No need for SG in Vic !

 
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it!

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  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it!
Dangersdan707

Hi...have a look at the official spiel before all the comments start.

https://www.ptv.vic.gov.au/projects/rail-projects/murray-basin-rail-project

Mike.
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it! Dangersdan707 Hi...have a look at the official spiel before all the comments start. https://www.ptv.vic.gov.au/projects/rail-projects/murray-bas... Mike.
The Vinelander

yeah still is about as pointless as standardising Melbourne- Adelaide I my view, though I can understand Oaklands and Semour-Albury standardisations.
  Clyde Goodwin2 Chief Train Controller

Dangerdan you surely cannot be serious you must without doubt be having a lend of us with your above post stating Melb/Adelaide as SG is pointless.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it!
Dangersdan707
Do we answer this question or do we let the poster go and read some more?
  Clyde Goodwin2 Chief Train Controller

Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it!
Do we answer this question or do we let the poster go and read some more?
james.au
Possibly best point of action might be to let this member read some more for a while and hope that he actualy grasps the importance of this regauging work.
  Jack Le Lievre Assistant Commissioner

Location: Moolap Station, Vic
Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it! Dangersdan707 Hi...have a look at the official spiel before all the comments start. https://www.ptv.vic.gov.au/projects/rail-projects/murray-bas... Mike.

yeah still is about as pointless as standardising Melbourne- Adelaide I my view, though I can understand Oaklands and Semour-Albury standardisations.
Dangersdan707
So I take that you think that Australia shouldn't have been federated and should be six separate colonies and still ruled from Britan, as becoming a federated nation was/is pointless?

You really should read more from under your bridge, troll.
  nswtrains Chief Commissioner

Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it!
Dangersdan707
You just seem generally confused and leave it at that.
  Jack Le Lievre Assistant Commissioner

Location: Moolap Station, Vic
You just seem generally confused and leave it at that.
yes I am bewildered infact

Dangerdan you surely cannot be serious you must without doubt be having a lend of us with your above post stating Melb/Adelaide as SG is pointless.
past tense said I was pointless to standardise Melbourne to Adelaide and in my view a wast of money

and
Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it! Do we answer this question or do we let the poster go and read some more? james.au Possibly best point of action might be to let this member read some more for a while and hope that he actualy grasps the importance of this regauging work.
yes I don't understand the importance of this regauging of more broad gauge to the (insert gauge fanatic rant about superior victorian gauge) 'standard gauge' and I understand why they don't like dual gauging broad gauge (speed restrictions unlike in WA and Queensland)


Hello I'm a little late to this thread though I would like to ask was there even a point of converting the Murray Basin to the NSW gauge? When I was up around Hattah earlier this year every thing seemed to be running fine I didn't even know that It was being converted until a few months back. still though Im a bit confused about why their doing it! Dangersdan707 Hi...have a look at the official spiel before all the comments start. https://www.ptv.vic.gov.au/projects/rail-projects/murray-bas... Mike. yeah still is about as pointless as standardising Melbourne- Adelaide I my view, though I can understand Oaklands and Semour-Albury standardisations. Dangersdan707 So I take that you think that Australia shouldn't have been federated and should be six separate colonies and still ruled from Britan, as becoming a federated nation was/is pointless? You really should read more from under your bridge, troll.

begin 10000% real rant 'ITS A JEWISH CULTURAL MARXIST NSW BOLSHEVIK NEW WORLD ORDER REPTILIAN SHAPE SHIFTER PLOT TO SPREAD THEIR GAUGE HERE' end 10000% real rant
seriously though Australia should be  ...... sorry ...... one nation (unintended)

*hobbles back to bridge
*puts on tin foil hat



Good day and apologies to everyone I'll be Sirius and attempt to grasp why they are regauging it (Were is R766 or whatever number it is)
Dangersdan707
Unless you have invented time travel and can go back to the 1850s and stop the Scottish Engineer James Wallace from persuading the then New South Wales Legislature to repeal the Railway Act of 1852 and change from Irish Broad Gauge to Stephenson Gauge then we wouldn't be having this debate, as the National Gauge would, in fact, be Irish Broad Gauge. Thus Victoria & South Australia wouldn't have isolated Irish Broad Gauge networks, and thus be at the whims of their respective rail operators, PN in Victoria and GWA in South Australia.

