useage of ticket machines on Adelaide Railcars

 
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
The STA would never have had to empty the machines on platforms at Smithfield and Elizabeth. No one from those stations has ever purchased a ticket, and if a visitor did, the locals would have emptied the machine on behalf of the STA anyway.

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  justapassenger Minister for Railways

I wonder how many revenue officers travel on the Gawler line?

There must be heaps of them on the books, judging by the squadrons of up to eight at a time I've seen travelling through the nice leafy suburbs on Belair trains.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Oh, and the gates were wide open with no staff in sight last time I went through Noarlunga Centre on a Seaford train. I didn't think that expensive little stunt would last long.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
I wouldn’t claim to be a frequent traveller to Noarlunga on the train, but on the few times I have bothered to go to Noarlunga by train since the gates were installed NOT ONCE have they been in operation. I am wondering if they ever are.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

I go down that way once every 2-3 weeks, but not always by train. I've seen them staffed a grand total of two times since they were installed.
  Brucetiki Station Staff

Oh, and the gates were wide open with no staff in sight last time I went through Noarlunga Centre on a Seaford train. I didn't think that expensive little stunt would last long.
justapassenger

Ironically they had them closed at Salisbury for the Adelaide v GWS game the other week, with the morons staffing the station trying to refuse boarding to Crows members saying the free travel didn't start until 12:30pm.

When challenged on it they refused to provide a badge number for a complaint either.
  mawsonboii Junior Train Controller

Location: Banned
I wonder how many revenue officers travel on the Gawler line?

There must be heaps of them on the books, judging by the squadrons of up to eight at a time I've seen travelling through the nice leafy suburbs on Belair trains.
justapassenger
Not enough. people get of at Chidda and catch a train back to Salisbury to avoid the barriers and the AM staff
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
When our basic fare, and indeed when the MINIMUM recharge amount for anyone, is known to equal or exceed the face value of our smallest note it was just plainly absurd to not include notes as a form of payment in our train ticket machines. Whatever way DPTI/AdMetro (or defenders thereof here) want to spin it, it was an act of purified stupidity. Where I work we have a 'stupid filter' which is a session that ideas go through to check they don't have any stupid tied to them, DPTI/AdMetro seem to have their stupid filter (perhaps intentionally) installed backwards, such as to make sure that only the stupid remains.
  ARG706 Chief Commissioner

Location: SA
How is this a bad thing in their point of view? Passengers who are unable to purchase a ticket can result in more revenue for them. Just like with the metrocard and the absense of a daily cap. It is their exact intention to include these kinds of inconveniences whilst disguising them as things that are too complex/tedious to implement.

It's exactly how they make the extra dollars, and they don't give really a toss about law abiding patrons, as long as money is made.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
How is this a bad thing in their point of view? Passengers who are unable to purchase a ticket can result in more revenue for them.
ARG706
Not having the facility to take notes does not gain them revenue, in fact it only loses them revenue. No PSA/Transit Police are going to expiate a patron with notes who cannot purchase a ticket/recharge. At worst, they will be directed to the outlet on the platform at Adelaide, where they can purchase before exiting the station with notes (not increased revenue, less actually, when you amortise the staff cost), or they will be allowed to alight at some other station where a purchase is not required (a direct loss in revenue). That's assuming a train, on a tram it's just a direct loss of revenue.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

When our basic fare, and indeed when the MINIMUM recharge amount for anyone, is known to equal or exceed the face value of our smallest note it was just plainly absurd to not include notes as a form of payment in our train ticket machines. Whatever way DPTI/AdMetro (or defenders thereof here) want to spin it, it was an act of purified stupidity.
Aaron
Unless the cost of procuring, installing, operating and servicing them exceeded the minor loss of revenue due to the occasional inability to purchase.

Given that the new Metrocard/ticket machines were installed once contactless payment cards were quite widespread, it's possible that they made a prudent choice.

Many transit systems are phasing out onboard acceptance of cash completely. Many people in Adelaide are so resistant to change that they would reject free beer because they are used to paying for it, so maybe there is some way to go before that would be accepted here.

No PSA/Transit Police are going to expiate a patron with notes who cannot purchase a ticket/recharge.
Aaron
100% correct.

They are smart enough not to bother. Wasting thousands of dollars on a prosecution guaranteed to be laughed out of court would be even worse than someone not paying their ~18% of the journey cost (before benefits of public transport are factored in) in the first place.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
Another "feature" was that if the yellow light on the machines was on then it would not accept $2 coins so you could board a train with the correct fare in coins at the ready including $2 coins and still not be able to pay your fare.

Of course you were expected to know this before boarding ????
  Radioman Chief Train Controller

Hello All,

until I read this thread I was unaware that Monty Python designed ticketing systems , learn something new every day !

