Ad Met goings on -

 
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
What do you mean by the kiosk at Noarlunga? The AdelaideMetro hole in the wall whose only purpose is to waste taxpayer funds on wages? Or the deli thing on the platform that is open most of the day, and derives most of its income from the bus drivers using the interchange and layover?

While on the subject of over served southern suburbs, does Hallett Cove qualify as the most over served suburb in Adelaide?

Does the 720 need to run a route as long and poorly used as The Overland? The ‘shopping centre all stopper’ from Reynella to the city via Hallett Cove and Marion, could the planners not notice that it goes right by Castle Plaza, surely it could loop that car park too? Thank god they couldn’t work out how to route it past Kurralta Park...
Aaron
The grand tour of Seacliff and Hallett Cove!   I'm pleased to see it goes to FMC too Smile.

Surely for the 720 FMC or Marion Shops to Reynella Interchange via Hallett Cove would be fine with the 719 doing the honours from the city.

Neither FMC or Marion is a bad place for an interchange since facilities are available within a short distance.     A few more seats outside the FMC would be nice though.

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  justapassenger Minister for Railways

What were the reasons behind the local Hub traders getting upset at this bus service change ?
I would think a perceived lack of opportunity to sell commuters stuff.
kipioneer
No, the T219 timetable was great for that because people who wanted to get to the city on one bus would park and ride there.

You'll find this funny, but the reason was actually anti-competition! Someone convinced a bunch of the traders that the half-hourly 618 buses made access to Marion so easy that it was diverting trade from the Hub to Marion.

I was a local at the time - and an occasional user of the 690 - and I remember the farcical debate well.

Judging by the number of vehicles in the Hub Shopping Centre car park and the Flagstaff Hill Shopping Centre car park I would say that there is a fairly large commuter component in these car parks.
kipioneer
That's possibly the case for the lower end of the Hub parking behind the servo, but there are free spaces in the actual park and ride a lot of the time which would suggest that any cars which are parked all day any further up the hill are staff at the shopping centre.

I'd be surprised if anyone used the parking at the Flagstaff Hill shops for commuting. Centre management keep a close eye on that and place warning notices on commuter cars there. Anyway, it's a pretty poor option for a commuter - you'd be better off using a side street near a G22X stop on Flagstaff Hill Road.

The service as outlined by justapassenger would much better serve the area with the trunk service to the city and feeder services to that trunk service.    It would give a higher frequency and hence more be attractive than the present hourly off-peak service if you live, as I do, beyond the Sunnymeade Drive - Hub Drive intersection.

My bus service - G20 - besides being hourly off-peak, travels over twice the distance from stop 52 on Taylors Road West to the stop 34 on Flagstaff Road, as I would if I drive, and takes considerably longer.    You get the grand tour of Aberfoyle Park and the southern part of Flagstaff Hill.     It takes more than twice the time to get to the city as it does to drive in off-peak.
kipioneer
One of the advantages of a half-hourly feeder service connecting at both the Hub and Stop 34 at Flagstaff Hill is that you could send the 'inbound' bus (Hub to Marion) via the present 320 route through the western side of Aberfoyle Park every time, and the 'outbound' route (Marion to Hub) through the middle of the suburb along Hub Drive every time.

A half-hourly feeder service in one direction is more predictable and reliable than an hourly service in both directions.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Does the 720 need to run a route as long and poorly used as The Overland? The ‘shopping centre all stopper’ from Reynella to the city via Hallett Cove and Marion, could the planners not notice that it goes right by Castle Plaza, surely it could loop that car park too? Thank god they couldn’t work out how to route it past Kurralta Park...
The grand tour of Seacliff and Hallett Cove!   I'm pleased to see it goes to FMC too Smile.

Surely for the 720 FMC or Marion Shops to Reynella Interchange via Hallett Cove would be fine with the 719 doing the honours from the city.

Neither FMC or Marion is a bad place for an interchange since facilities are available within a short distance.     A few more seats outside the FMC would be nice though.
kipioneer
I don't mind the 720, it's a good example of using a single bus to serve multiple overlapping short trips.

Every time I see one at any point of the route it seems to be quite well used, but Heath Loxton is probably the only person who would ever make the decision to ride the full length of the route while sober.

