

* Do they use the same setup as other Pilbara railways?
"awsgc24"


Firstly, so far, no other Pilbara railways use ECP braking in normal service (yet).

Assuming that the system is at least interchangeable with the Hunter Valley Interail trains, the power is from the loco via the wire. It is DC and carries a warning of 200 volts.

There are rectangular interlocking connectors with about 7mm diameter pins with conical mating ends, one pin on each connector.

If you look at the photo:

http://www.fmgl.com.au/IRM/content/Images/gallery/145.jpg

I think the connector, mated to a dummy, is seen just to the right (as viewed) of the coupler (but it might be something else - however the Interail connectors are in that location, with the cables crossing under the couplers like brake hoses).

Note in the background of the photo the Mt Newman ore cars in BHPB's Boodarie yard! They are pretty close to allow a connection shortly after Hell freezes over.

M636C
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
The FMG trains are fitted with ECP (Electronically Controlled Pneumatic) Brakes.

* Which Make?

* Power by wire from the loco or axle generators?

* If powered by wire, what do the intercar connectors look like?

* Do they use the same setup as other Pilbara railways?
"awsgc24"


New York Air Brake (part of Knorr Bremse)

Loco

Sort of plastic jumper plug but the action is plug in rather than twist like an airbrake gladhand.

No one else uses ECP in the Pilbara but QR use a home made sort of modified Westinghouse (I think) ECP in the Hunter.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
The FMG trains are fitted with ECP (Electronically Controlled Pneumatic) Brakes.

* Which Make?

* Power by wire from the loco or axle generators?

* If powered by wire, what do the intercar connectors look like?

* Do they use the same setup as other Pilbara railways?
"awsgc24"


Firstly, so far, no other Pilbara railways use ECP braking in normal service (yet).

Assuming that the system is at least interchangeable with the Hunter Valley Interail trains, the power is from the loco via the wire. It is DC and carries a warning of 200 volts.

There are rectangular interlocking connectors with about 7mm diameter pins with conical mating ends, one pin on each connector.

If you look at the photo:

http://www.fmgl.com.au/IRM/content/Images/gallery/145.jpg

I think the connector, mated to a dummy, is seen just to the right (as viewed) of the coupler (but it might be something else - however the Interail connectors are in that location, with the cables crossing under the couplers like brake hoses).

Note in the background of the photo the Mt Newman ore cars in BHPB's Boodarie yard! They are pretty close to allow a connection shortly after Hell freezes over.

M636C
"M636C"


Neither the train pipe nor the ECP cables cross over beneath the coupler. Both run down the same side of the train.
  M636C Minister for Railways


Neither the train pipe nor the ECP cables cross over beneath the coupler. Both run down the same side of the train.
"YM-Mundrabilla"


Looking at the high resolution photo on the FMG website of the first train, 012 appears to have an ECP cable connected to a dummy connector on both sides of the coupler.

This is consistent with a line on one side of basically unidirectional train, but locomotives which can face either way.

M636C
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik

Neither the train pipe nor the ECP cables cross over beneath the coupler. Both run down the same side of the train.
"YM-Mundrabilla"


Looking at the high resolution photo on the FMG website of the first train, 012 appears to have an ECP cable connected to a dummy connector on both sides of the coupler.

This is consistent with a line on one side of basically unidirectional train, but locomotives which can face either way.

M536C
"M636C"


Correct - the locos have ECP jumpers both sides of the coupler as the ore cars are only plumbed down one side.

I could post a photo if I knew how and in this regard before anyone says how easy it is please read the first line below my signature . Rolling Eyes
  Controller Deputy Commissioner

Location: Banjo Country
BHPBIO did trial electronic braking years ago, but did not operate to well....runaway trains etc  Rolling Eyes
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney

Neither the train pipe nor the ECP cables cross over beneath the coupler. Both run down the same side of the train.
"YM-Mundrabilla"


Looking at the high resolution photo on the FMG website of the first train, 012 appears to have an ECP cable connected to a dummy connector on both sides of the coupler.

This is consistent with a line on one side of basically unidirectional train, but locomotives which can face either way.

M536C
"M636C"


Correct - the locos have ECP jumpers both sides of the coupler as the ore cars are only plumbed down one side.

I could post a photo if I knew how and in this regard before anyone says how easy it is please read the first line below my signature . Rolling Eyes
"YM-Mundrabilla"


Does Fortescue (FMG) use a rotary tippler to unload (IIRC two cars at a time) and how does this work with the air brake hoses on one side?
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
Are the Fortescue (FMG) ore cars painted so that it is clear which end and which side points in the correct direction to suit the rotary ore unloader  Question
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
FYI the port has been renamed Port Herb Elliot after the Olympic runner who is also FMG Chairman.  Before the crash he owned a lot of shares ($20m) but lost half of them due to the failure of his stockbroker.
  Controller Deputy Commissioner

Location: Banjo Country
FYI the port has been renamed Port Herb Elliot after the Olympic runner who is also FMG Chairman.  Before the crash he owned a lot of shares ($20m) but lost half of them due to the failure of his stockbroker.
"awsgc24"


awsgc24.......are you telling me that Twiggy has renamed the port of PORT HEDLAND to Port Herb Elliot??????  I wasn't aware that FMG had purchased the whole of the port of PORT HEDLAND from the Government  Rolling Eyes

