Carrying passengers in brakevans in WA- when was the practice stopped?

 
  benscaro Chief Commissioner

i'm wading through the WAGR carriages opus of bill gray and andy may and i suppose i will come across this information, but not noticed it yet.

i get a sense WAGR pulled mixed trains and booted passengers off goods trains very early and did so universally, as opposed to other places where the practice petered out more slowly; in tasmania, you might buy a ticket to ride in a goods train i think up until ANR takeover in 1978 and the emu bay railway ran a mixed until 1983, and SA, where you could ride in guards vans on the eyre peninsula -if nowhere else in the state- up until they pulled the vans in 1992.

i've always had it somewhere in the back of my head that WA drew a line under this kind of thing rather earlier and more definitively.  but not sure of the actual date.

i'd be pleased to get some clarification and dates.

ben

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i'm wading through the WAGR carriages opus of bill gray and andy may and i suppose i will come across this information, but not noticed it yet.

i get a sense WAGR pulled mixed trains and booted passengers off goods trains very early and did so universally, as opposed to other places where the practice petered out more slowly; in tasmania, you might buy a ticket to ride in a goods train i think up until ANR takeover in 1978 and the emu bay railway ran a mixed until 1983, and SA, where you could ride in guards vans on the eyre peninsula -if nowhere else in the state- up until they pulled the vans in 1992.

i've always had it somewhere in the back of my head that WA drew a line under this kind of thing rather earlier and more definitively.  but not sure of the actual date.

i'd be pleased to get some clarification and dates.

ben
benscaro
Qld you buy a ticket on a mixed train to two destinations up until around 2000 I think. Canned due to lack of retention toilets or complaints about standard of service (which QR didn't provide or pretent to) or something like that.
  crisfitz Chief Commissioner

Location: Enroute somewhere
I would imagine it ended with the withdrawal of the ZA / ZB vans, although I know you could travel in the van of hired specials long after that.
  benscaro Chief Commissioner

the information on the WAGR wagons site says that the vans became redundant 'when the W.A.G.R. stopped providing passenger accommodation on goods trains' but ducks on giving an actual date too.  

i'm guessing no one much knows but from the dates ZA/ZB were rebuilt as other classes, my assumption is that the bulk of the vans became surplus around 1965.  

interestingly, although the WAGR gave up on mixed trains and the like, they didn't seem to mind providing goods accommodation on passenger trains, at least according to jim bisdee's online shots of the remaining long haul trains in the 1970s.
  crisfitz Chief Commissioner

Location: Enroute somewhere
Looking at some old Working Timetables, the April 1967 Book 6 (GSR) has a note that 'ZA brakevan attached' to the fast goods between

  • No. 36 Merredin - York on Monday and Wednesday
  • No. 37 York - Merredin on Monday and Wednesday
  • No. 47 Narrogin - Merredin via Corrigin daily
  • No. 48 Merredin - Narrogin via Corrigin daily
  • No. 67 Kondinin - Merredin on Tuesday
  • No. 59 Narrogin - Merredin via Kondinin on Wednesday, Thursday and Friday
  • No. 60 Merredin - Narrogin via Kondinin on Thursday and Friday
  • No. 51 Wagin - Newdegate on Tuesday and Wednesday
  • No. 52 Newdegate - Wagin on Wednesday
  • No. 27 and 28 Tambellup - Gnowangerup - Tambellup on Tuesday, connecting with No.18 at Tambellup

However, the 20th October 1968 Book 6 has no mention of ZA or ZB vans. So whilst this doesn't give an exact date it would suggest they stopped using them mid - late 1968.

Hope that helps Smile
  8888 Chief Commissioner

Location: Shire of Mundaring
I would guess that the last services to use a ZA brakevan for passenger accommodation were the 191 / 192 fast goods trains between Pinjarra and Boddington.  These ceased in 1969.

Until 1975, an ACL passenger coach was attached to some of the goods trains running between Mullewa and Meekatharra.  This arrangement finished in 1973 on the Leonora line when it was closed for regauging.
  benscaro Chief Commissioner

thanks for the extra information, gentlemen.  this is handy to know.
  WAGR Chief Commissioner

i'm wading through the WAGR carriages opus of bill gray and andy may and i suppose i will come across this information, but not noticed it yet.

i get a sense WAGR pulled mixed trains and booted passengers off goods trains very early and did so universally, as opposed to other places where the practice petered out more slowly; in tasmania, you might buy a ticket to ride in a goods train i think up until ANR takeover in 1978 and the emu bay railway ran a mixed until 1983, and SA, where you could ride in guards vans on the eyre peninsula -if nowhere else in the state- up until they pulled the vans in 1992.

i've always had it somewhere in the back of my head that WA drew a line under this kind of thing rather earlier and more definitively.  but not sure of the actual date.

i'd be pleased to get some clarification and dates.

ben

Yes a very interesting Question. Having travelled many miles on the WAGR system in non passenger brake vans IE Za ,Zb. The only conditions that applied with my travel was that (1) the guard allowed it under the act, (2) you payed the regular 2nd class fare and as far as I recall that prevailed up until the demise of Guards and Brake vans, thanks to Mr Ruston, but hey those days are long gone but it was great fun talking to those that ran the railway. I rode one off the last goods train to Koojedda and return to Midland and the next Weekend rode one of the first trains (NG) goods train to Avon in a brake van with one hellava long train behind a "C" class

So there you go, pretty boring today isn't it
benscaro
  benscaro Chief Commissioner

WAGR
hi,

what years are you talking about here? guards vans came off in 1985 in WA, didn't they?  so, do you mean to say you travelled by guard's van in the 1980s, or that it was possible to do that?
  WAGR Chief Commissioner

hi,

what years are you talking about here? guards vans came off in 1985 in WA, didn't they?  so, do you mean to say you travelled by guard's van in the 1980s, or that it was possible to do that?
benscaro

Hi Benscaro, gee you have my grey matter on the run.

Now as far as I can ascertain you could not ride in the Breakvan of a bulk commodity train as ran under a contract to a private company.

On other Goods trains with guard and Brakevan they would only allow transit between safe working stations. All other rules applie  like sobriety, guards acceptance etc.Bit hard to remember it all these days but it was a lot of fun.

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