I would bet on the FMC interchange eventually getting rebuilt closer to the Flinders train station, using land currently occupied by FMC/FPH staff parking. Don't expect a single unnecessary dollar to be spent on the current FMC bus stops.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
What were the reasons behind the local Hub traders getting upset at this bus service change ?
I would think a perceived lack of opportunity to sell commuters stuff.
No, the T219 timetable was great for that because people who wanted to get to the city on one bus would park and ride there.

You'll find this funny, but the reason was actually anti-competition! Someone convinced a bunch of the traders that the half-hourly 618 buses made access to Marion so easy that it was diverting trade from the Hub to Marion.

I was a local at the time - and an occasional user of the 690 - and I remember the farcical debate well.
justapassenger

I'm not sure the strategy worked judging by the number of vacant shops and relatively high turn-over of others in the Hub Shopping Centre.    Were it not for Coles and Woolworths and Bank SA the place would close down.

Just how long Bank SA continues there would be uncertain too.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

I'm not sure the strategy worked judging by the number of vacant shops and relatively high turn-over of others in the Hub Shopping Centre.    Were it not for Coles and Woolworths and Bank SA the place would close down.

Just how long Bank SA continues there would be uncertain too.
kipioneer
I think the 'strategy' was only ever a distraction.

The owners of the centre seem happy enough with the way they are running it. If they weren't, they would change course.

A third anchor tenant to join Coles and Woolworths (maybe Kmart, or a mini-Target like the one at Pasadena?) would turn things around in an instant.
  mawsonboii Junior Train Controller

Location: Banned
What the Government needs to do is get in a team to actually build a brand new bus network for Adelaide. Create proper routes that go from one end of a main to the other end. This would mean If you're travelling South Road on a bus you have the options to get off near any of the other main roads and connect a bus that runs down that road, Port Road for an example or Grange road. Only have busses running in to the city if the road they are travelling on runs in to the city. Get funding from local councils and shopping malls if they want feeder bus services. but again connect them in a way that actually serves multiple communities and shopping centres.

I've recently moved to the North East and TTP has became my local shopping centre, I have never seen so many busses at an interchange before. the busses weave their way all around the north east I'd be surprised if there's a road that doesn't have a bus running down it
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

The relocated Oaklands station opened today as scheduled. Still a lot of work needed to finish off the project, but the switching over of the tracks and the station reopening is a major milestone.

Not so good news for the Darlington Upgrade though, a large section of the shotcrete retaining wall (which separates the surface level Main South Road from the trenched North-South Motorway) has collapsed between Sturt Road and Flinders Drive.

The government says the rain last week caused it, which is rather alarming because the 24.2mm of rain spread over four days (BOM Adelaide weather station) is really a mere sprinkling. Every single month of the year has a daily rainfall record far higher than 24mm.
  62430 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Metro Adelaide
The relocated Oaklands station opened today as scheduled. Still a lot of work needed to finish off the project, but the switching over of the tracks and the station reopening is a major milestone.

Not so good news for the Darlington Upgrade though, a large section of the shotcrete retaining wall (which separates the surface level Main South Road from the trenched North-South Motorway) has collapsed between Sturt Road and Flinders Drive.

The government says the rain last week caused it, which is rather alarming because the 24.2mm of rain spread over four days (BOM Adelaide weather station) is really a mere sprinkling. Every single month of the year has a daily rainfall record far higher than 24mm.
justapassenger
Annual rainfall is ~600mm so monthly average is ~50mm and daily average is less than 2mm.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
We hardly had any rain last week, only about 15mm at my house in total, I thought it was pathetic blaming that wall falling down on that. This week is supposed to be wetter, especially Thursday. Here's hoping.

I'll catch a train to Noarlunga at some stage in the next few weeks to have a look at the works at the new 'Marion' station.
  62430 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Metro Adelaide
...

I've recently moved to the North East and TTP has became my local shopping centre, I have never seen so many busses at an interchange before. the busses weave their way all around the north east I'd be surprised if there's a road that doesn't have a bus running down it
mawsonboii
Giiven that TTP is at the end of the O-Bahn corridor, it is not surprising that there is a concentration of routes at the interchange with the 54x services radiating out to the N and E, the 50x and 55x services from Paradise as well as several other terminating routes!