I was only aware that they had a couple of ship berths in the Port of PORT HEDLAND which is under the control of the PORT HEDLAND Port Authority.  I could be wrong though ???
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
FYI the port has been renamed Port Herb Elliot after the Olympic runner who is also FMG Chairman.  Before the crash he owned a lot of shares ($20m) but lost half of them due to the failure of his stockbroker.
"awsgc24"


awsgc24.......are you telling me that Twiggy has renamed the port of PORT HEDLAND to Port Herb Elliot??????  I wasn't aware that FMG had purchased the whole of the port of PORT HEDLAND from the Government  Rolling Eyes

I was only aware that they had a couple of ship berths in the Port of PORT HEDLAND which is under the control of the PORT HEDLAND Port Authority.  I could be wrong though ???
"Controller"



Only Point Alexander is being renamed Port Herb Elliot.
  M636C Minister for Railways

I expect that "Port Herb Elliott" is likely to be a short lived name or perhaps confined to FMG operations.

BHPB generally call their part of town "Nelson Point" and I'd expect that FMG's location will be called Point Alexander by most people. One difference would be that the rail loop is in a location known to most people as "Boodarie" and I'd think that they'd have trouble changing that name.

So far the FMG wagons are painted in plain grey (common to other Chinese built wagons in this country). There is no (obvious) indication of which end has the rotary coupler. The cars run in bar coupled pairs, numbered 1001+2001 upward. The dumper does dump two cars at a time, as do most dumpers in the Pilbara. BHPB (well, Mt Newman then) built a triple dumper as their No 2 at Nelson Point, and this consists of three separate cells and you can dump or not dump any of the three cars in place at the time. Since then, nobody has bothered to do that.

BHP use a coupler design that prevents coupling of two fixed couplers, but I don't know if FMG use this technique. BHPB don't paint their cars to indicate which end has the rotary either. Rio Tinto paint a yellow spot on that end.

M636C
  Controller Deputy Commissioner

Location: Banjo Country
I have it on pretty good authority that the "first" ore train shown with Twiggy waving his Aussie flag was only 12 ore cars in length - good for publicity though I suppose  Rolling Eyes

I wonder what the photo shoot will be when they are supposed to load their "first" shipment of ore in May?  A 30,000 tonne coastal freighter  Question
  M636C Minister for Railways

I have it on pretty good authority that the "first" ore train shown with Twiggy waving his Aussie flag was only 12 ore cars in length - good for publicity though I suppose  Rolling Eyes

I wonder what the photo shoot will be when they are supposed to load their "first" shipment of ore in May?  A 30,000 tonne coastal freighter  Question
"Controller"


The low res photo on the FMG website of the first train approaching the dumper shows it to have twelve cars, but only the first ten appear to be loaded.

Clearly the whole thing was a publicity stunt, apparently timed to coincide with the first linking of the track to Cloudbreak.

I note that as the train approached the dumper, Mr Forrest had put on a hard hat, not visible in earlier shots. I guess riding on a locomotive front platform waving a flag much larger than yourself is perfectly safe if you have a hard hat.

M636C
  Controller Deputy Commissioner

Location: Banjo Country
Hard hat probably required in case he fell off while waving said flag and hit his scone Rolling Eyes but then again, we can't have the CEO of the company showing a bad example when approaching a designated hard hat wearing area, could we  Question

It will be interesting to see how well their rail and track stand up to the heavy haulage over a period of time and I suppose the up and coming cold weather at night will also put the rails and welds to the test.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Are the Fortescue (FMG) ore cars painted so that it is clear which end and which side points in the correct direction to suit the rotary ore unloader  Question
"awsgc24"


They have  a golden reflectorised ring on the rotary coupler end (which is on the slave car).
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
I expect that "Port Herb Elliott" is likely to be a short lived name or perhaps confined to FMG operations.

BHPB generally call their part of town "Nelson Point" and I'd expect that FMG's location will be called Point Alexander by most people. One difference would be that the rail loop is in a location known to most people as "Boodarie" and I'd think that they'd have trouble changing that name.

So far the FMG wagons are painted in plain grey (common to other Chinese built wagons in this country). There is no (obvious) indication of which end has the rotary coupler. The cars run in bar coupled pairs, numbered 1001+2001 upward. The dumper does dump two cars at a time, as do most dumpers in the Pilbara. BHPB (well, Mt Newman then) built a triple dumper as their No 2 at Nelson Point, and this consists of three separate cells and you can dump or not dump any of the three cars in place at the time. Since then, nobody has bothered to do that.

BHP use a coupler design that prevents coupling of two fixed couplers, but I don't know if FMG use this technique. BHPB don't paint their cars to indicate which end has the rotary either. Rio Tinto paint a yellow spot on that end.

