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Comeng Gunzel
Joined: Oct 08, 2004
Last Visited: Dec 1, 2008
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Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 12:03 pm
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| dalts 1985 wrote: | | > Re-electifiy the Gippsland/Eastern Line (this time also to 25Kv.) |
And what is the logic is that? The original electrification was for freight haulage, and diesel traction is perfectly adequate for the Traralgon passenger services.
| dalts 1985 wrote: | | could be considered or perhaps even a version of the EDIRail Cityrail M Bug or UGR Cityrail OSCar, both modified to suit our loading gauge requirements, this being a Double Deck train also helps to combat the overcrowding issues by fitting twice the amount of people in the one car in the 2 deck layout... |
I doubt that double deck trains are really required for Traralgon runs, or even Geelong. A couple of 8-car M sets could fit in an entire day's worth of Gippsland patronage with some seats to spare.
| dalts 1985 wrote: | | The V/Locitys currently used on these Geelong & Eastern Region RFR services could/would then be redeployed to the 2 other RFR lines of Ballarat/Bendigo, as well as Seymour, to boost available compacity of RFR required rollingstock. |
And rather than stringing up overhead wires to Traralgon with dual-voltage Millennium trains, you could alternatively, more logically, release some rollingstock by stringing overhead to the V/Line destinations which are essentially suburbs of Melbourne, which may be better serviced by suburban services than by interurban trains.
| NathanCastle wrote: | A simple train link bus service from the airport passenger terminal to Lara station (meeting trains) would do Avalon fine for the foreseeable future.
As for people having to lug around heavy luggage from train to bus visa versa, well the budget airlines are trying to ween their passengers off taking luggage (they want only hand luggage) and charge passengers though the nose for checked luggage.
So this might not be such an issue for people who would consider using public transport to the airport. |
Indeed. If there were to be an issue with luggage, luggage racks like Skybus has could be installed on the buses, although all modern low floor buses have sufficient room for passengers with luggage in the wheelchair area.
" The trains at Pennant Hills run roughly every half hour. Nobody in their right mind uses a service that shoddy. That so many do just proves how many dumb and/or desperate people there are in Sydney." - MrPC
Transport Textbook - My photos at RailPictures.Net |
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ZH836301
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Apr 26, 2006
Last Visited: Dec 1, 2008
Location: BleakCity
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Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 6:49 pm
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| dalts 1985 wrote: | | > Create a Melb. CBD - AVV Airport - MEL Airport - Melb. CBD Electified 25Kv Loop Service, requires building of 3 new lines, build them altogether & the cost may drop a little... |
What on Earth...?
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DalyWaters
Deputy Commissioner
Joined: Oct 31, 2006
Last Visited: Nov 28, 2008
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Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:43 pm
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Why do we have such an obsession with "serving" the airlines by providing rail links to get people on to the planes?
Sydney and Brisbane have shown what white elephant loss makers the rail links are. This was one time that Victoria's do very little government was able to see the results from up north and stop any project from happening here.
If Linfox/Avalon Airport are concerned about why there are not many bus services to and from their airport, maybe their $5 plus surchage/tax that they take from every bus passenger might have something to do with it.
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thadocta
Chief Train Controller
Joined: Apr 18, 2004
Last Visited: Dec 2, 2008
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:08 am
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| DalyWaters wrote: | | Why do we have such an obsession with "serving" the airlines by providing rail links to get people on to the planes? |
Because if the rail links aren't provided then the roads would be even more congested than they currently are.
| DalyWaters wrote: | | Sydney and Brisbane have shown what white elephant loss makers the rail links are. |
Only because of the pricing models used, which provide a disincentive to use the rail service when there are two or more people travelling together - taxis are cheaper.
The Sydney link actually needed to be built anyway, as the existing lines between Sydenham and Redfern were at saturation point, so extra lines needed to be provided, routing them via the airport was a bonus.
Dave
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NottaGunzel
Banned
Joined: Jul 05, 2007
Last Visited: Nov 12, 2008
Location: Banned
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robbiemc
Station Master
Joined: Jan 28, 2008
Last Visited: Aug 27, 2008
Location: Drilling holes in WA
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:59 am
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I cant believe the way you idiots carry on, what started out as a simple thread about getting trains to avalon turned into an orgy of absolute crap!
Grow up, stop being nerds and think about the matter in a sane way, if Mr Fox were to build a loop line that peeled off and rejoined the Geelong line wherever it needs to be then certain trains could be diverted to avalon to meet certain flights.Start off again and rejoin the geelong coridoor The train has its normal patronage and then the extra airline passengers. only a single line would be needed with a island platform so trains could cross giving passengers choice of which way they want to go geelong or melb. bloody hell dont get excited and rabble off stupid ideas,
| Post edited by 2001 |
I've removed some abusive remarks from you that are directed at a particular user. I'll say this once only : don't try it again.
- Railpage Australia™ |
" A cow in a paddock would have better opinions than some people in the www"
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DalyWaters
Deputy Commissioner
Joined: Oct 31, 2006
Last Visited: Nov 28, 2008
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:06 pm
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| Quote: | | OK - let's cancel all the V/Line Football Specials to South Geelong. After all , by the same logic ( or lack of it Rolling Eyes ) , why should we bother "serving" the AFL Question |
Yes, lets do that. Use the rolling stock for regular services instead of bus substitutes.