If there were buses running along every road, why is there such a demand for parking around the O-Bahn interchanges at TTP, Paradise and Klemzig?
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Annual rainfall is ~600mm so monthly average is ~50mm and daily average is (less than) 2mm.
62430
Rainfall is not evenly distributed though, so the infrastructure needs to be capable of dealing with the days when lots of rain falls and not just rated for the days when a small amount falls.

The mean number of days per year with more than 25mm of rain is 2.3

The record for the most rainfall in a day in Adelaide is 141mm, and the month with the lowest record for the most rainfall in a day is September with 43.2mm.

This project was originally scheduled for competition in May 2019, then revised to November 2019 when the project scope was extended past Tonsley Boulevard at the northern end.
Various delays had caused the projected date of all roads being open had slipped out to March 2020 (with removal of temporary roads, construction of footpaths, landscaping etc still to take some time after that) at one point, but recent progress had brought this back to the end of this year again.
I could see this latest issue pushing the opening of roads into early 2020 and causing further delays to all the other works beyond that to maybe April-May 2020.

I'll catch a train to Noarlunga at some stage in the next few weeks to have a look at the works at the new 'Marion' station.
don_dunstan
The station has stayed named Oaklands, despite being shifted towards both Westfield Marion (by about 15 metres, having been built alongside the previous temporary station) and Marion itself (by about 40 metres, due to having 160m platforms in place of the 120m platforms of the temporary station).

Evidently the public consultation on the Marion Centre renaming proposal did not support it. My submission included conditional support, the condition being that all costs related to the renaming be paid out of the salaries of Kris Hanna (Mayor of the City of Marion) and the other councillors who voted in favour of the proposal.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
My submission included conditional support, the condition being that all costs related to the renaming be paid out of the salaries of Kris Hanna (Mayor of the City of Marion) and the other councillors who voted in favour of the proposal.
justapassenger
That is almost exactly what I wrote in submission. I also included that the renaming of all other 'geographically incorrect' sites ought to be undertaken at the same people's expense - precedent being precedent. Exactly how are people supposed to find 'Adelaide Showground' or its railway station if it's not in Adelaide, or Adelaide Parklands Terminal which is neither in Adelaide or the parklands, or Adelaide Airport? Numerous things labelled 'Adelaide' which reside in North Adelaide, the zoo, gaol, golf course, oval. Surely all of these would need renaming too?

Annual rainfall is ~600mm so monthly average is ~50mm and daily average is (less than) 2mm.
Rainfall is not evenly distributed though, so the infrastructure needs to be capable of dealing with the days when lots of rain falls and not just rated for the days when a small amount falls.

The mean number of days per year with more than 25mm of rain is 2.3

The record for the most rainfall in a day in Adelaide is 141mm, and the month with the lowest record for the most rainfall in a day is September with 43.2mm.

This project was originally scheduled for competition in May 2019, then revised to November 2019 when the project scope was extended past Tonsley Boulevard at the northern end.
Various delays had caused the projected date of all roads being open had slipped out to March 2020 (with removal of temporary roads, construction of footpaths, landscaping etc still to take some time after that) at one point, but recent progress had brought this back to the end of this year again.
I could see this latest issue pushing the opening of roads into early 2020 and causing further delays to all the other works beyond that to maybe April-May 2020.
justapassenger
Correct! Annual average is meaningless, unless you're in something like agriculture or domestic water supply that relies on planning against such average. Civil engineering and water conveyance planning require designing around expected maximum PEAK flow.

Not being able to handle a short succession of 6mm average days is not a good sign for the civil engineering team that designed and constructed that part of the wall. Likely at the very least the entire cut section will need to be re-evaluated along with repairing the collapsed section. The failed section is either faulty in construction, or representative of the whole design meaning the entire length will need remediation.

Whether it's design or construction, such a failure will require some serious looking into, the state doesn't want another South Road tramway foot/cycle path incident. Lucky this occurred before the road opened to traffic and commuters were involved.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

My submission included conditional support, the condition being that all costs related to the renaming be paid out of the salaries of Kris Hanna (Mayor of the City of Marion) and the other councillors who voted in favour of the proposal.
That is almost exactly what I wrote in submission. I also included that the renaming of all other 'geographically incorrect' sites ought to be undertaken at the same people's expense - precedent being precedent. Exactly how are people supposed to find 'Adelaide Showground' or its railway station if it's not in Adelaide, or Adelaide Parklands Terminal which is neither in Adelaide or the parklands, or Adelaide Airport? Numerous things labelled 'Adelaide' which reside in North Adelaide, the zoo, gaol, golf course, oval. Surely all of these would need renaming too?
Aaron
The Oaklands renaming proposal deserved to be opposed because it was not an attempt to 'correct' an incorrect name, but an attempt to create a new one.

