Afternoon all,

Heard a rumour this afternoon from an inside source that claimed S Sets are getting sent up to UGL at Cardiff be fitted with aircon to extend service life owing to a shortfall in rolling stock because of new timetables. This seems fairly pricy, and difficult owing to the work that would need to be undertaken on not just installing AC, but also on electrical, cabling etc. Can anyone shed some light as to whether this if true or not?

Cheers,

TinHareRailcar

UGL are busy with the Tangaras, aren't they?

I just can't see this happening.  If it was viable, it would have been done years ago.

Afternoon all,

Heard a rumour this afternoon from an inside source that claimed S Sets are getting sent up to UGL at Cardiff be fitted with aircon to extend service life owing to a shortfall in rolling stock because of new timetables. This seems fairly pricy, and difficult owing to the work that would need to be undertaken on not just installing AC, but also on electrical, cabling etc. Can anyone shed some light as to whether this if true or not?

Cheers,

TinHareRailcar

I suppose T comes after S, and as some other contributor rightly observed, the T sets are going up to UGL for a makeover. S sets, no way is it possible to air con them period. The only make over the S sets will receive is effected by one of those machines with a great claw that rips them apart in the not too distant future.

nswtrains is correct: the S sets do not have the roof space for air-conditioning to be fitted, hence why they were the last trains to be built with the pantographs on the motor cars, so the eternal rumour of S sets getting air-conditioning is not happening.

No point anyway since they are an asset that is of decreasing use with complete extinction on the Sydney Trains network likely in 5 years.

No point anyway since they are an asset that is of decreasing use with complete extinction on the Sydney Trains network likely in 5 years.

This one has nothing on the rumour that they were going to be converted to locomotive-hauled replacements for the XPT.

Just because V/Line happens to run peak commuter trains using locomotives and ex-metropolitan coaching stock first built in the 1950s doesn't make it a good idea.

some other contributor

Been called a lot of things during my time here; but this is a new one

The only way the s-sets are ever getting air con is if/when some of them are converted to ATP test trains.

the S sets do not have the roof space for air-conditioning to be fitted, hence why they were the last trains to be built with the pantographs on the motor cars, so the eternal rumour of S sets getting air-conditioning is not happening.

V Sets have pantographs on their motor cars.

the S sets do not have the roof space for air-conditioning to be fitted, hence why they were the last trains to be built with the pantographs on the motor cars, so the eternal rumour of S sets getting air-conditioning is not happening.

V Sets have pantographs on their motor cars.

Oooh yes, quite right!

I shall cover up my lapse with the following excuses:

1. I was only counting metropolitan trains, and so the V sets were excluded;
2. They are longer cars, so they actually sidestep the roof space issue;
3. They had to be modified from the prototype to have more roof space, hence the odd half-windows; and
4. OK, fine, I never actually thought about V sets when I posted that.

Fiction:

S sets already are air-conditioned... you just open the window and the air comes in...

A/C ing 36-42 year old stock, unlikely!

Delta airlines have flown 50 yr old aircraft with new fit outs internally - so its not without precedent...!

Delta airlines have flown 50 yr old aircraft with new fit outs internally - so its not without precedent...!

a rare outlier in a sea of modern fleets and not really a precedent for a commuter railway fleet.

Yes the Red Rattlers lasted over 50 years, but these days 40 years appears to be the magic number for electronics and other parts for technology made without the skills of a Blacksmith.

Yeah agreed - i was drawing a long bow at best!

nswtrains is correct: the S sets do not have the roof space for air-conditioning to be fitted, hence why they were the last trains to be built with the pantographs on the motor cars, so the eternal rumour of S sets getting air-conditioning is not happening.

For the purposes of accuracy...  S Set motor cars already DO have airon fitted and working, albeit only for the crew cabs.
With that in mind, the current rumours I have heard circulating, suggest that there is a project in the works that will have the already fitted aircon units ducted into the passenger areas of the motor cars, leaving the trailer cars to be the nostalgic sweatboxes they are...  Note the aircon units are COLD only - they do NOT have a heat function, so in winter the nostalgic freezing experience would continue to live on - for the entire train ...

So, although only a rumour, it is actually physically possible and indeed technically feasible.  Converting the trailer cars whilst technically possible, would be vastly problematic and would blow out costs well beyond the acceptable scope.  Ducting existing aircon in the motor cars on the other hand could be done with minimal fuss and expense, and the government would likely believe they could spin it into a revolutionary win for the travelling public...

If there's any truth to the rumours, then it will be down this path, so they can claim the non air conditioned carriages have been reduced by half, and the rumours I'm hearing suggest that S Sets ARE required for the next major timetable change, so there is an element of credibility to the rumour...

nswtrains is correct: the S sets do not have the roof space for air-conditioning to be fitted, hence why they were the last trains to be built with the pantographs on the motor cars, so the eternal rumour of S sets getting air-conditioning is not happening.

For the purposes of accuracy...  S Set motor cars already DO have airon fitted and working, albeit only for the crew cabs.
With that in mind, the current rumours I have heard circulating, suggest that there is a project in the works that will have the already fitted aircon units ducted into the passenger areas of the motor cars, leaving the trailer cars to be the nostalgic sweatboxes they are...  Note the aircon units are COLD only - they do NOT have a heat function, so in winter the nostalgic freezing experience would continue to live on - for the entire train ...

So, although only a rumour, it is actually physically possible and indeed technically feasible.  Converting the trailer cars whilst technically possible, would be vastly problematic and would blow out costs well beyond the acceptable scope.  Ducting existing aircon in the motor cars on the other hand could be done with minimal fuss and expense, and the government would likely believe they could spin it into a revolutionary win for the travelling public...

If there's any truth to the rumours, then it will be down this path, so they can claim the non air conditioned carriages have been reduced by half, and the rumours I'm hearing suggest that S Sets ARE required for the next major timetable change, so there is an element of credibility to the rumour...

The A/C unit in crew cabs would not be sufficiently powerful to a/c anything other than the crew cabs. I suggest this thread be locked as it is only attracting the usual BS.

The A/C unit in crew cabs would not be sufficiently powerful to a/c anything other than the crew cabs. I suggest this thread be locked as it is only attracting the usual BS.

That's what I was thinking too - it's just a little box isn't it?

An A/C unit that powers a crew cab would small enough to fit under a seat and would draw very little electricity.   And frankly, I believe its far more important that a driver to be comfortable while in a train, than a passenger.

An A/C unit that powers a crew cab would small enough to fit under a seat and would draw very little electricity.   And frankly, I believe its far more important that a driver to be comfortable while in a train, than a passenger.