Sydney Light Rail Extension

 

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  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
I believe this is good thing, but I'm worried about how the bus network will be reconfigured, as that affects far more people. So far, little has been said, apart from passing comments.

I honestly believe that the state government has got it upside down - the buses should be reorganised first.
  Peter Spyker Train Controller

No mention of it connecting to the existing light rail. I presume it will, but you'd think they'd actually make a big thing of it.
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
No mention of it connecting to the existing light rail. I presume it will, but you'd think they'd actually make a big thing of it.
"Peter Spyker"


They will both run via Central, though it appears the new line will run via Eddy Ave rather than up the Colonnade. I'm not sure how they'll build a junction at George/Hay, but I suppose that's not as important as phallic nosecones whooshing around the CBD.
  Waratah842 Junior Train Controller

Location: On Earth
They'll probably make a timetable but will they build a depot andwhere?
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
There already is a timetable. It's just not public. Trams run at ~12 minute intervals.
  jken8476 Station Master

How will this new light rail line interface with the inner west light rail line? Will the inner west line trams turn up george st and proceed to circular quay as well? rather than terminating at central?
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
How will this new light rail line interface with the inner west light rail line? Will the inner west line trams turn up george st and proceed to circular quay as well? rather than terminating at central?
"jken8476"


At the very least, there should be an interchange at Eddy Ave - the Lilyfield line will run via the Colonnade and the UNSW line will run via Eddy Ave, so connections can be made via the Eddy Ave forecourt.

They'll probably make a timetable but will they build a depot andwhere?
"Waratah842"


As a cost-cutting exercise, trams will be stabled overnight on Anzac Parade. (I'm joking. Obviously a depot will have to be built.)
  mboi84 Junior Train Controller

Location: Sydney
How will this new light rail line interface with the inner west light rail line? Will the inner west line trams turn up george st and proceed to circular quay as well? rather than terminating at central?
"jken8476"


At the very least, there should be an interchange at Eddy Ave - the Lilyfield line will run via the Colonnade and the UNSW line will run via Eddy Ave, so connections can be made via the Eddy Ave forecourt.

They'll probably make a timetable but will they build a depot andwhere?
"Waratah842"


As a cost-cutting exercise, trams will be stabled overnight on Anzac Parade. (I'm joking. Obviously a depot will have to be built.)
"Watson374"



Can I ask, why can't they redevelop and place the light rail interchange down near where the coach buses start/terminate from but instead of kicking them out - because lets be honest, there would be hell if that happened - but move the Sydney Buses bus stops to eddy ave/railway square and have the trams stop there to interchange with the trams above that will go to lillyfield/dulwich hill?

Makes sense to me to do that then to have all these separate light rail/bus/train interchanges - will only become confusing and a nightmare for all

On another note, I would like to point out that I really don't like the livery within the vids for the new extension/trains. I mean its bad enough the buses have gone sky blue/white but red and white??? Lets gets some consistency happening with liveries for everything. Next they will probably want sky blue, red and white for the train liveries
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
Can I ask, why can't they redevelop and place the light rail interchange down near where the coach buses start/terminate from but instead of kicking them out - because lets be honest, there would be hell if that happened - but move the Sydney Buses bus stops to eddy ave/railway square and have the trams stop there to interchange with the trams above that will go to lillyfield/dulwich hill?
"mboi84"


For starters, State Transit buses stop at Eddy Ave and Railway Sq already, so I'm not exactly sure what you're hinting there. What I can suggest, however, is a configuration in which the coaches are moved somewhere more sheltered and Eddy Ave be turned into a bus-tram interchange. The buses should run in the middle, flanked by the trams. This allows parallel-path cross-platform interchange between buses and trams.

That's just one possibility, though.

Makes sense to me to do that then to have all these separate light rail/bus/train interchanges - will only become confusing and a nightmare for all
"mboi84"


Ideally, Central would be a true superhub. Sadly, it isn't, extending from Railway Sq to Eddy Ave to Chalmers St.

On another note, I would like to point out that I really don't like the livery within the vids for the new extension/trains. I mean its bad enough the buses have gone sky blue/white but red and white??? Lets gets some consistency happening with liveries for everything. Next they will probably want sky blue, red and white for the train liveries
"mboi84"


In all honesty, the best livery was the last STA one - corporate blue and white.

