Maryborough numbers

 
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
In usual Victorian Style estates are built miles from any railway line rather than development around regional hubs.

Would it be even possible to relay the line to Redan?

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  Carnot Minister for Railways

The estates go up so fast, Google maps can't keep up.
Camster

Google maps lag badly.  I find that I'm using "whereis" instead.

Real estate around Victoria is a strange beast atm.  Inner Melbourne prices are being artificially inflated by investors who never live there - i.e ghost apartments.  The nimbys who live in the gentrifying middle suburbs which generally have good PT have prevented in-fill - thus inflating prices there as well.  That pushes people out to the outer suburbs (often with poor PT) and demand enables developers to squash 'em in.  That makes ex-urbs with (just) tolerable (albeit very irregular) PT attractive to people who want a bit of space at a good price.  

Maryborough in some regards could almost be considered an ex-urb of Ballarat: cheap housing, a bit of space, and a train with a timetable that suits commuters to Ballarat, but not beyond.  

In Bendigo there are all these new housing developments going on which are emptying older properties closer to town.  It's a buyers market there right now.  At some recent auctions properties have been selling well under the reserve.... partly because prices jumped a few years ago when there was a genuine housing shortage.
  don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Adelaide proud
In usual Victorian Style estates are built miles from any railway line rather than development around regional hubs.

Would it be even possible to relay the line to Redan?
bevans

I believe the alignment has been built-over now where it passed through the former golf course but is still intact south of Sturt Street.
  don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Adelaide proud
Real estate around Victoria is a strange beast atm. Inner Melbourne prices are being artificially inflated by investors who never live there - i.e ghost apartments. The nimbys who live in the gentrifying middle suburbs which generally have good PT have prevented in-fill - thus inflating prices there as well. That pushes people out to the outer suburbs (often with poor PT) and demand enables developers to squash 'em in. That makes ex-urbs with (just) tolerable (albeit very irregular) PT attractive to people who want a bit of space at a good price.

Maryborough in some regards could almost be considered an ex-urb of Ballarat: cheap housing, a bit of space, and a train with a timetable that suits commuters to Ballarat, but not beyond.
Carnot

The problem is that housing has become the main game for any kind of investment because of very favourable tax treatment and banks that are willing to lend for any kind of residential property in a capital city (but not for business or productive enterprise). Ex-urbs are the ugly face of a complete failure of policy; failure to properly provide for the hundreds of thousands of migrants who move here every year and failure to provide infrastructure for the growth of our cities as they expand at the fringes.
  ZH836301 Chief Commissioner

Location: BleakCity
Planning is a complete joke in this state. $250,000 for a postage stamp-sized block of land on the extreme fringes of the metro area is completely stupid - it only encourages the move to ex-urbs like Wallan, Drouin and Bacchus Marsh.
don

Diggers is expanding with land for ~$170k - not going to get close to that further out in the likes of Gisborne or Macedon.


If you can put up with being in Diggers.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Planning is a joke. From what I have most housing developments undertaken on the fringe of Melbourne do so with inadequate transport planning. They are approved miles from rail corridors active or otherwise.

Take south morang as an example. Why were the developers of housing going north or the land owners compelled to assist in funding the railway extension. ?
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Planning is a joke. From what I have most housing developments undertaken on the fringe of Melbourne do so with inadequate transport planning. They are approved miles from rail corridors active or otherwise.

Take south morang as an example. Why were the developers of housing going north or the land owners compelled to assist in funding the railway extension. ?
freightgate

There's quite a story with that one.  The developers of the Aurora Estate to the North of Epping put in an easement for heavy rail since that is what they allegedly heard the Govt was planning on building.  And they advertised as such.  Then the State Govt changed their minds and (re)built the line out East to South Morang.  The truth is out there, somewhere.
http://theage.domain.com.au/real-estate-news/epping-hell-estate-residents-betrayed-by-promises-20111214-1ouyb.html
  don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Adelaide proud
Diggers is expanding with land for ~$170k - not going to get close to that further out in the likes of Gisborne or Macedon.
ZH836301

At least it has an electric train station, doesn't it. Caroline Springs was (is?) much more expensive than that and it's only just getting a station now. I also saw signs everywhere when driving that way last week for a huge new infill estate between Caroline Springs and Rockbank - Melbourne keeps shooting its tentacles out to grab passing towns like prey and absorb them!
  ParkesHub Chief Commissioner

Diggers is expanding with land for ~$170k - not going to get close to that further out in the likes of Gisborne or Macedon.


