Climate Change Confusion

 
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Hi Don, a probing question, feel free to answer, comment or disregard as you see fit.
You've posted repeatedly that you do not believe in the carbon monster and conversely stated that you are one of the lowest carbon people you know.
Why?

Regards, Mick.
michaelgm
Hey Mick, I don't find that intrusive or offensive. I used to be somewhat of a greenie; I read Tim Flannery's books and considered joining the Greens (ugh! Bullet dodged). But I've come to think that 'green energy' is another thing hobbling our international competitiveness and what chides me the most is that its become a massive wealth transfer from Australia's poorest to the wealthy. The millions of hand-to-mouth people in this country have no choice but to be captive to the grid and yet they're the ones directly paying for the stupidly-high feed-in tariffs of the wealthy. It's a scam to make the poor poorer... but anyway.

I've always been a conservationist and concerned about our impact on the environment; you can be that way without subscribing the rest of the Green anthropomorphic warming alarmist rubbish. I've always bought local where-ever I can; I've always detested single-use plastics and avoid them like the plague. We always buy our clothes from op shops - people cringe when you say that but the amount of brand new never worn stuff you find is incredible, you just end up having no need to ever buy retail if you browse op shops in your spare time. Shoes and undies are the exception though - men never seem to get rid of shoes until they're completely rooted.

I always had a veggie garden in my somewhat limited spaces in Melbourne but since moving to large suburban block in Adelaide with a purpose-built veggie garden (thank-you previous Italian owners) so we've really been able to kick growing our own food up a notch. I bought a galvanised tank second-hand but it's not big enough really; I tried to buy a new larger PVC rainwater tank from a MaxiPlas clearance auction in Salisbury North yesterday but the prices were just too high - that's next on my shopping list though so that we can keep the water bills down. If you look you'll eventually find at the right price.

We have never had a new car, all our electricals and household appliances are second-hand from auctions or op shops. People get horrified when you tell them that but it saves you a fortune and if you wait long enough you always find what you want. I bought a CIG 3-phase arc welder complete with new-in-box auto helmet from a local auction here in Adelaide the other week and the whole lot was only $100 (should have been more like a grand), now I can tackle a few projects that might have otherwise required outside expertise. We were also lucky enough to score a 55 inch 2018 Sony Bravia complete with Android/Google operating system a few months ago, wasn't even looking for a new TV but couldn't pass it up @ $450 at an estate auction - something like a quarter of the retail. It's like new and it was a surprise for our household to have the very latest; we're getting better use out of our broadband now too.

I'm not doing all this because I'm a greenie, I'm doing it because I've always run my family on the smell of an oily rag and almost never buy new. The only sins against the planet are that I refuse to have solar power on my roof because I think the whole thing is a scam against the poor as I outlined earlier. I drive a petrol-driven car and I don't have a second-thought about flying. I bought a brand new smartphone last year but that's about it as far as new stuff goes. On the whole I compare my household carbon output to other people and our aversion to brand new goods in particular must surely get us greenie points or stars or whatever!

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  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

Well thanks, Don, for your considered and voluminous response.
Have posted previously, Flannery over egged the pudding and in my view lost credibility.
Personally, I haven't purchased second hand household goods, I try to buy the best, and make them last. So far so good.
Clothing,  I have several suits passed along from some neighbors, who out grew them. Ralph Lauren, other top shelf stuff. Low mileage.
Have PV panels because we did a knock down rebuild a few years back, unlikely we would have retrofited the old place, approx 90 years old.
A dollar saver, Don. Get on the band wagon.

Edit. I have picked up a couple of bar fridges, one a hand me down and one from a coucil clean up. Both sevred their purpose. Ironically, both were passed on to the guys who installed our PV system, free of charge.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
...

You'd have to ask why older diesel generation wasn't maintained as a stand-by; apparently they didn't think it was a contingency worth planning for. Seems there was a battery but it overloaded and shut down apparently as the plant output dropping by 3 m/w in a matter of minutes.
You would also have to ask if a cloud causes a system failure during the daytime what in hell happens at night.
I'm not an engineer but I'd hazard a guess and say its usually a slow change from the solar plant to the batteries as the sun goes down and vice versa as the sun comes up but for some reason a single very dark cloud front (thunderstorm?) suddenly passed over the area and overloaded the battery too very quickly - which is why it also tripped out.

