2019 Federal Election Thread

 
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
26 times they voted against it.

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  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
The Howard-lovers can protest all they like, but "never, ever" means exactly what it says. He lied.
Valvegear
The one eye'd red shirt brigade can twist it as much as they like but then again they hate the use of the democratic process and prefer the socialist approach of back door dictatorship decision making

- CGT not put to election after saying won't happen
- CO2 tax back flip within months of an election saying it won't happen
- Reduction in shift allowances, not put to external review
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Julia, didn't "really" lead the government.
Oakshott and Windor did.
michaelgm
Nope, she was the Prime Minister and leader of the Labor Party Fact Check

Bucks stops with the Leader of the govt and party and accordingly she was dumped by her own party and the public later on.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Valvegear, again, Howard changed his mind over three years - which ever way you wrinkle it, that’s about 50 times longer than it took Gillard to change her mind about a carbon tax that wouldn’t be initiated ‘under a government I lead’...
I'm not singling Howard out just as a bashing exercise - I'm using him as an example. Gillard is another horrible example which I am perfectly happy to add to the mix.
Any pollie who says "Never" is so stupid that he/she should at the very least have advisers teaching how to speak; it's obvious they can't think for themselves. It really is very simple to say, "there are no immediate plans."
Valvegear
Problem is you did single out Howard and never mentioned anyone else and to put the GST into the same boat or "mix" as the CO2 tax disaster is an insult to commonsense.

Howard gave YOU a bloody choice, yes he changed his mind, so what, you probably already changed your mind a few times today. It happens in industry and in govt as needs require, build a bridge and get over it. However as leader of the party and govt he then took a risk and put the ultimate decision to the people to seek their opinion and as the polls show came very close to loosing govt in the process and after the implementation of the tax increased his majority, twice!

If you are calling this bad politics or bad govt then your expectations of govt are completely unrealistic.

Its very easy in the days of the internet to hang on every word that comes out of the politicians mouth and throw it back at them at will and if we are expecting our politicians to be that flawless we are kidding ourselves. Additionally YOU don't know how genuine he was or wasn't when he said that so don't pretend to guess.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Regardless of what happened with the GST, John Howard’s quote is now synonymous with the duplicity of politicians and that’s the context it was used in. It’s up there with the unempathetic  ‘Life wasn’t meant to be easy’, ‘The recession Australia had to have’ and ‘Lifters and Leaners’. The John Howard cheer-leading exercise has been pretty much a waste of time and probably off topic.
kitchgp
You can also add
- Plant a billion trees in a decade
- No child will be in poverty
- This is good as it gets
- Something about how much money should you expect from welfare or what ever (TA I think)
etc

Politicians on both sides are human and we as voters need to be realistic with expectations and some of their gaffs, often stated in a rage of excitement. Some are better than others, but the better ones often lack that charisma that gets the top job.

Whats more important is what they do and how they go about it?
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Whats more important is what they do and how they go about it?
"RTT_Rules"
Well; who'd have thought it? RTT is a closet communist - the end justifies the means.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Valvegear, again, Howard changed his mind over three years - which ever way you wrinkle it, that’s about 50 times longer than it took Gillard to change her mind about a carbon tax that wouldn’t be initiated ‘under a government I lead’...Additionally YOU don't know how genuine he was or wasn't when he said that so don't pretend to guess.
RTT_Rules

There was nothing whatsoever about Johnny Howard that wasn't for sale, he was the master of sticking his head about the parapet and sailing in the direction of public opinion. He didn't earn "The Rodent" for no reason.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
You can also add
- Plant a billion trees in a decade
- No child will be in poverty
- This is good as it gets
RTT_Rules
"No child in poverty" was particularly memorable, he realised he'd made a mistake straight away. I think by then his own party was starting to question him but like Margaret Thatcher he had to be blasted out of the top job with dynamite.

Incidentally I'm not chilling the champagne just yet but it's in the pantry waiting for its time.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Valvegear, again, Howard changed his mind over three years - which ever way you wrinkle it, that’s about 50 times longer than it took Gillard to change her mind about a carbon tax that wouldn’t be initiated ‘under a government I lead’...Additionally YOU don't know how genuine he was or wasn't when he said that so don't pretend to guess.

