A-City trains

 
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

I would be amazed if the permanent coupling between the first and second car could be done outside in the yard like that.

These are not old-style railcars that can be coupled and uncoupled at will; these are permanently coupled cars that, once coupled, operate as one unit. Many of the various systems involved are by no means duplicated on each of the three cars that make up one unit.

A road-rail vehicle of some kind (using rubber tyres for better traction) might be more suitable for getting the centre car into the commissioning shed in the absence of a 3000-compatible coupling on either end.
justapassenger

Agree about the rubber tyred vehicle, they seem to work quite well moving three ballast hoppers, about the same or more mass as a three car EMU. A new way of getting EMUs to Dry Creek Depot.

Having the Goal Loop would help. Laughing

Sponsored advertisement

  Halo Chief Train Controller

So how long till we get the next third?
I did hear that both the other two pieces were due this week, but that would have the truck running pretty much 24hrs a day, all week!

Perhaps one more car this week, but I would find two hard to believe.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Thanks for this - just speculating, in the second photo there appears to be a box or something in an odd position at the end of the carriage - would that be to cover/protect the pantograph for the trip over?
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

So how long till we get the next third?
I did hear that both the other two pieces were due this week, but that would have the truck running pretty much 24hrs a day, all week!

Perhaps one more car this week, but I would find two hard to believe.
Halo
Well, no.

Each delivery run takes a day and a half of daytime running to get one over here, and presumably a shorter amount of time to do the return run without a 40-50 tonne rail vehicle on the back. It would be back in Melbourne on Wednesday afternoon, easily in time to make the next run on the same Thursday-Friday schedule as the first car that arrived last week.

So long as the crew schedules are arranged so they are well within the legal limits, I can't see the problem with doing two delivery runs in one week.


Thanks for this - just speculating, in the second photo there appears to be a box or something in an odd position at the end of the carriage - would that be to cover/protect the pantograph for the trip over?
don_dunstan

Possibly. It could also be the HVAC unit under that cover.
  Tonsley213 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Everywhere except South Kensington
Thanks for this - just speculating, in the second photo there appears to be a box or something in an odd position at the end of the carriage - would that be to cover/protect the pantograph for the trip over?
don_dunstan
Yes it would be to cover the pantograph.
  GeoffreyHansen Minister for Railways

Location: In a FAM sleeper
I was actually about to ask about the second and third carriages. Thanks very much for updating us.
  hosk1956 Deputy Commissioner

Location: no where near gunzels
Can somebody provide some clue as to why these EMUs are to be so heavy, or verify that the 185 tonne figure for each 3-car unit was just a made-up figure used for an applied example in a year 9 science lesson?

The Siemens Nexas (3 cars) and Alstom X'Trapolis 100 (3 cars) used in Melbourne are only a couple of metres shorter than the A-City, and come in at only 121 tonnes, albeit without the need for an AC transformer which alone cannot account for the 64 tonne difference.

The Bombardier 160/260 EMUs used by QR are also only a couple of metres shorter and also narrower, and they come in at 128 tonnes. As the A-City design is the newest evolution based on the 1980s AdTranz design (i.e. the next evolution after the QR 160/260 and Transperth B-series) this example is most important.

I accept that ours are a different design (or at least a new generation based on the same original design) to the other relatively recent types mentioned above, having slightly larger bodies to take advantage of slightly more generous gauging and various other miscellaneous updates. But a couple of metres should not account for a penalty that is equivalent to adding one and a half cars.

I would be disappointed at what would be a clear failure of the procurement process if we end up with the EMUs being any heavier than 125 tonnes each. The point of using an external electricity supply instead of on-board internal combustion engines is to reduce weight - which has the advantages of increased performance, increased efficiency and (very importantly in Adelaide where track maintenance requires a capital works program) less impact on the track. If the cars end up being 60-65 tonnes each compared to the current 46-48 tonne 3000/3100 cars it will have been a step backwards.
justapassenger
The data sheet list the end cars having a tare weight of 46.7 tonnes (60.0 tonnes gross), the centre cars are 43.5 tonne tare and 58.5 tonne gross.

