North Melbourne - Moonee Ponds is another one. Only saving of time is skipping Ascot Vale as up until Newmarket the speed is 65kmh max. On the new timetable though, there only seems to be 5 in (which only one beholding the title of a true express), and a lone useless one out.

I think the point of the express running is that by Moonee Ponds the train is crush loaded (usually by Essendon passengers) so there is not point stopping the train down the line - you just end up losing more time as people try to squeeze aboard.

The only reason that they stop at Moonee Ponds is because of the 'inability' (for whatever reason) to set the booms at Puckle street for express running.

True or false  

I feel sorry for the poor bloke running Frankston signal box now.  I doubt that he would get a 30 second break during the day.  I ran a down Frankston the other day and after stopping at Kananook noticed that the auto didnt come off like normal.  Looked further ahead to see the previous down train in front of me.  No problems, just wait till it pulls into platform 1 (platform 2 had a siemens in it already) and I could start moving up.  Only problem was platform 1 already had another siemens in it. I watched 4 trains depart (including me) , 1 shunt out, and 2 arrive in the 12 minutes I was there.  No idea where they are going to put the Stony Point sprinters with this sort of scheduling.

I feel sorry for the poor bloke running Frankston signal box now.  I doubt that he would get a 30 second break during the day.  I ran a down Frankston the other day and after stopping at Kananook noticed that the auto didnt come off like normal.  Looked further ahead to see the previous down train in front of me.  No problems, just wait till it pulls into platform 1 (platform 2 had a siemens in it already) and I could start moving up.  Only problem was platform 1 already had another siemens in it. I watched 4 trains depart (including me) , 1 shunt out, and 2 arrive in the 12 minutes I was there.  No idea where they are going to put the Stony Point sprinters with this sort of scheduling.

Just put them in one of the extra roads and get the bogans to walk across the tracks and climb in  

The only reason that they stop at Moonee Ponds is because of the 'inability' (for whatever reason) to set the booms at Puckle street for express running.

True or false  

False, as V/Line services do not stop at Moonee Ponds.

If you don't stop at Essendon, then the crossing at Moonee Ponds will be set for the express. As to whether or not the signaller at Essendon has manual control over the stopper/Express setting is beyond my knowledge.

Punctuality has dropped from 89.4 on Thursday or Friday to 88.6 today.  I want my "pleasant" commute back.  9.20 train was masquerading as the 9.33 today.  Surprised we could squeeze on, whole train was packed right the way through.  Got to Flagstaff 16 minutes late, at ten to ten, and yet again they'd turned the speed on the escalators down (seriously, that pisses me off big time, they  need to EXTEND the fast escalators to quarter past because of all the late running trains).

Based on the past three days of 10-15 late trains they're going to be going right back to 82-85% in a hurry.

That said, I'm just grateful I'm in one piece, because a woman had been hit by a garbage truck near the Little Lonsdale corner and was lying on the road in the rain (with lots of people helping her, thank heavens).   Makes my issues getting in seem a bit more trivial.

A couple of problems with the "new" Werribee timetable:

1. The 7:45 and 8:05 stop at Aircraft and the 7:49 and 8:09 skip it.  This means the 7:49 and 8:09 always get stuck behind the 7:45 and 8:05.  Not sure why the DoT / Metro didn't swap this around as it doesn't affect the timetabled running time.

2. Passengers from Werribee wanting to travel to Altona have a much longer journey due to the stopping train from Lavo departing at the same time as the incoming train from Werribee (7:35 and 7:55).

3. Not really a timetable problem but V/Line still can't get their 5hit together and make it to Werribee on-time.  I have *never* seen their 8:00 Spencer St service depart on-time.  Maybe V/Line need to allow more time between Geelong and Werribee?

Fourth consecutive day of uncomfortably packed trains, and yet again it arrived  over ten minutes late.

Once or twice was a coincidence, this is a pattern and I'm pissed.  In the previous two months of catching this train at the same line I can remember only once or twice where it was similarly full.

armadale-gal, in your opinion would this problem exist if the trains were on-time?

And also, do you find generally that Siemens trains are more late than Comeng trains? Others have suggested that this is likely because the Frankston Line has the highest number of Siemens-only speed restrictions after the Upfield line.

armadale-gal, in your opinion would this problem exist if the trains were on-time?

And also, do you find generally that Siemens trains are more late than Comeng trains? Others have suggested that this is likely because the Frankston Line has the highest number of Siemens-only speed restrictions after the Upfield line.

It might be, but I peg this issue as being caused by the reduced options & timing of the time the Frankstons & Pak/Cran's get to Caulfield and Malvern.  The expresses come from Pak/Cran not Frankston so I can't really comment on late running Siemens but the Siemens get packed way more quickly than the Comengs because of fewer doors and fewer seats.  Basically I smile when I see a Comeng these days  Hitachi today, slightly more comfortable than a Siemens but not fun being jerked around with nothing to hang on to  We were all like skittles.