Regards, Radioman
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
How is this a bad thing in their point of view? Passengers who are unable to purchase a ticket can result in more revenue for them.
Not having the facility to take notes does not gain them revenue, in fact it only loses them revenue. No PSA/Transit Police are going to expiate a patron with notes who cannot purchase a ticket/recharge.

It hasnt been recent, but many a time Ive seen people forced to walk up and down the train to beg people for change because all they had was a note and the inspector was going to fine them unless they bought a ticket. The policy switched when they put gates in at Adelaide.
sr1180
I don't see how an in ability to accept your legal tender could ever cause STA/TA/AdMEtro/whatever to fine you for evading a fare you couldn't pay because they couldn't take the payment. This *might* have happened, but under the passenger's own duress, not threat from inspector.
  ARG706 Chief Commissioner

Location: SA
IIRC, the word stupid needs the letters d, p ,t and i to be spelt correctly.
  DJPeters Deputy Commissioner

How is this a bad thing in their point of view? Passengers who are unable to purchase a ticket can result in more revenue for them.
Not having the facility to take notes does not gain them revenue, in fact it only loses them revenue. No PSA/Transit Police are going to expiate a patron with notes who cannot purchase a ticket/recharge.

It hasnt been recent, but many a time Ive seen people forced to walk up and down the train to beg people for change because all they had was a note and the inspector was going to fine them unless they bought a ticket. The policy switched when they put gates in at Adelaide.
I don't see how an in ability to accept your legal tender could ever cause STA/TA/AdMEtro/whatever to fine you for evading a fare you couldn't pay because they couldn't take the payment. This *might* have happened, but under the passenger's own duress, not threat from inspector.
Aaron
A lot of the PSA's at times simply did not fully know fully or understand how the system worked, some even tried to coerce people to buy a new ticket half way to where the paassenger was going when they checked the ticket on board part way through the journey the  ticket was valid though when the passenger got on, but they would not give in until usually challenged by other comutters on it. They used all kinds of what could be termed threats at time's. Most though understood the system and some would even shock horror change your note or as said go up and down the railcar to get someone to change it if they could. I have seen all of these things happen. I have even been asked by a PSA for change for someone, just lucky that I carry a bit on me these days just in case of.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
When are you becoming a PSA David? If knowing how the ticketing system works isn’t a job requirement, you’d be perfect!

Have you worked out if the gates on the ARS platform validate your ticket/card or not yet?
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Ouch!

I wish I had an aloe vera farm, because Davey boy will be needing a good whack of it for that burn.

I don't see how an in ability to accept your legal tender …
Aaron
It would be more accurate to state that they choose not to accept it rather than referring to an inability.

The current ticketing system is a man-made creation, not an external imposition.

The rail operator is the body that chose not to accept certain legal tender, it is their responsibility to accept the consequences of their choice.

This *might* have happened, but under the passenger's own duress, not threat from inspector.
Aaron
Or because the inspector spotted someone they thought wouldn't stand up to that stunt.

I challenged an inspector on this once when he was hounding a twenty something woman to beg for change. He refused to give his name or an ID number (idiot, he could have told me anything!) and when I pulled my phone out to take a photo of him* and, like all petty bullies, he practically wet his pants and fled for the safety of the nearest cab.

Body language is everything. Present yourself as passive in public and people will try anything, but learn a little about assertive (not aggressive) body language and petty bullies won't come near you.

* as authorised by the notices in the trains reading "images and sound may be recorded and used"
  DJPeters Deputy Commissioner

When are you becoming a PSA David? If knowing how the ticketing system works isn’t a job requirement, you’d be perfect!

Have you worked out if the gates on the ARS platform validate your ticket/card or not yet?
Aaron
I suppose I could report this post to the admins as you seem to have a bad chip on your shoulder there Aaron and as a matter of fact I have tried what you suggested and all it did was open the gate for me to go to the platform I needed. It only validated my ticket on the train I got on. I bought the ticket at Adelaide station from the ticket machines there!
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
David,

Look at my post on the 17th page of the Admet Goings On thread.  https://www.railpage.com.au/f-t11385496-0-asc-s400.htm

It includes an actual card history (a seniors card with added credit).    The transactions on 21st September clearly show the fare being deducted at the gate.

Here it is again:



I find it troubling you can't accept empirical evidence.
  Captainchoochoo61 Locomotive Fireman

@ KI P

David has never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

And feel sorry for anybody who points out that David is wrong.

Peace and goodwill to all compassionate persons.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Quite simply David I contend that you are either GROSSLY mistaken, so mistaken as to appear as though you’re lying (post us a screen shot of your metro card use as evidence perhaps) or simply a liar. I think everyone will be with me in going with the later.

My contention (that you stand good chance of becoming a PSA, based on your own assertion that PSAs do not necessarily know fully or understand the system they’re employed to ‘enforce’) still stands.

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