Wayne
  Scooter_Guy Chief Train Controller

Location: Adelaide, SA. Suburb: Redwood Park
When will the third car of 4001 arrive?
  witsend Chief Commissioner

Location: Front RH Seat of a School Bus
When will the third car of 4001 arrive?
Scooter_Guy
On this schedule, Friday (assuming its ready).
  Alphatron Station Master

Location: Wellington
The data sheet list the end cars having a tare weight of 46.7 tonnes (60.0 tonnes gross), the centre cars are 43.5 tonne tare and 58.5 tonne gross.

Wayne
"hosk1956"


At nearly 180 tonnes gross for a 3 car set, they do seem to be pretty heavy . By comparison the new CAF 3 car EMUs for Auckland are only 155 tonnes gross (http://www.aucklandtransport.govt.nz/improving-transport/auckland-rail-upgrade/electric-trains/Pages/electric-train-design-and-features.aspx). Admittedly the Auckland cars are 1067 mm gauge so are narrower but 25 tonnes seems a lot more - I don't know what load factors have been used for both train's gross weight calculations though.

At the risk of starting a trans Tasman argument, I also think the CAF EMUs look rather better than the Adelaide trains (http://www.aucklandtransport.govt.nz/improving-transport/auckland-rail-upgrade/electric-trains/Pages/default.aspx)!
  Halo Chief Train Controller

Does the depot have 25kv yet to power up the resulting full set?
  nm39 Chief Commissioner

Location: By a road taking pictures
At nearly 180 tonnes gross for a 3 car set, they do seem to be pretty heavy . By comparison the new CAF 3 car EMUs for Auckland are only 155 tonnes gross (http://www.aucklandtransport.govt.nz/improving-transport/auckland-rail-upgrade/electric-trains/Pages/electric-train-design-and-features.aspx). Admittedly the Auckland cars are 1067 mm gauge so are narrower but 25 tonnes seems a lot more - I don't know what load factors have been used for both train's gross weight calculations though.

At the risk of starting a trans Tasman argument, I also think the CAF EMUs look rather better than the Adelaide trains (http://www.aucklandtransport.govt.nz/improving-transport/auckland-rail-upgrade/electric-trains/Pages/default.aspx)!
Alphatron
At the risk of a what? The capacity of the Auckland ones is 375 passengers. The A-City 240 Seated + a further 300. 540 passengers compared to 375- someones getting half a train.
  trainznbuses Train Controller

Location: Seacliff Park, SA


Last unit passed through Coonalpyn about 3:45 this afternoon. Looks like it is numbered 4001B.

Sorry about the camera phone quality. I think that it is interesting the direction that the unit is facing.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Looks like that settles the discussion about which way it will roll off the ramp at Seaford, and about the evenness of weight distribution.

I like the addition of the blue plastic on the forward-facing end for this run, but if you're going to protect part of the end from bug splats you may as well do the whole lot.
  Guard Class 2 Chief Commissioner

Location: Elizabeth,South Australia
So, based on the experiences with the previous 2 units, can anyone offer a predicted timetable and route for tomorrows movement from Tailem Bend? to Seaford?

I am thinking about trying to follow it, but would mean an early start from Elizabeth if I wanted to chase it from the start of its journey.
  GeoffreyHansen Minister for Railways

Location: In a FAM sleeper


Last unit passed through Coonalpyn about 3:45 this afternoon. Looks like it is numbered 4001B.

Sorry about the camera phone quality. I think that it is interesting the direction that the unit is facing.
"trainznbuses"


Thanks for posting the image of car 3. It's good to see Adelaide have a complete set. Will they put the set together right away?
  GeoffreyHansen Minister for Railways

Location: In a FAM sleeper


Last unit passed through Coonalpyn about 3:45 this afternoon. Looks like it is numbered 4001B.

Sorry about the camera phone quality. I think that it is interesting the direction that the unit is facing.
"trainznbuses"


Thanks for posting the image of car 3. It's good to see Adelaide have a complete set. Will they put the set together right away?
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

That would depend on the schedule of commissioning and testing activities I guess. The cars have previously been photographed at the Dandenong facility coupled together to form the full unit, so my guess is that it would be fairly prompt since they have been (at least once) in a state ready for coupling.

