NSW Main South and West deviations

Warks · Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 6:27 pm

Have been looking at the line maps on nswrail.net (aka Rolfeworld) and I am wondering about some of the deviations shown. Rolfe will probably be able to explain. Some examples:

I assume the shortest line is the new track. Although I've not visited these precise locations (has anyone?) I know of others like Binalong where the station is at a new location with a deviation.
There are some on the Main West as well which aren't shown, in particular Sodwalls, which is quite extensive.

Note the small one near Rydal though.

I'm not sure of the origin of these maps - I guess only Rolfe can explain. I'm assuming they are not complete. I would have thought there were a lot more.

Here's another on the North Coast line, only one I could find:

No maps for the South Coast line so can't check there.

... and loving it!

duttonbay · Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 6:57 pm

drwaddles · Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:24 pm

What a timely thread, as I just scanned this. It's a brochure my mate picked up for me when he went through Gunning a few weeks ago - it's got some information for you on the deviations in that area.
Download here.

Also, I started a thread on one of the Main West deviations and discussion spread to the remainder of them. You can find it here.

Rolfe's maps aren't complete - but the old NSW topographic maps show most of the deviations. Since they were compiled from aerial photography, you know there were some remnants to be seen at the location at least then, if not now.

People who talk out their asre usually have bad breath.

NSWRcars · Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:39 pm

M636C · Posted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 11:04 pm

As far as the Main South is concerned, the NSWGR published in the early 1970s a set of drawings showing the original line as a solid line and deviations as dotted lines.

I find them amazingly useful, particularly as they show North at the top and help in working out photo locations from a lighting point of view.

The nswrail.net maps are far from complete - between Fish River and Cullerin, the main road (formerly the Hume Highway) was on the old formation and from the date on the "Top Bridge" had been so since 1928, (the rail deviation occuring about 1915).

Equally the secondary road shown from Jindalee to Morrison's Hill follows the original formation.

A similar deviation is partly shown between Jerrawa and Oolong.

M636C

7334 · Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 12:51 am

In the early and late 1940s the ARHS in their monthly Bulletin (I think it was called that at the time) published a series by C C Singleton which covered the deviations of the main south in some detail.

The break in the middle was, believe it or not, due to the war and the perception that the information being published could be of use to the enemy. As a consequence the series was suspended for the duration of the war and resumed after it. Seems a bit hard to believe that the information on the location of railway lines could not have been obtained elsewhere but that was the thinking at the time.

The articles were published in foolscap and printed from old wax masters but were thorough in the same way as other material prepared by Singleton.

I obtained photocopies from the ARHS some years ago and they explained a lot about what had been done. I had to bear in mind that what I was reading had been written at least 50 years ago and that when mention was made of something still being in evidence it wasn't necessarily so.

I do not know about the west but in the Bulletin around 1966 there was a series about the Waterfall to Coalcliff deviations so Singleton was still at it then.

Regards,

7334

awsgc24 · Posted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 9:00 am

7334 · Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 6:20 pm

I have dug out the copies of the ARHS Bulletin I referred to in a previous post and which I obtained some years ago. While I had previously been under the impression that the deviations all resulted from grade easing associated with the duplication this was not correct.

Several of the deviations, including the major ones on Morrisons Hill and at Frampton were actually constructed well before the duplication as single track, and later duplicated with the rest of the line.

Between Harden and Cootamundra there were four major deviations constructed in 1900 while duplication did not occur until 1915.

The following is a direct quote from page 11 of ARHS Bulletin 111 of January 1947 which deals with the Harden to Cootamundra section.

In reading it, Newington was a crossing loop between Harden and Wallendbeen, while Wamba was a crossing loop between Cootamundra and Wallendbeen, somewhere about where the road overbridge crosses the current line a couple of kilometres north of Jindalee.