Obviously there's more redundancy required than just a single solar plant with a battery for a town of 25,000.
don_dunstan
As I said before, its not the first cloud to go over AS. There must have been something else in play.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Hey Mick, I don't find that intrusive or offensive. I used to be somewhat of a greenie; I read Tim Flannery's books and considered joining the Greens (ugh! Bullet dodged). But I've come to think that 'green energy' is another thing hobbling our international competitiveness and what chides me the most is that its become a massive wealth transfer from Australia's poorest to the wealthy. The millions of hand-to-mouth people in this country have no choice but to be captive to the grid and yet they're the ones directly paying for the stupidly-high feed-in tariffs of the wealthy. It's a scam to make the poor poorer... but anyway.

I've always been a conservationist and concerned about our impact on the environment; you can be that way without subscribing the rest of the Green anthropomorphic warming alarmist rubbish. I've always bought local where-ever I can; I've always detested single-use plastics and avoid them like the plague. We always buy our clothes from op shops - people cringe when you say that but the amount of brand new never worn stuff you find is incredible, you just end up having no need to ever buy retail if you browse op shops in your spare time. Shoes and undies are the exception though - men never seem to get rid of shoes until they're completely rooted.

I always had a veggie garden in my somewhat limited spaces in Melbourne but since moving to large suburban block in Adelaide with a purpose-built veggie garden (thank-you previous Italian owners) so we've really been able to kick growing our own food up a notch. I bought a galvanised tank second-hand but it's not big enough really; I tried to buy a new larger PVC rainwater tank from a MaxiPlas clearance auction in Salisbury North yesterday but the prices were just too high - that's next on my shopping list though so that we can keep the water bills down. If you look you'll eventually find at the right price.

We have never had a new car, all our electricals and household appliances are second-hand from auctions or op shops. People get horrified when you tell them that but it saves you a fortune and if you wait long enough you always find what you want. I bought a CIG 3-phase arc welder complete with new-in-box auto helmet from a local auction here in Adelaide the other week and the whole lot was only $100 (should have been more like a grand), now I can tackle a few projects that might have otherwise required outside expertise. We were also lucky enough to score a 55 inch 2018 Sony Bravia complete with Android/Google operating system a few months ago, wasn't even looking for a new TV but couldn't pass it up @ $450 at an estate auction - something like a quarter of the retail. It's like new and it was a surprise for our household to have the very latest; we're getting better use out of our broadband now too.

I'm not doing all this because I'm a greenie, I'm doing it because I've always run my family on the smell of an oily rag and almost never buy new. The only sins against the planet are that I refuse to have solar power on my roof because I think the whole thing is a scam against the poor as I outlined earlier. I drive a petrol-driven car and I don't have a second-thought about flying. I bought a brand new smartphone last year but that's about it as far as new stuff goes. On the whole I compare my household carbon output to other people and our aversion to brand new goods in particular must surely get us greenie points or stars or whatever!
don_dunstan
Evidence that you can be environmentally responsible in your personal life, but fall for BS served up under the guise of climate change but the hard liners.
  Graham4405 The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Dalby Qld
We were also lucky enough to score a 55 inch 2018 Sony Bravia complete with Android/Google operating system a few months ago, wasn't even looking for a new TV but couldn't pass it up @ $450 at an estate auction - something like a quarter of the retail.
don_dunstan


Not quite a quarter, but about half, a brand new 55" Sony Bravia is $899 in Big W right now.
https://www.bigw.com.au/product/sony-55-led-4k-ultra-hd-high-dynamic-range-smart-tv-kd55x7000g/p/1191557/

But I like my bargains too, scored a 10 year old DSLR with 3 lenses in an op shop recently for $80. The receipts were in the bag, $2760 new. The camera package deal came with 2 lenses and is available on eBay for ~$450 without the the big (200-400mm) lens that was over $1500 new. Not sure how much I'll use it, but pretty sure I can make some money on it if I don't want to use it!
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
We were also lucky enough to score a 55 inch 2018 Sony Bravia complete with Android/Google operating system a few months ago, wasn't even looking for a new TV but couldn't pass it up @ $450 at an estate auction - something like a quarter of the retail.


