Thank you for sharingThe 5 made in 1944 were advertised by there makers as able to put out 7000bhp at 70mph. The loco itself weighs 380 tons tender is another 155tons, total weight 535tons.
One big massive engine
Andre Chapelon claimed he could have increased the power of a UP 4000 to 12,000 hp but his proposed modifications were extensive. Given his success with French locomotives there is no reason to doubt this.Even at the advertised 7000hp, very little of that will be required now for heritage operation.
For true heritage operation you are correct as it was NEVER a pass loco, but I am sure UP will try it on a few decent sized freights. After all 844 has hauled a freight and assisted an 11,000 ton freight that had stalled on a grade, so UP is NOT afraid to load these locos up. It would be nice to see it at the head of a 3 to 4000 ton freight.Andre Chapelon claimed he could have increased the power of a UP 4000 to 12,000 hp but his proposed modifications were extensive. Given his success with French locomotives there is no reason to doubt this.Even at the advertised 7000hp, very little of that will be required now for heritage operation.
For true heritage operation you are correct as it was NEVER a pass loco, but I am sure UP will try it on a few decent sized freights. After all 844 has hauled a freight and assisted an 11,000 ton freight that had stalled on a grade, so UP is NOT afraid to load these locos up. It would be nice to see it at the head of a 3 to 4000 ton freight.Whereas here we have a garratt rated 3000HP in the current table, yet can't go anywhere without a diesel pusher or three.
Mainline heritage operators in NSW are guests on busy suburban networks that need to squeeze them in beside their own trains or open-access country networks where delays to other operators' trains have a very real financial impact for all concerned.For true heritage operation you are correct as it was NEVER a pass loco, but I am sure UP will try it on a few decent sized freights. After all 844 has hauled a freight and assisted an 11,000 ton freight that had stalled on a grade, so UP is NOT afraid to load these locos up. It would be nice to see it at the head of a 3 to 4000 ton freight.Whereas here we have a garratt rated 3000HP in the current table, yet can't go anywhere without a diesel pusher or three.
Any steam loco can travel by itself on the mainline without diesel assistance. The operator's choice to put diesel's on it.For true heritage operation you are correct as it was NEVER a pass loco, but I am sure UP will try it on a few decent sized freights. After all 844 has hauled a freight and assisted an 11,000 ton freight that had stalled on a grade, so UP is NOT afraid to load these locos up. It would be nice to see it at the head of a 3 to 4000 ton freight.Whereas here we have a garratt rated 3000HP in the current table, yet can't go anywhere without a diesel pusher or three.
Britain, the USA and Europe appear to have a much more mature way of looking at steam operation, they are seen as either major tourist attractions or rail publicity. In Aus steam appears to be considered a pain in the rear end.For true heritage operation you are correct as it was NEVER a pass loco, but I am sure UP will try it on a few decent sized freights. After all 844 has hauled a freight and assisted an 11,000 ton freight that had stalled on a grade, so UP is NOT afraid to load these locos up. It would be nice to see it at the head of a 3 to 4000 ton freight.Whereas here we have a garratt rated 3000HP in the current table, yet can't go anywhere without a diesel pusher or three.
What are you talking about? TPWS in Victoria? As far as i'm aware there are no restrictions (besides the 80km/h speed limit if they dont have TPWS) for any steam loco to go anywhere. If there is a restriction, its mainly due to weight.Britain, the USA and Europe appear to have a much more mature way of looking at steam operation, they are seen as either major tourist attractions or rail publicity. In Aus steam appears to be considered a pain in the rear end.For true heritage operation you are correct as it was NEVER a pass loco, but I am sure UP will try it on a few decent sized freights. After all 844 has hauled a freight and assisted an 11,000 ton freight that had stalled on a grade, so UP is NOT afraid to load these locos up. It would be nice to see it at the head of a 3 to 4000 ton freight.Whereas here we have a garratt rated 3000HP in the current table, yet can't go anywhere without a diesel pusher or three.
A problem in Aus appears to be most steamers have NOT been fitted with modern signalling equipment, this limits where they can be used. In Britain particularly an increasing number of steamers are being fitted with this equipment specifcly so they can run on main lines and I would not be surprised if UP4014 was so fittted.
woodford
On 130kph main lines 80kph is a significant restriction, it limits the paths availible. THe AI locomotive trust went to a great deal of trouble to get the locomotive certified for 90mph, to allow it to run on main lines without it holding up normal 100mph traffic.What are you talking about? TPWS in Victoria? As far as i'm aware there are no restrictions (besides the 80km/h speed limit if they dont have TPWS) for any steam loco to go anywhere. If there is a restriction, its mainly due to weight.Britain, the USA and Europe appear to have a much more mature way of looking at steam operation, they are seen as either major tourist attractions or rail publicity. In Aus steam appears to be considered a pain in the rear end.For true heritage operation you are correct as it was NEVER a pass loco, but I am sure UP will try it on a few decent sized freights. After all 844 has hauled a freight and assisted an 11,000 ton freight that had stalled on a grade, so UP is NOT afraid to load these locos up. It would be nice to see it at the head of a 3 to 4000 ton freight.Whereas here we have a garratt rated 3000HP in the current table, yet can't go anywhere without a diesel pusher or three.