“Deviations during Single Line Period

The numerous 1 in 40 gradients between Harden and Cootamundra resulted in expensive and sluggish working, with very short trains, if double heading was to be avoided, so, as the location ran through fairly easy country with a minimum of rock, regrading was decided on to give up trains a ruling grade of 1 in 75, which more or less balanced the empty trucks in a train load over 1 in 40 grades in the down direction. Pending completion of the large deviations involved two minor regradings were made in 1898 by the simple method of lifting the original line. These were:— 1½ miles in length, on the Cootamundra side of Jindalee, and ¾ mile in length immediately on the Sydney side of Cootamundra yard. In the year 1900 the four large deviations were brought into use, thus giving a ruling grade of 1 in 75 uncompensated from Cootamundra to Harden for up trains. The Harden to Murrumburrah Deviation extended from the former station yard to just beyond Murrumburrah, (the station having to be relocated on the new line) a distance of 1 mile 76 chains. The deviation included a new bridge over Murrimboola Creek. The second deviation was 3 miles 67 chains in length and extended from the junction points of the Blayney line at Demondrille to a mile on the Sydney side of Newington crossing Demondrille Creek by a new bridge. The junction arrangements and triangle at Demondrille were completely remodelled. The third deviation, 2 miles 51 chains in length, commenced immediately beyond Nubba and terminated at Connaughtmans Creek crossing immediately before reaching Wallendbeen. The fourth deviation, 5 miles 47 chains in length, was so tortuous that it added 1 mile 62 chains to the length of journey; it commenced at the top of the ridge 2 miles south of Wallendbeen and rejoined the original line north of Jindalee.

Duplication

As the first installment of the duplication to Cootamundra in this section, relief was given to the long single line sections Demondrille — Newington — Wallendbeen by opening a temporary junction at Demondrille Creek 2 miles on the Sydney side of Newington and duplicating the line from that point to Wallendbeen, a distance of 7 miles 26 chains, the opening date being June 13, 1915. Two other sections with fairly light earthwork followed., Wamba to Cootamundra North Junction opening on June 10, 1917, and Wallendbeen to Wamba on June 17, 1917. With the completion of a steel bridge over Murrimboola Creek Bridge the section between Harden South Box and Murrumburrah was opened on March, 25, 1918. Owing to the amount of work involved in constructing the new station, yard, coaling elevated bins, and dive at Demondrille, together with the curve improvements and new bridge over Demondrille Creek, the section from Murrumburrah and Demondrille was not opened till July 9, 1922 and. from Demondrille to Demondrille Creek till July 17, 1922, thus completing the double track from Sydney to Cootamundra North Box.

Deviations duping Duplication

The crossing of Murrimboola Creek at Murrumburrah entailed a minor realignment, as the new bridge was erected on the up side of the original deviation single line structure, and this resulted in alteration to the down platform at the station. While the duplication work was proceeding, opportunity was taken to ease several curves of 20 chains radius between Demondrille and Demondrille Creek. To enable loads of down goods trains (built up at Demondrille) to be hauled by a single engine to Cootamundra, the ruling grade of 1 in 40 up Morrisons Hill Bank was eased to 1 in 66 by means of a regrading laid alongside on the up side o± the original location for 1 mile 25 chains. At low lying parts of the Jindalee Creek Valley where trouble had occurred from washaways, the line was lifted and the creek canalised. All these were carried out with the duplication work and brought into use with the opening of each new section.”

The following is a direct quote from pages 44 and 46 of ARHS Bulletin 114 of April 1947 which deals with the Cootamundra to Junee section:

“Early Deviations

As far back as 1897 four minor regradings inside the railway boundary were carried out between Bethungra and Illabo which provided maximum grades of 1 in 75 against up trains on that section. Three of these were simple lifts on the original centre line, and the southernmost one, which required lowering, was constructed on the down side but adjacent to the original location.
In 1898 a deviation 2 miles 73 chains in length was made on the Sydney side of Frampton giving a ruling grade of 1 in 75 against up trains in place of the original 1 in 40, but adding 1 mile 7 chains to the journey. The above alterations had the effect of allowing a greatly increased single engine load to be hauled from Junee to Cootamundra - if assisted in the rear up Junee and Bethungra banks of 3 miles and 3½ miles respectively.