In other news, I've found it extremely interesting that the tram should take the same time to get to Randwick as the bus. 1.6 billion dollars for no mobility improvement!
  fixitguy Chief Train Controller

Location: In Carriage 4 on a Tangara

For starters, State Transit buses stop at Eddy Ave and Railway Sq already, so I'm not exactly sure what you're hinting there. What I can suggest, however, is a configuration in which the coaches are moved somewhere more sheltered and Eddy Ave be turned into a bus-tram interchange. The buses should run in the middle, flanked by the trams. This allows parallel-path cross-platform interchange between buses and trams.

That's just one possibility, though.
"Watson374"


Could the coach terminal use the space where currently trackwork busses depart with a new shelter built or is that not a good location?


In all honesty, the best livery was the last STA one - corporate blue and white.
"Watson374"

that should have been the livery for T4NSW. the current one sereiously wtf were they thinking


In other news, I've found it extremely interesting that the tram should take the same time to get to Randwick as the bus. 1.6 billion dollars for no mobility improvement!
"Watson374"

no speed improvement are you fricking kidding me Barry.
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
Could the coach terminal use the space where currently trackwork busses depart with a new shelter built or is that not a good location?
"fixitguy"


Careful - trackwork buses depart from all three locations (Eddy Ave, Chalmers St, behind Platform 1).

Putting coaches behind Platform 1 is a possibility, but it's slot-restricted.

that should have been the livery for T4NSW. the current one sereiously wtf were they thinking
"fixitguy"


omg i feel u bro

no speed improvement are you fricking kidding me Barry.
"fixitguy"


Just because it's a tram, not a bus, doesn't mean it'll get anywhere faster.
  bambul Station Master

Location: Sydney
The advantage of trams isn't that they are faster than buses, it's that they have a higher capacity. The determinants of speed are things like exclusive rights of way, few stops, grade separation, all door boarding, etc. You can have those for buses as well as trams.
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
The advantage of trams isn't that they are faster than buses, it's that they have a higher capacity.
"bambul"


Correct, but a lot of the congestion is caused by inefficiencies of how the network is configured, not because it uses buses.

The determinants of speed are things like exclusive rights of way, few stops, grade separation, all door boarding, etc. You can have those for buses as well as trams.
"bambul"


Correct.
  fixitguy Chief Train Controller

Location: In Carriage 4 on a Tangara
Could the coach terminal use the space where currently trackwork busses depart with a new shelter built or is that not a good location?
"fixitguy"


Careful - trackwork buses depart from all three locations (Eddy Ave, Chalmers St, behind Platform 1).

Putting coaches behind Platform 1 is a possibility, but it's slot-restricted.

"Watson374"


thats what i meant. behind platform 1. i could see the carpark being changed to coach terminals, maybe the current MLR sation could be used with lightrail (like as you said) on Eddy Ave continuing on to UNSW and Randwick
  Watson374 Chief Commissioner

Location: Fully reclined at the pointy end.
thats what i meant. behind platform 1. i could see the carpark being changed to coach terminals,
"fixitguy"


I know, but I wanted to make sure everyone else knew that.

maybe the current MLR sation could be used with lightrail (like as you said) on Eddy Ave continuing on to UNSW and Randwick
"fixitguy"


I'd say they should have separate stops - Lilyfield upstairs and George St/UNSW downstairs.
  Fred Scuttle Junior Train Controller

Location: Point Clare, NSW
Having looked at the light rail plan, a  number of questions arise:

1.    The line heads up Devonshire Street in the direction of Moore Park, Anzac Parade, etc. However, Devonshire Street comes to an abrupt end at Bourke Street. The projected route map shows the line continuing on towards Anzac Parade. This looks to me as if property resumptions are going to be required. Also, how is the line going to (a) get across South Dowling Street, and (b) is the line going to cut across Moore Park to reach Anzac Parade? I myself would reckon that a better way to go would be to go down Crown Street from Devonshire, and then onto Cleveland Street, and from there to Anzac Parade (or is that too easy?).