At least go and read Tim Fisher's book Transcontinental Train Odyssey and pay particular attention to Chapter Two. Also, read through this thread and you will see as to why the conversion is happening, and if you are still confused, follow Tim's advice and read more books of the history of railways in Australia and Australian history.
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
Unless you have invented time travel and can go back to the 1850s and stop the Scottish Engineer James Wallace from persuading the then New South Wales Legislature to repeal the Railway Act of 1852 and change from Irish Broad Gauge to Stephenson Gauge then we wouldn't be having this debate, as the National Gauge would, in fact, be Irish Broad Gauge. Thus Victoria & South Australia wouldn't have isolated Irish Broad Gauge networks, and thus be at the whims of their respective rail operators, PN in Victoria and GWA in South Australia. At least go and read Tim Fisher's book Transcontinental Train Odyssey and pay particular attention to Chapter Two. Also, read through this thread and you will see as to why the conversion is happening, and if you are still confused, follow Tim's advice and read more books of the history of railways in Australia and Australian history.
Jack Le Lievre
mm only every read one of fishers books ok then thanks for the advice  
yes the filthy cockroaches north of OUR RIVER would of used the victorian gauge (Learnt that in fishers other book Trains unlimited)

Time Machines have obviously existed for 1000000 years though are hidden by the JEWISH CULTURAL MARXIST NSW BOLSHEVIK NEW WORLD ORDER REPTILIAN SHAPE SHIFTERs

also a minor correction there was been no broad gauge operations by GWA in south Australia since 2014 now only the metro and steam ranger!
  BDA Chief Commissioner

Location: Sydney
Like it or lump it .
The big boys with the big toys use standard gauge .
Because they build it and the trains they run on it Tonka Tough all the hard works been done sorting it out .
Front up with the bucks and they'll even sell it to you generally cheaper than you can build some weirdo toy gauge/loading gauge . Why re invent the wheel ?
Build for big axle loads and big loading gauges and laugh all the way to the bank .
  MetroFemme Assistant Commissioner

Take the time to look at the traffic volumes now between Melbourne and Adelaide and number of wagons and you will see volumes have fallen since the conversion of broad gauge between the cities. On conversion metro traffic delivery was also lost to road post conversion as also happened in Melbourne.

Has the conversion been good for traffic?
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
no
  M636C Minister for Railways

Take the time to look at the traffic volumes now between Melbourne and Adelaide and number of wagons and you will see volumes have fallen since the conversion of broad gauge between the cities. On conversion metro traffic delivery was also lost to road post conversion as also happened in Melbourne.

Has the conversion been good for traffic?
MetroFemme

Traffic Volumes have dropped everywhere.

If Melbourne Adelaide were still 1600, there might be no traffic as there is on the rest of the country 1600 gauge in South Australia.

They might have already given up "The Overland" with no freight traffic.

Would the suburban sidings have remained in use for traffic from Adelaide (but not Perth, Brisbane or Sydney?)

Peter
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
There was certainly healthy contrains running ourt of Melbourne for parts and there was also a hell of a lot of cement and paper on rail between Melbourne and Adelaide and a lot of van traffic which has all gone.

Mount Gambier had two trains per day and the Millicent traffic was abundant.  Yes a lot has been lost with the poor planning on the conversion.

Also remember the Barossa traffic to the cement plant.
  Jack Le Lievre Assistant Commissioner

Location: Moolap Station, Vic
Take the time to look at the traffic volumes now between Melbourne and Adelaide and number of wagons and you will see volumes have fallen since the conversion of broad gauge between the cities. On conversion metro traffic delivery was also lost to road post conversion as also happened in Melbourne.

Has the conversion been good for traffic?
MetroFemme
That is like saying that the Road to Zero campaign stopped working in 2007 although the rates had been dropping in the preceding years. Did people stop paying attention to it? Did people start drinking and driving more? No. The smartphone was introduced and drivers had an additional distraction in their vehicle. You cannot take the conversion to standard gauge as an isolated event. You must also consider what the rest of the world of transport and freight was doing at the time and following the conversion. Consider the fact that all of the formerly State-run rail freight operations have now been privatized, and trucking regulations have been toughened in some aspects but relaxed in others. The introduction of B doubles and B triples on those routes have increased road freight.

And the road infrastructure could be said to have been better maintained because politicians will always find money for roads because 'everyone' (voters) will use them whereas the general acknowledgement of how much the country relies on rail for freight is very low.

Basically, you need to look at the whole picture as to why Traffic Volumes have dropped since the conversion rather than assigning it as the cause of the decrease.
  Inland_Sailor Junior Train Controller

Whilst not debating the virtue of converting BG to SG..... a no brainer in C21, how much of rural Victoria, ie not Metro, will be SG and how much BG will remain to be converted when the Murray Basin is completed? What project[s] will follow? [ie Inglewood- Bendigo] When?
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
It could have been better as a large part of Western Victoria and South Eastern SA was disconnected.
  Dangersdan707 Chief Commissioner

Location: On a Thing with Internet
It could have been better as a large part of Western Victoria and South Eastern SA was disconnected.
x31
that is true as Paul Keetting Govs poor planning as the pollies have an obsession with sg every where apart from queensland
also I believe that no lines in Victoria need converting
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
It could have been better as a large part of Western Victoria and South Eastern SA was disconnected.
x31
The dumping of the Mount Gambier paper traffic was a disaster. I don't know if it was rail or politically instigated but one has to wonder whether it was plain incompetence and stupidity or something worse.