Not quite a quarter, but about half, a brand new 55" Sony Bravia is $899 in Big W right now.
https://www.bigw.com.au/product/sony-55-led-4k-ultra-hd-high-dynamic-range-smart-tv-kd55x7000g/p/1191557/

But I like my bargains too, scored a 10 year old DSLR with 3 lenses in an op shop recently for $80. The receipts were in the bag, $2760 new. The camera package deal came with 2 lenses and is available on eBay for ~$450 without the the big (200-400mm) lens that was over $1500 new. Not sure how much I'll use it, but pretty sure I can make some money on it if I don't want to use it!
Graham4405
Well that came down a lot in a very short space of time - the RRP for my TV was almost two grand when it was new. I guess it's the end of 2019 and they're clearing them out anyway.

EDIT: Google Android was a bonus, didn't realise how good it was until we got it - a lot of earlier 'smart' TV's are now obsolete because their makers don't support operating systems any more but Android seems to be here to stay. Not that we use the smart function that much but its good to have the option of watching something direct from the interwebs.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Evidence that you can be environmentally responsible in your personal life, but fall for BS served up under the guise of climate change but the hard liners.
RTT_Rules
Did you mean to say "deniers". Yeah I'll admit to being a denier because I view the biggest problem to be the excuse to rip off the millions of poor in this country with middle class welfare in the form of an imported solar panel - making the grid lopsided with all this stupid green energy being generated at the wrong times of day and then failing to deliver under critical stress situations like in Alice Springs. And that was just a cloud - imagine if someone was trying to sabotage it deliberately, doesn't sound hard does it. Coal is not going to wreak the planet - the carbon dioxide concentrations have been much higher in past and life survived, the only thing that I can see all these green policies doing is making the poor of our nation even more poverty-stricken by making them pay the very highest domestic charges for electricity in the world.

The ridiculous cost of doing business in this country with utilities and housing has progressively made us less productive and poorer - hence the large fall in output per person GDP. Nobody wants to make things here any more - who can blame them? In Germany 21% of the workforce is employed by manufacturing; in most EU countries that rate is about 15%. Here it is less than 7% - our slavish adherence to neo-Thatcherite economics combined with this stupid idea that carbon dioxide is bad - those two situations have combined to completely gut our nation of manufacturing. See that GM announced the demise of the Commodore today - not surprised in the least to hear that, Australians hated GM for closing their factory, I'm not the only one angry about what's happened to our once mighty capable, independent nation.

Something has to give - we can't keep off-shoring everything and expect services to fill all the gaps - our living standards will have to drop dramatically unless we can generate higher paying "clever country" jobs (remember that?) like we were promised once upon a time.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
Hi Don, a probing question, feel free to answer, comment or disregard as you see fit.
You've posted repeatedly that you do not believe in the carbon monster and conversely stated that you are one of the lowest carbon people you know.
Why?

Regards, Mick.
Hey Mick, I don't find that intrusive or offensive. I used to be somewhat of a greenie; I read Tim Flannery's books and considered joining the Greens
don_dunstan
Is that like the 2GB jock who said he leaned a little to the right. Laughing

For Don The Greens get the blame for everything he doesn't blame Labor for.

Anyone who knows anything about Climate Change understands CO2 is just one of the problematic green house gases. I'm confident nothing will change thanks to the Dons of the world. Eventually things will come to a head, but not in my lifetime.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Hi Don, a probing question, feel free to answer, comment or disregard as you see fit.
You've posted repeatedly that you do not believe in the carbon monster and conversely stated that you are one of the lowest carbon people you know.
Why?

Regards, Mick.
Hey Mick, I don't find that intrusive or offensive. I used to be somewhat of a greenie; I read Tim Flannery's books and considered joining the Greens
Is that like the 2GB jock who said he leaned a little to the right. Laughing

For Don The Greens get the blame for everything he doesn't blame Labor for.