If you can put up with being in Diggers.
ZH836301

There's couple of new estates in Woodend that don't look too expensive. Although, you have to be a confirmed latte sipping hipster to get a look in.
  Bethungra Train Controller

There's quite a story with that one.  The developers of the Aurora Estate to the North of Epping put in an easement for heavy rail since that is what they allegedly heard the Govt was planning on building.  And they advertised as such.  Then the State Govt changed their minds and (re)built the line out East to South Morang.  The truth is out there, somewhere.
Carnot



Was it ever a feasible development?  I for one could not see the government building off the alignment unless they planned on building both routes.  Looking at the development of housing it is yes going west from that location but a hell of a lot if now going north along the old alignment.

I think we are getting off topic.
  ZH836301 Chief Commissioner

Location: BleakCity
There's couple of new estates in Woodend that don't look too expensive. Although, you have to be a confirmed latte sipping hipster to get a look in.
ParkesHub

I'll blame Holgate's for that one, Mount Macedon too has been taken over by yuppies.


Was it ever a feasible development?
Bethungra

Aurora was VicUrban, meaning it should have been - demonstrates the organisational skill of government.
  don_dunstan The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Adelaide proud
Aurora was VicUrban, meaning it should have been - demonstrates the organisational skill of government.
ZH836301

The easement is still there if they ever get around to it; although the number of trains on the Clifton Hill group might be more than the existing infrastructure can cope with.

You are right about land suddenly dropping once you leave the metro fringes; a lot of those estates around Wallan, Beveridge and Drouin have land $50-60k cheaper than in the officially mandated urban fringes. It's a lot of money if you are trying to buy your first house - Maryborough is a bit too far for the average commuter though!
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

The easement is still there if they ever get around to it; although the number of trains on the Clifton Hill group might be more than the existing infrastructure can cope with.

You are right about land suddenly dropping once you leave the metro fringes; a lot of those estates around Wallan, Beveridge and Drouin have land $50-60k cheaper than in the officially mandated urban fringes. It's a lot of money if you are trying to buy your first house - Maryborough is a bit too far for the average commuter though!
don_dunstan

The Clifton Hill  Loop has some surplus capacity to accept extra peak period trains but this last capacity will be used up with the extension to  Mernda .  After that any extra peak capacity North of Clifton Hill cannot be absorbed in the Clifton Hill Loop either without re-signalling that loop for higher train throughput or the long term vision of an extra single line loop underground from Clifton Hill under Fitzroy then paralleling the existing route down Lonsdale Street as a fifth tunnel and into  Fishermans Bend area .
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
This discussion is off topic. Can an admin or mod please split this thread ?
  ZH836301 Chief Commissioner

Location: BleakCity
Here's Vicurban's old plan:



I'd say it's a dead duck - but all those claiming it would have made all that much difference to travel patterns are deluded.

Funnily enough they could even get the bus shelters right.

The Department of Transport yesterday blamed Aurora's developer, the state government development agency Places Victoria (formerly VicUrban), saying: ''New shelters in Epping North were installed without consultation with the Department of Transport and don't necessarily reflect future public transport routes.''


[url=http://theage.domain.com.au/real-estate-news/epping-hell-estate-residents-betrayed-by-promises-20111214-1ouyb.htmlThe Aged - 17/12/2011[/url]

The bus service is a shocker, bus 575, hourly with a spaghetti design that even includes a u-turn, most likely to staisfy this stupid clause:

Several bus shelters went up around the estate earlier this year, in accordance with Places Victoria's plan that 80 per cent of homes in Aurora be within 400 metres of a public transport connection.

Just think, if they can't even run a bus service right could you really trust them to build and operate a rail service anyway?

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