There was a huge amount of paper traffic ex the Mount which battling through the bogie exchanges on a daily basis was a significant problem yet as soon as this problem no longer existed the traffic was simply abandoned.

The Maryvale traffic, although it still remains on BG, was almost abandoned too around the same time as being all too hard but, thankfully, was persevered with in containers.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
[quote=Inland_Sailor]Whilst not debating the virtue of converting BG to SG..... a no brainer in C21, how much of rural Victoria, ie not Metro, will be SG and how much BG will remain to be converted when the Murray Basin is completed? What project[s] will follow? [ie Inglewood- Bendigo] When?[/quote]
Per BITRE (via wiki), the Vic distances are currently as follows (distances include metro but not trams)

BG - 2894
SG - 1222
DG - 32
NG - 19
Other - 28

Post MBRP, about 1100km will transfer from BG to SG.

Remaining BG in the regions will be Goulburn Valley (incl. Seymour), Bendigo, Warrnambool and the Gippsland lines.

Realistically, id see the GV lines are next to go (including Toolamba-Echuca-Deni)

Then it could be Bendigo or Warrnambool, though both are not clearly logical to to do so. Both have freight and pax services. Bendigo would be the last grain on BG and i suspect that if the freight differentials are strong enough, farmers will haul to the potentially cheaper SG lines. Warrnambool would be reasonably easier than Bendigo from a competition with BG pax services, but the issue would be Geelong, and putting DG through that area to allow the BG services to Geelong to continue.

Id say Gippsland, needing to go through the BG metro network, will be a long way off before its converted, if it ever is. Ballarat will probably go SG before Gippsland will....
  x31 Chief Commissioner

Location: gallifrey
Would have been easier to force BG into NSW which was the initial agreement.
  simstrain Chief Commissioner

Per BITRE (via wiki), the Vic distances are currently as follows (distances include metro but not trams)

BG - 2894
SG - 1222
DG - 32
NG - 19
Other - 28

Post MBRP, about 1100km will transfer from BG to SG.

Remaining BG in the regions will be Goulburn Valley (incl. Seymour), Bendigo, Warrnambool and the Gippsland lines.

Realistically, id see the GV lines are next to go (including Toolamba-Echuca-Deni)

Then it could be Bendigo or Warrnambool, though both are not clearly logical to to do so.  Both have freight and pax services.  Bendigo would be the last grain on BG and i suspect that if the freight differentials are strong enough, farmers will haul to the potentially cheaper SG lines.  Warrnambool would be reasonably easier than Bendigo from a competition with BG pax services, but the issue would be Geelong, and putting DG through that area to allow the BG services to Geelong to continue.

Id say Gippsland, needing to go through the BG metro network, will be a long way off before its converted, if it ever is.  Ballarat will probably go SG before Gippsland will....
james.au

Does that NG include the puffing billy and what is other?
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
[quote=simstrain][quote][quote]Whilst not debating the virtue of converting BG to SG..... a no brainer in C21, how much of rural Victoria, ie not Metro, will be SG and how much BG will remain to be converted when the Murray Basin is completed? What project[s] will follow? [ie Inglewood- Bendigo] When?[/quote]
Per BITRE (via wiki), the Vic distances are currently as follows (distances include metro but not trams)

BG - 2894
SG - 1222
DG - 32
NG - 19
Other - 28

Post MBRP, about 1100km will transfer from BG to SG.

Remaining BG in the regions will be Goulburn Valley (incl. Seymour), Bendigo, Warrnambool and the Gippsland lines.

Realistically, id see the GV lines are next to go (including Toolamba-Echuca-Deni)

Then it could be Bendigo or Warrnambool, though both are not clearly logical to to do so. Both have freight and pax services. Bendigo would be the last grain on BG and i suspect that if the freight differentials are strong enough, farmers will haul to the potentially cheaper SG lines. Warrnambool would be reasonably easier than Bendigo from a competition with BG pax services, but the issue would be Geelong, and putting DG through that area to allow the BG services to Geelong to continue.

Id say Gippsland, needing to go through the BG metro network, will be a long way off before its converted, if it ever is. Ballarat will probably go SG before Gippsland will....[/quote]
Does that NG include the puffing billy and what is other?[/quote]
Id think so. No idea what other is. You'd have to look into the BITRE report. Its immaterial to me.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Would have been easier to force BG into NSW which was the initial agreement.
x31

There is a PhD thesis out there somewhere that goes through the historic documents and puts the blame at LaTrobe's feet, not NSWs.  Most likely through inaction than any conscious effort to make a problem.

(Though to be fair, colonial administrations at the time never thought the lines would meet so the issue was not a significant one to them).

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