Anyone who knows anything about Climate Change understands CO2 is just one of the problematic green house gases. I'm confident nothing will change thanks to the Dons of the world. Eventually things will come to a head, but not in my lifetime.
Groundrelay
I was wondering when you'd pop up to give me an updated account of my life. You should become my personal biographer - although I'll warn you, I'm an uncontrollable narcissist like Bob Hawke so you'll have to pose with me in our dressing gowns for a New Idea spread about how wonderful I am.

"Just one of the problematic green house gases" - What a joke - just like one of the many problematic plastic dumping behaviours. And yeah, one thing we can agree on - nothing will happen in our lifetimes just like nothing is happening now.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Evidence that you can be environmentally responsible in your personal life, but fall for BS served up under the guise of climate change but the hard liners.
Did you mean to say "deniers". Yeah I'll admit to being a denier because I view the biggest problem to be the excuse to rip off the millions of poor in this country with middle class welfare in the form of an imported solar panel - making the grid lopsided with all this stupid green energy being generated at the wrong times of day and then failing to deliver under critical stress situations like in Alice Springs. And that was just a cloud - imagine if someone was trying to sabotage it deliberately, doesn't sound hard does it. Coal is not going to wreak the planet - the carbon dioxide concentrations have been much higher in past and life survived, the only thing that I can see all these green policies doing is making the poor of our nation even more poverty-stricken by making them pay the very highest domestic charges for electricity in the world.

The ridiculous cost of doing business in this country with utilities and housing has progressively made us less productive and poorer - hence the large fall in output per person GDP. Nobody wants to make things here any more - who can blame them? In Germany 21% of the workforce is employed by manufacturing; in most EU countries that rate is about 15%. Here it is less than 7% - our slavish adherence to neo-Thatcherite economics combined with this stupid idea that carbon dioxide is bad - those two situations have combined to completely gut our nation of manufacturing. See that GM announced the demise of the Commodore today - not surprised in the least to hear that, Australians hated GM for closing their factory, I'm not the only one angry about what's happened to our once mighty capable, independent nation.

Something has to give - we can't keep off-shoring everything and expect services to fill all the gaps - our living standards will have to drop dramatically unless we can generate higher paying "clever country" jobs (remember that?) like we were promised once upon a time.
don_dunstan
I left off, "NOT"

Evidence that you can be environmentally responsible in your personal life, but NOT fall for BS served up under the guise of climate change but the hard liners.

I think its only part of the issue for Holden closing the Commodore local production, loosing its Australian home grown certainly did have some impact, for example I bought a Aussie Aurion when I moved to Dubai in 2011, it was a combination of "Buy Australian" plus the car was well suited to our needs at the time. Now its gone, when it came time to upgrade with 200k on the clock and also replace our aging small 2d Pajero I didn't feel any brand or model loyalty and bought a near new Sth African made Ranger.

Commodore was loosing 2000-3000 sales a year when made locally and dropped from 23000 to just 9000 in 2018 and 5000 YTD. As GM have seen in the USA, sales of sedan's are in rapid decline. Camry one of the world's highest selling cars is also in decline world wide and especially in US.

We were lucky for the car to remain in production as long as it did. 23,000 pa is SFA. Tesla makes 6000 Model 3's a week and 50,000 a year of the luxury models X or S and Tesla doesn't yet rate a significant producer of cars. 23,000 is 63 cars a day or barely 8 per hour on a 8 hr shift. The biggest assembly lines churn them out at 20-30 cars / h, 16 h a day.

Aussies off-shored our car industries by not buying local made and this is why electric cars wil not be made he because we'd be the last to buy them and exporting is not viable on our high global wages.

Australia used to be one of the lowest energy (gas and electricity) cost countries in the world. We need to focus on getting back there within 2 years. Anything not commercially viable on its own without govt interference by should be off the table.

GM is following Ford in acknowledging they cannot compete in the sedan / hatch sector, ironically the very model assembly lines that have been propped up in Australia and US by respective govts for last 10 years. Others will follow and fall to the onslaught of low cost hatches and sedans from Eastern Europe, China and other.