Duplications

Duplication work south of Cootamundra North Junction as far as Junee, was commenced as a war measure, to give continuous double track over the 300 miles from Sydney to a point where the heavy interstate traffic could be divided over the two single lines via Albury and Tocumwal transhipment stations respectively. The sections of duplication were opened in the following order:- Cootamundra South Box to Tanyinna, March 8, 1942; Bethungra to Illabo, August 16, 1942; Illabo to Junee South Box, October 18, 1942; Cootamundra North Junction to Cootamundra South Box (including Cootarnundra~now yard) April 11, 1943. Owing to the extremely heavy rook excavation involved, the last section from Tanyinna to Bethungra was not opened until July, 1946.

Deviations during Duplication

When duplication was approved, it was decided to extend the working of 57 c1ass engines to Junee and improve the grades and structures to permit of these engines hauling through goods loads of 1000 tons from Junee to Cootamundra without assistance, thus making a standard load to Goulburn. As the existing grades against down trains provided for approximately a balancing number of empty vehicles they were not altered.
At the old Frampton Deviation a grade of 1 in 75 uncompensated existed giving the standard load required, but the abandoned formation, which descended at a grade of 1 in 40, was utilised as far as practicable for the new down line, incidentally saving 1 mile 7 chains of running for each down train. This new down line was brought into use as part of the Cootamundra South-Tanyinna duplication in 1942.”

From this it seems that the original line just to the north of Frampton was deviated in 1898 and then became a deviation of the deviation in 1942.

Hope some of this helps

Regards,

7334

awsgc24 · Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 7:49 pm

penov · Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 10:13 am

[quote from 7334]
The break in the middle was, believe it or not, due to the war and the perception that the information being published could be of use to the enemy. As a consequence the series was suspended for the duration of the war and resumed after it. Seems a bit hard to believe that the information on the location of railway lines could not have been obtained elsewhere but that was the thinking at the time.
[/quote]

Of interest, after Japan entered the war in 1941, with possible invasion of Australia, all "streamer boards" and signs on railway stations within 100
miles of the coast had to be removed in case they could be read by enemy aircraft. This included boards on all signal boxes and platform names in the metropolitan area of Melbourne unless they were under the station verandah roof. Guards had to call the names of suburban stations for the benefit of passengers. To make no bones about it, everyone was sh#tscared in those days. Railway lines were classed as army installations - if anyone took a photo of a train without permission you could be on a treason charge - not that anyone had a film in their camera, you couldn't buy them.

Warks · Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:55 pm

Thanks for all the great info everyone. It would be good to see the maps on nswrail.net with all the deviations but I think Rolfe has been rather busy this year!
drwaddles that brochure was so interesting I had to print it off for a leisurely read.
Next time I'm along there I'll have a good explore with the camera. Pics to come... one day.

... and loving it!

rolfe · Posted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 1:33 pm

These maps were all generated from a digital dataset I obtained from Geoscience Australia. As has been noted, it does contain a number of deviations, but if I recall correctly, it didn't include information about which parts were the old and which were the new. I didn't really want to go through and sort it out, so I just generated the maps as is.

At the time, I was much more interested in producing nice looking maps and working out how to automatically lay out the labels so they didn't overwrite each other, than in trying to get the deviations right!

Rolfe

drwaddles · Posted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 6:05 pm

I feel your pain, Rolfe - those datasets are usually riddled with errors Sad

People who talk out their asre usually have bad breath.

Warks · Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 8:53 pm

Courtesy of Hairyleg's gargantuan work I can now illustrate the deviations:

Cullerin

Fish River

Gunning 1

Gunning 2

Oolong

Jerrawa

Coolalie

It looks like there could be another one on the Cullerin bend - the road that cuts it is the old highway?
Discuss.

... and loving it!

Nightfire · Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 9:36 pm

would It be feasible to re-aline some of the deviations back onto the old straighter alinements (Main South) ?

As a lot of the old earthworks are still In place.

Austraila needs to stop stuffing around with different rail gauges and all go Stephenson Standard 4'8.5"(1435mm)