Marion Centre would have been incorrect because it is not in Marion, not at the centre of Marion, and there is already a public transport facility known as Marion Centre.

The zoo and gaol are fine as they are on the Adelaide side of the Torrens. The only time a problem arises is for a few hours every few weeks when Port Power have a home match and the largest concentration of feral animals and prison inmates in the City of Adelaide local government area is located just on the other side of the river in North Adelaide.

I wrote a submission against the proposed naming of Blackwood Park (which is a housing estate full of production line McMansions, not a park, and not in Blackwood either) a few years back. I was quite pleased with the sound decision made to name the suburb Craigburn Farm, the name for the area which had existed since before it had been decided that boundaries were needed for places in the hills outside of towns.
  kipioneer Chief Commissioner

Location: Aberfoyle Park
As might be expected the BOM records for the Darlington area give both daily and monthly rainfall.

The nearest weather station on the plains to Darlington, Mitchell Park, had 8.6 of rain in April with a maximum of 4.2 mm on the 9th.  In May so far it recorded 35.6mm  with a maximum on the 4th of 17.6mm and nothing under 5mm before that.

Just up the hill at Bellevue Heights saw 7.2 mm in April with a maximum of 3.4 on the 9th and in May so far 34.2 mm with 10.8mm on the 4th and nothing under 6 mm before that.

Rainfall can vary even over short distances: essentially it comes down to where the measuring device is placed.

It is fortunate that this mishap on the expressway happened before its opening, not after.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Soil hydrology is a complex thing, and outside my training, but I would think the water falling toward Bellevue Heights had more impact than that at Mitchell Park, but this complicated by the function of the Sturt River. Either way, the rainfall experienced in the lead up to the collapse was quite mundane really, a big downpour or a more continuous soaking and the place might have been a disaster.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

More of the retaining wall collapsed yesterday.

No word from Nicolle Flint as yet, which is strange because she was enthusiastically taking responsibility for the Darlington Upgrade project just a week ago.
  mawsonboii Junior Train Controller

Location: Banned
...

I've recently moved to the North East and TTP has became my local shopping centre, I have never seen so many busses at an interchange before. the busses weave their way all around the north east I'd be surprised if there's a road that doesn't have a bus running down it
Giiven that TTP is at the end of the O-Bahn corridor, it is not surprising that there is a concentration of routes at the interchange with the 54x services radiating out to the N and E, the 50x and 55x services from Paradise as well as several other terminating routes!

If there were buses running along every road, why is there such a demand for parking around the O-Bahn interchanges at TTP, Paradise and Klemzig?
62430
"If there were buses running along every road, why is there such a demand for parking around the O-Bahn interchanges at TTP, Paradise and Klemzig?" this doesn't make sense lol. What I meant was there are busses running all over the North Eastern suburbs I often see busses popping out all over different streets.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

4:10pm forecast update has just live on the BOM website.

100% chance of rain tomorrow.

50% chance of more than 10mm.

25% chance of more than 20mm.

Pity the BOM can't predict the chance of the motorway collapsing.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Meanwhile Tom Kousontoohardtospellis proves why he was completely inept at being minister for transport questioning how if the shotcreted wall could stand up to rain, how it would cope with vehicular traffic... Well mate, vehicles don’t usually drive on the walls...

Before someone mentions, the road above is actually retained on concrete piles behind the soil, behind the shotcrete.
  DJPeters Deputy Commissioner

Meanwhile Tom Kousontoohardtospellis proves why he was completely inept at being minister for transport questioning how if the shotcreted wall could stand up to rain, how it would cope with vehicular traffic... Well mate, vehicles don’t usually drive on the walls...