Depending on whether the local maintenance staff have previously spent time in Melbourne getting acquainted with the intra-unit permanent couplings, they might even get coupled and then decoupled just for the sake of practicing that work.

Bombardier's MITRAC computer system doesn't work until the cars are coupled together to form the full unit, so they definitely can't do anything much in the way of onboard system testing (using a DC shore supply) or staff training until the unit is formed.
  Mufreight Train Controller

Location: North Ipswich
That would depend on the schedule of commissioning and testing activities I guess. The cars have previously been photographed at the Dandenong facility coupled together to form the full unit, so my guess is that it would be fairly prompt since they have been (at least once) in a state ready for coupling.

Depending on whether the local maintenance staff have previously spent time in Melbourne getting acquainted with the intra-unit permanent couplings, they might even get coupled and then decoupled just for the sake of practicing that work.

Bombardier's MITRAC computer system doesn't work until the cars are coupled together to form the full unit, so they definitely can't do anything much in the way of onboard system testing (using a DC shore supply) or staff training until the unit is formed.
justapassenger
Almost a foregone conclusion that they will couple the three cars as soon as possible, it is most probable that the first two cars are already coupled.
The complete set will enable some testing immediately and the publicity machine can get into top gear with the usual political spin.
  BuddyALX Train Controller

Location: South Australia.
Can't wait to see the first set being tested, though I suppose it'd be hard to tell when exactly these tests would be carried out, one would think. Would be nice to get some footage of it in action long before service next year.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Most of the internal systems can easily be tested in the commissioning shed with a shore supply of high voltage DC hooked up downstream of the main transformer. It looks like it will be a fair while before there's electricity to do real runs on the line, and I'm sure it will be well reported on here if/when the electrification works get towards that point.
  nm39 Chief Commissioner

Location: By a road taking pictures
I would be amazed if the permanent coupling between the first and second car could be done outside in the yard like that.

These are not old-style railcars that can be coupled and uncoupled at will; these are permanently coupled cars that, once coupled, operate as one unit. Many of the various systems involved are by no means duplicated on each of the three cars that make up one unit.

A road-rail vehicle of some kind (using rubber tyres for better traction) might be more suitable for getting the centre car into the commissioning shed in the absence of a 3000-compatible coupling on either end.
justapassenger
Well, please be amazed. As I surmised, the railcars were rolled off the jinker, down the ramp and linked in the yard to the rest of the set. However today this was achieved with one poxbox to shunt the entire 4001 set without any trouble with the grade. Apparently the 4001 set will be ready for driver training on Monday. Whether this means out on the track or not is another question.
  Halo Chief Train Controller

I'm wondering what frequency of delivery we will get? Considering 4001 was finished two weeks ago....
  Scooter_Guy Chief Train Controller

Location: Adelaide, SA. Suburb: Redwood Park
Though the newly refurbished 3000 class trains announce the route of service & next station in a female voice, I think the new A-City trains should have a nice male voice that speaks sentences in different arrangements (e.g. "Now stopping at Seaford. This service terminates at Seaford. You can alight here for local bus services." OR "Now stopping at Goodwood. For service to Belair, you can change here.")
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Though the newly refurbished 3000 class trains announce the route of service & next station in a female voice, I think the new A-City trains should have a nice male voice that speaks sentences in different arrangements.
Scooter_Guy
I disagree on the male voice part - female voices are deliberately used in the majority of pre-recorded PA systems because of the greater clarity.

I agree that the wording of the announcements doesn't necessarily need to be the same, just so long as they aren't unnecessarily wordy or filled with railway jargonese. By virtue of being 5+ years newer than the automated systems of the 3000 units, the new units should have a greater storage capacity to have individual recordings rather than chopped and spliced phrases, and higher fidelity speakers.

The bigger question is who should do the recordings - it should be a local, maybe a newsreader from the ABC, to make sure it's not an interstate accent.

I expect that the main interchange is likely to be Wayville though, that's a far more plausible station for limited stop Seaford services to service than Goodwood.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from:   

Quick Reply

We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.