[ETA just to explain again, as two trains arrived at 9.20 and two at 9.33 the load was split four ways, now it's only split three ways.  Those arriving at 9.20 or 9.30 would either catch the Frankston stopper or the Pak/Cran express depending on which was coming first or which they preferred.  That option is now gone, there's only one option unless you want a much longer wait]

I'm not sure if this is a factor in Armadale-gal's issue, but at the time of day that she travels, the Frankston line is transitioning to the 10 minute frequency, with the result that there are a couple of intervals of more than 10 minutes (although on average 10 minute intervals are achieved).  Even though these longer intervals are only 11 and 12 minutes respectively, would this make a difference, especially as that time of day the loadings are still quite high?
Lots of people at South Yarra today taking notes about passenger loads, so perhaps the issue will be addressed some time in the future?   Or will Metro's attention turn to other lines (maybe Pakenham/Cranbourne?), now that the Frankston line has got the benefit of the 10 minute inter-peak service etc?

I know it's sort of an old thread, but my new thread would have been similar in scope to this.


I was wondering, the DoT website reads that Melbourne's 17th new train is on its way.

I clicked for further information and I learnt that there are 38 trains on order.

My point is, if 16 trains so far meant we have 10 minute frequencies on the Frankston line as well as additional peak hour and outside peak services to other train lines, I am wondering...

When we get all 38 trains (I estimate by 2012 based on current rates) what do you expect the timetable to look like.

Is it fair to think we will have 10 minute frequencies on the Pakenham line? Or the Upfield line (which still has 20 minute frequencies even during peak hour!)

Or do you think more attention will be to increase peak hour services evenly across the whole network?

When we get all 38 trains (I estimate by 2012 based on current rates) what do you expect the timetable to look like.

Is it fair to think we will have 10 minute frequencies on the Pakenham line? Or the Upfield line (which still has 20 minute frequencies even during peak hour!)

Probably the direction they're headed. However, I think if we see 10 minute frequencys on other lines, we will see more disasters like the Frankston line. (Think - 7 trains banked up behind each other between Frankston and Seaford....)  

A frequency better than 20 minutes won't happen on the Upfield line unless you terminate every second train at Coburg. With the Craigieburn line and tram route 19 running parralel there isn't much demand for more off peak trains.

Rumour has it that after the Mordialloc sidings have been redone over the next few months that during the off peak period every 2nd train will to Frankston will terminate at Mordialloc and go back to Flinders St. By my reckoning that will mean a 20min service between Frankston and Mordialloc between 9am and 4pm and i don't reckon the locals will be too pleased. If this is true i would expect the new government to knock it on the head since all the sitting Labor members between Mordialloc and Frankston lost their seats at the last election, with a big reason being the poor performance of the Frankston line.

Rumour has it that after the Mordialloc sidings have been redone over the next few months that during the off peak period every 2nd train will to Frankston will terminate at Mordialloc and go back to Flinders St. By my reckoning that will mean a 20min service between Frankston and Mordialloc between 9am and 4pm and i don't reckon the locals will be too pleased. If this is true i would expect the new government to knock it on the head since all the sitting Labor members between Mordialloc and Frankston lost their seats at the last election, with a big reason being the poor performance of the Frankston line.

I don't see why they would introduce a down-graded service from 10 min to 20 min (or even 15 min to 20 min). The more likely reason is to turn back trains at Mordialloc during peak, to reduce the number of rollingstock needed as well as split the loading (i.e. forcing people who live beyond Mordialloc to take an express).

Also, Upfield will not receive any service upgrades for a while due to local opposition, especially with the council who dislike trains delaying cars at the large number of level crossings.

Rumour has it that after the Mordialloc sidings have been redone over the next few months that during the off peak period every 2nd train will to Frankston will terminate at Mordialloc and go back to Flinders St. By my reckoning that will mean a 20min service between Frankston and Mordialloc between 9am and 4pm and i don't reckon the locals will be too pleased. If this is true i would expect the new government to knock it on the head since all the sitting Labor members between Mordialloc and Frankston lost their seats at the last election, with a big reason being the poor performance of the Frankston line.

Restricting the movement of people beyond Mordialloc to frankston will have one major imapct: less scrotes.  A similar program to only run trains once an hour beyond Mitcham will have a similar effect.

Also, Upfield will not receive any service upgrades for a while due to local opposition, especially with the council who dislike trains delaying cars at the large number of level crossings.