Before someone mentions, the road above is actually retained on concrete piles behind the soil, behind the shotcrete.
Aaron
And also shooting his mouth off because from memory it was the Labor party Govt that signed for this so Tom Kousontoohardtospellis might be better off shutting his trap before the you know what comes along and hits him in the face. Ewwwwww!
  62430 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Metro Adelaide
Meanwhile Tom Kousontoohardtospellis proves why he was completely inept at being minister for transport questioning how if the shotcreted wall could stand up to rain, how it would cope with vehicular traffic... Well mate, vehicles don’t usually drive on the walls...

Before someone mentions, the road above is actually retained on concrete piles behind the soil, behind the shotcrete.
And also shooting his mouth off because from memory it was the Labor party Govt that signed for this so Tom Kousontoohardtospellis might be better off shutting his trap before the you know what comes along and hits him in the face. Ewwwwww!
DJPeters
Do we have to resort to lampooning people's names to make a point?
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

And also shooting his mouth off because from memory it was the Labor party Govt that signed for this so Tom Kousontoohardtospellis might be better off shutting his trap before the you know what comes along and hits him in the face. Ewwwwww!
DJPeters
I think you'll find that it's a Liberal project.

Nicolle Flunk has lots of posters up around the area claiming the credit for fixing South Road. She wouldn't lie about that would she? The posters are still there tonight, so it would seem they are standing by the claim despite their little issue this week.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
To be fair to Nicole Flunk (I am no fan of hers either) her government is paying the bills, but she’s not signing off on any of the engineering. Any issues in planning and design will be fixed, slight overrun likely, but it’s not going to cost the government more.

When your generous aunt buys you an expensive coffee machine from Myers you don’t thank Myer for providing it, you thank her for acquiring it. Equally, when the machine then becomes faulty you don’t blame your aunt for the fault - or at least it would likely be unwise to. You have a word to Myer and they will restitute.

Slightly OT, but this has never bothered an RP discussion before, do we actually know who ended up ‘paying’ for the black Forrest cycle bridge remediation? Pretty sure Turbo Tom Voldemort would have taken credit for the construction at the time, did he also take credit for it falling apart, both whilst in use and towards actual traffic?
  DJPeters Deputy Commissioner

Meanwhile Tom Kousontoohardtospellis proves why he was completely inept at being minister for transport questioning how if the shotcreted wall could stand up to rain, how it would cope with vehicular traffic... Well mate, vehicles don’t usually drive on the walls...

Before someone mentions, the road above is actually retained on concrete piles behind the soil, behind the shotcrete.
And also shooting his mouth off because from memory it was the Labor party Govt that signed for this so Tom Kousontoohardtospellis might be better off shutting his trap before the you know what comes along and hits him in the face. Ewwwwww!
Do we have to resort to lampooning people's names to make a point?
62430
Yes we do actually as it is hard to spell and he deserves to be lampooned, anything that failed or like this was signed off by him or the Labor party they now blame on the current Govt. He should look at that old saying, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone". He really like Knoll for the Liberals was way out of his depth when Labor was in. And now he has the temerity to say it is their fault. What a load of manure Tom. I would not be surprised if he blamed the Liberals for the South Road bridge either as he has shown he has a very short and selective memory about things. I am not a Liberal voter either, I would not vote for any of them given the chance no matter what party they are from. But of late he has mouthed off at just about anything the current Govt has done or is doing and a lot of it goes back into when Labor was in power though. And this project was one of them.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

To be fair to Nicole Flunk (I am no fan of hers either) her government is paying the bills, but she’s not signing off on any of the engineering. Any issues in planning and design will be fixed, slight overrun likely, but it’s not going to cost the government more.

When your generous aunt buys you an expensive coffee machine from Myers you don’t thank Myer for providing it, you thank her for acquiring it. Equally, when the machine then becomes faulty you don’t blame your aunt for the fault - or at least it would likely be unwise to. You have a word to Myer and they will restitute.
Aaron
But let's say my "generous" aunt had actually bought me one of those nasty Espressotoria pod machines from Woolworths and started taking every opportunity to boast about how she's the world's greatest aunt, then I might be just a touch less polite about it.

Flunk deserves even less courtesy than an average aunt with delusions of grandeur, and I won't be disappointed if this is the final nail in the coffin. According to The Poll Bludger, Ladbrokes have Labor at $1.60 to take the seat.

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