2.   I see that the line is projected to travel via Alison Road and Walmsley Street. Is the tram reservation from Alison Road (opposite Randwick Workshops) to Belmore Road no longer available? Admittedly, I haven't been to the Randwick area for a few years.

3.   There seems to be no mention of depot accomodation. The current car shed at Ultimo would appear to be somewhat restricted, given that there will be an influx of new cars. Is the site capable of expansion, or would it be more feasible to build a new depot elsewhere (which should be, ideally, centrally located, so as to minimise the problem of "dead" kilometerage from empty running)?

4.   Has any thought been given to reactivating Randwick Workshops as an overhaul/maintenance facility for the light rail fleet?

Thoughts, anyone?
  Waratah842 Junior Train Controller

Location: On Earth
Kind of a stupid suggestion but anyway, they could use platform 26 and 27 that were never used, and somehow connect the tunnel to Eddy Ave.
  fixitguy Chief Train Controller

Location: In Carriage 4 on a Tangara
Kind of a stupid suggestion but anyway, they could use platform 26 and 27 that were never used, and somehow connect the tunnel to Eddy Ave.
"Waratah842"


it would be cheaper to use Eddy Ave. it also provides a beter connection with the current lightrail (going up the esclators). save platform 26/27 for metro or cityrail expansion.
  Waratah842 Junior Train Controller

Location: On Earth
Yep, likely those platforms in the next few decades will be used. Smile
  dat581 Chief Train Controller

Location: The Shire
I wonder what the government will do with the tram fleet when it comes time to order new trams for the New South Eastern Lines. We have six variotrams plus the CAF trams on order for the Inner West Extension and will need to order more so will they make another relatively small order for new trams and have a fleet with three different trams or replace the lot with a completely new fleet? The variotrams are now 15 years old so a mid-life upgrade should at least be on the cards when the CAF trams arrive.
  fixitguy Chief Train Controller

Location: In Carriage 4 on a Tangara
I wonder what the government will do with the tram fleet when it comes time to order new trams for the New South Eastern Lines. We have six variotrams plus the CAF trams on order for the Inner West Extension and will need to order more so will they make another relatively small order for new trams and have a fleet with three different trams or replace the lot with a completely new fleet? The variotrams are now 15 years old so a mid-life upgrade should at least be on the cards when the CAF trams arrive.
"dat581"


what if we order more CAF trams?

http://tdu.to/181808.msg
if the link above works theres a pic of a CAF tram in T4NSW livery. also for some reason there is a double deck bus in current T4NSW livery. although off topic but could we see a return of double deck busses in sydney?
  Fred Scuttle Junior Train Controller

Location: Point Clare, NSW
I wonder what the government will do with the tram fleet when it comes time to order new trams for the New South Eastern Lines. We have six variotrams plus the CAF trams on order for the Inner West Extension and will need to order more so will they make another relatively small order for new trams and have a fleet with three different trams or replace the lot with a completely new fleet? The variotrams are now 15 years old so a mid-life upgrade should at least be on the cards when the CAF trams arrive.
"dat581"


It hasn't really been made clear what the purchasing policy for rolling stock will be. It would make sense to increase the current order for CAF trams, as well as carry out a mid-life upgrade on the Variotrams. Even if trams of a different design are ordered for the South-Eastern lines, an augmented order of CAF trams for the Inner West would allow the pressure to be taken off the Variotrams (maybe seeing them pulled back from front-line duties).

It's still early days yet, but I daresay we will, in due course, see the question of depot accomodation addressed - pity that Dowling Street was bulldozed some 20-odd years ago. Smile
  Waratah842 Junior Train Controller

Location: On Earth
Replying to fixitguy's querie, the double deck busses are currently operating from Blacktown to (I think) Castle Hill. From my knowledge, the government plans to roll out more on different lines.
  fixitguy Chief Train Controller

Location: In Carriage 4 on a Tangara
Replying to fixitguy's querie, the double deck busses are currently operating from Blacktown to (I think) Castle Hill. From my knowledge, the government plans to roll out more on different lines.
"Waratah842"


thanks for that. could we see them after the trial as a premant part of Sydney's bus network?

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