There was nothing whatsoever about Johnny Howard that wasn't for sale, he was the master of sticking his head about the parapet and sailing in the direction of public opinion. He didn't earn "The Rodent" for no reason.
don_dunstan
Politics is about being popular, otherwise you may as well join Railpage Lounge Smile
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
You can also add
- Plant a billion trees in a decade
- No child will be in poverty
- This is good as it gets
"No child in poverty" was particularly memorable, he realised he'd made a mistake straight away. I think by then his own party was starting to question him but like Margaret Thatcher he had to be blasted out of the top job with dynamite.

Incidentally I'm not chilling the champagne just yet but it's in the pantry waiting for its time.
don_dunstan
Don,
We all make comments that we are not always intended as they sound or just a general example not susposed to be used as a metric.

I know or at least assume you mis-typed a word in another (Irrelevant) thread, but I played on it, alot! politicians suffer the same and you can see in the house during debate time its all game playing trying to pick at each others wording. They even smile at each other when doing so.

The average voter is however easily led by propaganda mostly from media and Unions etc who turn on these poorly stated quoted.
  Aaron Minister for Railways

Location: University of Adelaide SA
What’s the problem with John Howard following public opinion? Our politicians are popularly elected, isn’t following public opinion what they are supposed to be doing? I would have thought so, and maybe, just maybe, that’s why he managed to keep a job for so long that effectively no one has been able to keep since...
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
What’s the problem with John Howard following public opinion? Our politicians are popularly elected, isn’t following public opinion what they are supposed to be doing? I would have thought so, and maybe, just maybe, that’s why he managed to keep a job for so long that effectively no one has been able to keep since...
Aaron
Ultimately he just couldn't be trusted to do what he said he was going to do... but you're right, the public didn't really seem to care anyway.

Laura Tingle wrote an interesting piece on the ABC News site this morning pointing out that the government has stopped negotiating with cross-bench senators altogether - as if they can't be bothered trying to get anything through for the rest of their term. I think the focus has turned on trying to survive any no-confidence motions in the lower house?
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Whats more important is what they do and how they go about it?
Well; who'd have thought it? RTT is a closet communist - the end justifies the means.
Valvegear
:roll:Hardly, since you have now stated repeatedly you prefer the communist dictatorship approach.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Ultimately he just couldn't be trusted to do what he said he was going to do... but you're right, the public didn't really seem to care anyway.

don_dunstan
Of course the public cared, the cared so much that the gave the LNP the go ahead to implement the GST after the LNP used the appropriate tool to seek their opinion.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Hardly, since you have now stated repeatedly you prefer the communist dictatorship approach.
"RTT_Rules"
Good try, but no kewpie doll. You've had a couple of days and that's the best you can do. You swallowed the bait, and could only respond by publishing a blatant lie. I thought better of you.
  davesvline Chief Commissioner

Location: 1983-1998
Now can we just get a politician to say we're NOT going to build or grant approval for a coal fired power station???
Based on the liar liar calling, and backflips et all, if we can get it said we'd probably all end up better off??

It'd provide "jobs n growf ", and if we run into problems, maybe we can call it a desal plant Laughing

Regards
  Carnot Chief Commissioner

Building a new coal-fired power station would appeal to about 20% of the electorate. Ain't gonna happen, and you can get more renewable power up and running quicker and cheaper anyway.

And I usually vote conservative because I can't stand much of the identity politics of the Left. Might even vote informal this time around if there are no candidates or parties who are both environmentally aware and also socially conservative.
  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

Building a new coal-fired power station would appeal to about 20% of the electorate.
Carnot
I could be persuaded to flip and join the 20% if the policy was to build it within the present boundaries of the Division of Warringah.
  Valvegear Dr Beeching

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Let's not muck about; build one in the Division of Cook where Morrison's family can enjoy it.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Building a new coal-fired power station would appeal to about 20% of the electorate. Ain't gonna happen, and you can get more renewable power up and running quicker and cheaper anyway.

And I usually vote conservative because I can't stand much of the identity politics of the Left. Might even vote informal this time around if there are no candidates or parties who are both environmentally aware and also socially conservative.
Carnot
Probably a bit more as not everyone has their rose coloured classes on.