M636C
"M636C"


The exterior paint is only short term protection for the sea journey when this wears off the cars will be unpainted externally. There is a golden reflectorised ring about 2 inches wide and 12 inches outside diameter on the rotary end of the slave cars. The car numbers are 2002 to 2816 (even numbers) and 1001 to 1815 (odd numbers) for master and slave cars respectively.

FMG have their own port at Anderson Point.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Does Fortescue (FMG) use a rotary tippler to unload (IIRC two cars at a time) and how does this work with the air brake hoses on one side?[/quote]

Without difficulty, as they are designed to to so.
  M636C Minister for Railways

There seems to be a small mystery about the earliest two pairs of Fortescue ore cars. The CSR (car builder) website and catalogue illustrate a pair of completely flat sided grey painted cars (like the BHPB 9000 and 9100 cars) with the number 1001 (and the other number illegible).

The catalog also illustrates a completely different pair of unpainted cars with the standard offset upper panels with the number 2002 clearly visible on the end (and the other car number illegible, of course).

The only thing that is certain is that the illustrated 1001 is not coupled to the illustrated 2002.

I think Toad has mentioned seeing a flat sided pair but I don't think he's mentioned the numbers if he's seen them, but either of the pairs illustrated could now be 1001+2002.

While the early 1001 had the gold ring on the rotary end as described by YM, the production cars have the gold ring filled with a black circle with the tare weight (22.6T) painted in it. The tare of the master car (22.9T) is painted on a black oval on the equivalent position.

M636C
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
There seems to be a small mystery about the earliest two pairs of Fortescue ore cars. The CSR (car builder) website and catalogue illustrate a pair of completely flat sided grey painted cars (like the BHPB 9000 and 9100 cars) with the number 1001 (and the other number illegible).

The catalog also illustrates a completely different pair of unpainted cars with the standard offset upper panels with the number 2002 clearly visible on the end (and the other car number illegible, of course).

The only thing that is certain is that the illustrated 1001 is not coupled to the illustrated 2002.

I think Toad has mentioned seeing a flat sided pair but I don't think he's mentioned the numbers if he's seen them, but either of the pairs illustrated could now be 1001+2002.

While the early 1001 had the gold ring on the rotary end as described by YM, the production cars have the gold ring filled with a black circle with the tare weight (22.6T) painted in it. The tare of the master car (22.9T) is painted on a black oval on the equivalent position.

M636C
"M636C"


Cars 1001 and 2002 are a married pair and are identical to the other 814 cars. They (and the last pair 1815 and 2816) arrived on the last boat from China which was the Opel Ace IIRC. Do not be misled by the ZRSW website.

For the sake of accuracy, and without wishing to be pedantic, the gold ring to indicate the rotary coupler end is on a black painted circular background which extends about 20mm beyond the outside diameter of the gold ring.
  M636C Minister for Railways

The interesting point about the cars illustrated in the CSR catalog is that the flat sided cars are not retouched photos of other cars but appear to be genuine prototypes and the similarity to the BHPB stainless steel cars is unlikely to be coincidental.

They have the gold reflective ring without the black border (which seems to be made as part of the reflective ring on later cars, not part of a painted background) The area inside the ring is painted on production cars (not on the prototypes), but in matt black.

I don't know if these two cars could be rebuilt as standard cars - even the end structure is different. But it would just be the steel body - all the added hardware could be reused on a pair of standard bodies.

The main visible change, to the offset top rail is quite logical in that it reduces the chance of ore "catching" during tippling and is consistent with the design of the much more complex BHPB Golynx cars. More interestngly, the body rubbing pads on the side have been relocated from the prototypes to lower on the body on production cars.

What I am saying is not that the delivered cars 1001+2002 are non standard, but that 1001 (at least) is probably not the first to carry that number.

M636C
  awsgc24 Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney
The dimensions of the cars have to match the dimensions of the rotary unloaders. Do all the Pilbara lines use compatible and interchangable dimensions or are they all different?
  M636C Minister for Railways

The dimensions of the cars have to match the dimensions of the rotary unloaders. Do all the Pilbara lines use compatible and interchangable dimensions or are they all different?
"awsgc24"


Basically, they are all different.

Goldsworthy used bottom dump cars, and BHPB purchased bottom dump versions of their standard cars to keep the operation going until No 4 dumper was built at Finucane Island, replacing the bottom dump facility.
The 8400 series cars then had their slope sheets and hopper doors removed and became standard Newman cars.

Pilbara Iron have two dumpers at Cape Lambert, one for the Robe River design cars and one for the Hamersley Iron design cars. The Robe River cars are used exclusively on the Deepdale line, and cars to Hamersley design are used to all other mines. Robe River own many cars to Hamersley design, which can be recognised by their grey colour (rather than HI red-brown) but they are numbered in the HI series.

The car clamps in the dumpers are different as well: Most dumpers clamp the top rail of the car, but the Mt Newman cars are clamped on special bars at floor level, which result in recesses in the side of later designs of car.

The physical size varies too. The HI cars are the smallest, followed by BHPB, Robe River and Fortescue, in that order (I think). I haven't a diagram of Robe and Fortescue cars but that is my estimation. Robe cars have lower sides but are longer, giving a larger appearance.

M636C

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