"Local opposition" you say?

http://leader-news.whereilive.com.au/news/story/long-wait-on-upfield-trains-greens/
http://moreland-leader.whereilive.com.au/news/story/upfield-line-dismay/
http://moreland-leader.whereilive.com.au/news/story/upfield-railway-line-frequency-blast/
http://thecoburginitiative.com.au/topic/rail-line

Also, Upfield will not receive any service upgrades for a while due to local opposition, especially with the council who dislike trains delaying cars at the large number of level crossings.

"Local opposition" you say?

http://leader-news.whereilive.com.au/news/story/long-wait-on-upfield-trains-greens/
http://moreland-leader.whereilive.com.au/news/story/upfield-line-dismay/
http://moreland-leader.whereilive.com.au/news/story/upfield-railway-line-frequency-blast/
http://thecoburginitiative.com.au/topic/rail-line

Oh Snap!  

Rumour has it that after the Mordialloc sidings have been redone over the next few months that during the off peak period every 2nd train will to Frankston will terminate at Mordialloc and go back to Flinders St. By my reckoning that will mean a 20min service between Frankston and Mordialloc between 9am and 4pm and i don't reckon the locals will be too pleased. If this is true i would expect the new government to knock it on the head since all the sitting Labor members between Mordialloc and Frankston lost their seats at the last election, with a big reason being the poor performance of the Frankston line.

I don't see why they would introduce a down-graded service from 10 min to 20 min (or even 15 min to 20 min). The more likely reason is to turn back trains at Mordialloc during peak, to reduce the number of rollingstock needed as well as split the loading (i.e. forcing people who live beyond Mordialloc to take an express).

Also, Upfield will not receive any service upgrades for a while due to local opposition, especially with the council who dislike trains delaying cars at the large number of level crossings.

Perfectly agree with your point regarding Frankston. I doubt (although I am no expert) that following Metro CEO's desire for a "truly metro system" with 10 minute frequencies, that we would go backwards...

I don't know about you, but I trust Andrew Lezala's call, it would be a PR disaster to go back on such a big "vision", even if he didn't make that comment, going backwards is definitely not the answer, and commuters far and wide would be quick to bite at such a major change.

However , knowing the delays the line has been experiencing lately, maybe cutting back some services until some improvements can be made could be Metro's vision... that is, "we tested this for almost 6 months but the service is still bad, we need to try something else before we can re-introduce services".

But to be honest I don't even really support that statement which I came up with   haha...

Also, Azn_dj, I have looked a little into the Upfield line, and many people I know personally and from opinions online+the news etc is that more services=good.

I doubt ANY community in the city would be against more frequent train services just because of level crossings...

You don't hear people in Clayton/Springvale saying "we want less trains on the Pakenham line to stop the boom gates staying down", instead you hear for calls of grade seperations (i.e. the more feasible option)

Upfield residents (which sort of makes up the voice of the council) in my opinion would be grateful for any increase in services

If you look at the Coburg re-development plan, Council advocated to the state government to sink the Coburg rail crossing underground to create a better entrance into the retail hub. (I think though this is now history, with the cost being a main factor, but I was just trying to highlight Councils point of view)

Cheers

EDIT: After having a look at the previous poster who provided several links which de-bunk your claim, I am interested in what made you say that AZN_dj.

Maybe we are missing something/mis-interpreted, don't want to be quick to bite the bullet!

Also, Upfield will not receive any service upgrades for a while due to local opposition, especially with the council who dislike trains delaying cars at the large number of level crossings.

"Local opposition" you say?

http://leader-news.whereilive.com.au/news/story/long-wait-on-upfield-trains-greens/
http://moreland-leader.whereilive.com.au/news/story/upfield-line-dismay/
http://moreland-leader.whereilive.com.au/news/story/upfield-railway-line-frequency-blast/
http://thecoburginitiative.com.au/topic/rail-line

Oh thanks greatly for that.

Had a good read through all four links. Really love the last one which was about putting the railway underground. Or should I say I really love the responses to that idea.

Yes, they should put Bell Street under both the railway and Sydney Road.

Obviously if you are going to search for articles, then you're going to find the ones that support your point.

And ok, I don't actually have any evidence as such, but a rumor I had heard was that the council had requested for the frequency on the Upfield line to not be increased because it would impact the travel times on the large number of level crossings. But also because of the distances between the level crossings, grade separation is not a friendly option.

I'm not saying that frequency increases are a bad thing, but there are 23 level crossings across the whole route, with most of them congregated quite close to the city.

It's interesting to note that this line was in threat of being closed not long ago, as well as the increase of services on route 19.

Obviously if you are going to search for articles, then you're going to find the ones that support your point.

I let Google sort them out for me:
http://www.google.com/search?q=upfield+line+more+trains

Perhaps you were thinking of another council?
http://stonnington-leader.whereilive.com.au/news/story/cross-over-stonnington-crossings/

Nah it was definitely Moreland Council.