No, right now and for at least next 10 years you cannot build a RE replacement cheaper and unlikely quicker, I'm talking despatchable which is the problem we are increasingly facing lack of. If you could, they would be doing it now as you will never find a more attractive whole sale price.

The reason no major party pollie will commit to no coal is because they are fully aware of the realistic facts and limitations of RE as applied to Australia and therefore won't go down a pathway of no return just yet.

Ironically the bulk of the middle east Gulf states makes desal water very cheaply by using the waste heat of their thermal power stations still left after the steam generator to supply desal water to over 250m people, cheaply and reliably. So should a new coal power station or even a CCGT power station be built its very cheap to bolt on a desal plant and supply water at low cost and thus increase the overall thermal efficiency of the power station to over 85-90%. But no what does Australia do, builds half a dozen desal plants which rely on constant power from the likes of coal to use an energy intensive desal process.
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
LOL, Chinese Communist Party operative demands that the Aussie political parties he gave money to return said money on account of his being kicked out of the country... ABC;

Huang Xiangmo quickly rose to become a leading pro-China lobbyist, courting politicians and donating at least $2 million to Australian political parties directly and through his companies.

But a decision from the Home Affairs Department to strip him of permanent residency and reject his citizenship application, made while Mr Huang was offshore, leaves him unable to re-enter the country.

Security agencies have raised concerns about Mr Huang's possible links to the Chinese Communist Party and the motivation behind his generous donations.

A joint ABC-Fairfax investigation in 2017 revealed his bid for an Australian passport had stalled due to those concerns.

In a statement issued on Friday, Mr Huang said he had been treated unfairly by the Australian Government and had not broken any Australian laws.

"It is profoundly disappointing to be treated in such a grotesquely unfair manner," Mr Huang's said.

Gosh, why aren't these ASIO and Foreign Affairs assessments for sale? Grossly unfair.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
The one eye'd red shirt brigade can twist it as much as they like but then again they hate the use of the democratic process and prefer the socialist approach of back door dictatorship decision making
RTT_Rules
Our authoritarian loving wrought wingers do keep trying to conjure up that ghost of Joe Stalin Rolling Eyes

The fact remains, those anointed by their god as 'Right' have vigorously and often violently opposed most of the 'rights' we now take for granted. That includes pluralistic democracy, something they have been trying to undermine ever since. In fact the rise of communism in Russia and China was partly driven by the total absence of representative democracy. Thank the 'Right' for that RTT!

Things like consumer protection and accessible healthcare were not implemented by the regressive side of politics. Once such things become entrenched political reality means they can't kill them off as quickly as their ideology requires.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Our authoritarian loving wrought wingers do keep trying to conjure up that ghost of Joe Stalin Rolling Eyes

The fact remains, those anointed by their god as 'Right' have vigorously and often violently opposed most of the 'rights' we now take for granted. That includes pluralistic democracy, something they have been trying to undermine ever since. In fact the rise of communism in Russia and China was partly driven by the total absence of representative democracy. Thank the 'Right' for that RTT!

Things like consumer protection and accessible healthcare were not implemented by the regressive side of politics. Once such things become entrenched political reality means they can't kill them off as quickly as their ideology requires.
Groundrelay
So you are blaming the right side of politics for the rise of communism where as Communism became entrenched in countries like Russia that was still basically a feudal Monarchy at the time.

Opposition of views that will impact on your livelyhood and standard of living occur all the time, whether they are real or perceived. whats your point?

Each side adds their own spice to the democratic stew, over time we operate in the approximate average over this mix. One side adds one thing and one sides adds another, when we have had enough of one we push them aside to get fed by the other. Its called democracy 101, whats your point?
  don_dunstan Minister for Railways

Location: Adelaide proud
Our authoritarian loving wrought wingers do keep trying to conjure up that ghost of Joe Stalin Rolling Eyes
Groundrelay
No one ideology has killed more people than communism.
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville
Our authoritarian loving wrought wingers do keep trying to conjure up that ghost of Joe Stalin Rolling Eyes
No one ideology has killed more people than communism.
don_dunstan

Other than Christianity and perhaps Islam.

And there again the fascists come from such a broad church it's it bit hard to calculate their sins Razz

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