A problem in Aus appears to be most steamers have NOT been fitted with modern signalling equipment, this limits where they can be used. In Britain particularly an increasing number of steamers are being fitted with this equipment specifcly so they can run on main lines and I would not be surprised if UP4014 was so fittted.
woodford
Your first comment is talking about Government and stakeholders, yes?
In Victoria, Wooden cars are limited to 80km/h with the Steel cars rated for 115km/h. There are paths out there for 80km/h running. Steel cars can run at 115km/h. The only locomotive that can run at 115km/h is the R Class. The D3 is rated at 95km/h. K, J & A2 are all 80km/h with the Y Class rated for 60km/h.On 130kph main lines 80kph is a significant restriction, it limits the paths availible. THe AI locomotive trust went to a great deal of trouble to get the locomotive certified for 90mph, to allow it to run on main lines without it holding up normal 100mph traffic.Britain, the USA and Europe appear to have a much more mature way of looking at steam operation, they are seen as either major tourist attractions or rail publicity. In Aus steam appears to be considered a pain in the rear end.What are you talking about? TPWS in Victoria? As far as i'm aware there are no restrictions (besides the 80km/h speed limit if they dont have TPWS) for any steam loco to go anywhere. If there is a restriction, its mainly due to weight.
A problem in Aus appears to be most steamers have NOT been fitted with modern signalling equipment, this limits where they can be used. In Britain particularly an increasing number of steamers are being fitted with this equipment specifcly so they can run on main lines and I would not be surprised if UP4014 was so fittted.
woodford
Your first comment is talking about Government and stakeholders, yes?
"Your first comment is talking about Government and stakeholders, yes?"
Correct
There is a Utube clip somewhere with UP's Challenger, dragging a long line of double stacked containers.That was a special run put on at the request of APL. Apart from 5 kms of compensated 1:150 grade up Archer hill the rest of the journey to North Platte is all down Hill. The return journey was with a very small load.
Might post link later.
Edit
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XhgHrDbN4EU
Well after stating the above I did find another clip where 844 hauled a short 23 car freight between Denver and Cheyenne. It appeared to be making very light work of it.There is a Utube clip somewhere with UP's Challenger, dragging a long line of double stacked containers.That was a special run put on at the request of APL. Apart from 5 kms of compensated 1:150 grade up Archer hill the rest of the journey to North Platte is all down Hill. The return journey was with a very small load.
Might post link later.
Edit
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XhgHrDbN4EU
Apart from the APL train and the 844 assisting a stalled freight I can't think of any other steam freights with the UP steam locomotives.
There is a Utube clip somewhere with UP's Challenger, dragging a long line of double stacked containers.That was a special run put on at the request of APL. Apart from 5 kms of compensated 1:150 grade up Archer hill the rest of the journey to North Platte is all down Hill. The return journey was with a very small load.
Might post link later.
Edit
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XhgHrDbN4EU
Apart from the APL train and the 844 assisting a stalled freight I can't think of any other steam freights with the UP steam locomotives.
It's far more common than you might imagine including a fairly recent one pulled by 8444. The real power and the glory. Someone once tried to tell me that the NSW 60 class were the largest locos in the world. I laughed and told him they were about half way there. We suffer from railway chauvinism in this country with a surprising number not realising just how bloody big US steam was. For instance the NSWGR 57 class were actually based on a scaled down Santa Fe light mountain type.There is a Utube clip somewhere with UP's Challenger, dragging a long line of double stacked containers.That was a special run put on at the request of APL. Apart from 5 kms of compensated 1:150 grade up Archer hill the rest of the journey to North Platte is all down Hill. The return journey was with a very small load.
Might post link later.
Edit
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XhgHrDbN4EU
Apart from the APL train and the 844 assisting a stalled freight I can't think of any other steam freights with the UP steam locomotives.
From what I read over the years, when steam does go on the front of a freight there is little or no warning so not often photos. If the engine is in steam sitting at North Platte and heading to Omaha for example if there is a freight within it's capability they couple up and go. Don't forget UP steam locos have MU controls for the diesels behind.
While it is rare, it does happen.
Remember the 4000 class has a maximum tractive effort of 135,000 lbs, this is as much as the couplers will take, and a power of around 6000bhp. They will be able to pull almost any freight UP can put together and such a load will not do it any harm.I thought they were designed to pull freights out of Ogden over the Wasatch Hills at 100 mph? There is a bit of a dispute but a C&O loco may have been more powerful. Forget your little dinky British steam, this is the real power and glory, the Gods of steam.
Note: the iron ore trains in the Pilbara, in northern Western Australia, require a total tractive effort of over 300,000 lbs to avoid coupler problems, 3 pairs of loco's are put throughout the length of the train.
woodford
Andre Chapelon claimed he could have increased the power of a UP 4000 to 12,000 hp but his proposed modifications were extensive. Given his success with French locomotives there is no reason to doubt this.I have Looked this up and not found a single reference to this online. Perhaps You can enlighten me?
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