Have you thought about what it costs V/Line to serve the AFL? Especially when the trains are run empty from Bacchus Marsh to South Geelong to start a service!
| Quote: | | No more Connex Specials to the Melbourne Show |
So you are saying there are enough passengers wanting to go to Avalon Airport to equate with patronage to the Show? Have you ever travelled on a train to Brisbane Airport?
| Quote: | | No more services to Flemington Races in November |
As above. Also, the tracks to Flemington are already there and are cross subsidised by their use to store trains outside the peaks.
Otherwise, I would be quite happy if the Show and Racecourse were to pay the costs to run services there.
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NottaGunzel
Banned
Joined: Jul 05, 2007
Last Visited: Nov 12, 2008
Location: Banned
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DalyWaters
Deputy Commissioner
Joined: Oct 31, 2006
Last Visited: Nov 28, 2008
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:26 pm
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| Quote: | | Well if costs are of such great concern to you - you must be in favour of scrapping all V/Line regional services because none of them make money ! |
Well, they are hard to justify. However, there is a community service obligation that requires V/Line to provide services to Victoria's regions. Therefore, the Victorian Government gives a subsidy to V/Line. Somewhere around 90% at the moment. Fares provide the other 10% or so.
The AFL, Melbourne Show and Flemington Races fit in under mass movements that the Government probably look on as detrimental to not have public transport to. The traffic and parking problems would be immense without public transport. It would be good if the AFL, Melbourne Show and VRC would contribute to the costs that are incurred because of them.
As for both airports, there should be no community service obligation. There are commercial public transport operators servicing both airports right now. They are able to cope with the demand quite well. Why should the Victorian taxpayer have to provide the cost of heavy rail and subsidised travel to compete against what currently works?
Does that explain my stance better for you?
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robbiemc
Station Master
Joined: Jan 28, 2008
Last Visited: Aug 27, 2008
Location: Drilling holes in WA
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:24 am
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Both airports should have links built its getting to expensive to drive, taxis are a rip off and the bus services while being resonable still cost a few big notes. people should be able to have an alternative, and what would emitt more Co2 100 people in cars buses and taxis or 50 on one train and 50 in cars buses and taxis.
we all pay for rail links if its not avalon or melb airport it will be somewhere else, the government should regain control of the rail system and run it like a service NOT a business, people are sick of being held to ransom by taxis and private bus operators, if rail links are built people will use them!
P.S I,ll behave myself if people stop making fools of themselves on Railpage Australia™.
" A cow in a paddock would have better opinions than some people in the www"
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DalyWaters
Deputy Commissioner
Joined: Oct 31, 2006
Last Visited: Nov 28, 2008
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:57 am
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| Quote: | | Both airports should have links built its getting to expensive to drive, taxis are a rip off and the bus services while being resonable still cost a few big notes. |
If its getting too expensive, don't fly! Catch a train instead, if you want subsidised transport.
| Quote: | | what would emitt more Co2 100 people in cars buses and taxis or 50 on one train and 50 in cars buses and taxis. |
Well, actually, the bus emits the least.
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spottyrahr
Chief Commissioner
Joined: Jan 17, 2003
Last Visited: Nov 26, 2008
Location: St Albans Melbourne
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 11:47 am
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What is the point of building a train line there when there is already a bus service that works well.
One bus service for every flight. Normally it is only one coach that isn't empty but not full. It's hardly a jam packed service with buses every 15 mins that are basically full. Focus on Tulla before going off and playing Sim City with secondary airports.
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Camster
Deputy Commissioner
Joined: Nov 25, 2004
Last Visited: Nov 21, 2008
Location: Kew by force
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 4:36 pm
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| DalyWaters wrote: |
Sydney and Brisbane have shown what white elephant loss makers the rail links are. This was one time that Victoria's do very little government was able to see the results from up north and stop any project from happening here.
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Brisbane? There are always plenty of people on the trains to the airport when I travel on the airport line. It is very convenient. The only issue I have is Brisbane is quite hilly in places and people with luggage might struggle, walking to their hotel.
"Election in November"
"What? Again? This stupid country!"
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NathanCastle
Assistant Commissioner
Joined: Dec 11, 2007
Last Visited: Nov 24, 2008
Location: Gippsland
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 5:36 pm
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| DalyWaters wrote: | Why do we have such an obsession with "serving" the airlines by providing rail links to get people on to the planes?
Sydney and Brisbane have shown what white elephant loss makers the rail links are. This was one time that Victoria's do very little government was able to see the results from up north and stop any project from happening here. |
Have they both realy been White Elephant's In terms of a survice to the public ? or Is the White Elephant saying only from the Invester point of view (the sercharge don't help them one little bit)
Many railways that where privitley funded and built to surve the public have gone bust and the Governments took over them.
Governments can right off masive amounts of funds for projects that sevice the public. Prvite companies can not.
This proposed carbon trading scheme Is going to ruin the economy of Australia. "Dump It Now"
65 miles from Flinders Street Station Melbourne and 703 feet above sea level
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robbiemc
Station Master
Joined: Jan 28, 2008
Last Visited: Aug 27, 2008
Location: Drilling holes in WA
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Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:54 pm
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Hey Dalywaters your not to bright, Airfares have ACTUALLY become cheaper in the last five years, petrol prices have gone through the roof
It is easyier for people to fly around australia than its is to get to an airport in melb if you havent got a car ! smeghead !
" A cow in a paddock would have better opinions than some people in the www"
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) , why should we bother "serving" the AFL 