The all electric car boom is expected to kill off a number of major brands that have left their run too late competing with too few a EV resources, so stayed tuned for future model and manufacturers demise.  

The decision to axe the Commodore and Astra means Holden’s lineup in 2021 will only have SUVs and trucks, plus the right-hand-drive mid-engined Corvette C8.

The Insignia/Commodore is being retired from North America as well considering General Motors has decided to pull the plug on the Buick Regal. It will soldier on in China as a Buick as well as in Europe where it’s sold with Opel and Vauxhall badges. The model was recently facelifted, although you’ll have a difficult time figuring out what’s new since the changes are limited to upgraded LED headlights, infotainment system, and some mild styling tweaks. It’s a similar story with the Astra facelift unveiled in Europe back in July with subtle revisions.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
...

Australia used to be one of the lowest energy (gas and electricity) cost countries in the world. We need to focus on getting back there within 2 years. Anything not commercially viable on its own without govt interference by should be off the table.

...
RTT_Rules
Australia is being reamed by criminal cartels of multi-nationals now, we don't actually have any control over our resources any longer. Parliament is just a rubber stamp for the theft.

Truly we've become Keating's Banana Republic (without the 'republic' part).
  Carnot Minister for Railways

...

Australia used to be one of the lowest energy (gas and electricity) cost countries in the world. We need to focus on getting back there within 2 years. Anything not commercially viable on its own without govt interference by should be off the table.

...
Australia is being reamed by criminal cartels of multi-nationals now, we don't actually have any control over our resources any longer. Parliament is just a rubber stamp for the theft.

Truly we've become Keating's Banana Republic (without the 'republic' part).
don_dunstan
I mostly agree with you on this one.

Ironically Keating has been bleating on about how wonderful the dictators in China are of late.  Puppet.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
...

Australia used to be one of the lowest energy (gas and electricity) cost countries in the world. We need to focus on getting back there within 2 years. Anything not commercially viable on its own without govt interference by should be off the table.

...
Australia is being reamed by criminal cartels of multi-nationals now, we don't actually have any control over our resources any longer. Parliament is just a rubber stamp for the theft.

Truly we've become Keating's Banana Republic (without the 'republic' part).
I mostly agree with you on this one.

Ironically Keating has been bleating on about how wonderful the dictators in China are of late.  Puppet.
Carnot
HE likes China because he thinks its easier to be in govt over there as little opposition, however I suspect behind  the scenes makes Australia's political system look like child's play. Making a goof/wrong comment in Oz is embarrassing, but in China its unthinkable and the internal politics and game playing I'm sure would make our minds spin.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
...

Australia used to be one of the lowest energy (gas and electricity) cost countries in the world. We need to focus on getting back there within 2 years. Anything not commercially viable on its own without govt interference by should be off the table.

...
Australia is being reamed by criminal cartels of multi-nationals now, we don't actually have any control over our resources any longer. Parliament is just a rubber stamp for the theft.

Truly we've become Keating's Banana Republic (without the 'republic' part).
I mostly agree with you on this one.

Ironically Keating has been bleating on about how wonderful the dictators in China are of late.  Puppet.
Carnot
So where's the LNP been since 1996? Just askin' Razz

You really believe those that claim the right and their backers would do anything to risk trade with China.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
I mostly agree with you on this one.

Ironically Keating has been bleating on about how wonderful the dictators in China are of late.  Puppet.
So where's the LNP been since 1996? Just askin' Razz

You really believe those that claim the right and their backers would do anything to risk trade with China.
Groundrelay
I dunno, Andrew Hastie has been making some noise recently about the need to protect our democratic institutions from corruption by foreign communist governments - don't see anyone on the Labor side doing anything remotely like that.

In more ALP good news, I see Eddie Obied is getting out of jail. Hooray - now he'll be able to go straight back to the Labor Party where he left off. Graham Richardson will give him a glowing reference I'm sure.
  billybaxter Chief Commissioner

Location: Bosnia Park, Fairfield
Just askin'? Just Robert Askin?  Well played old chap!
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Engineers Ireland published a comparison of carbon per MW emitted with the conversion of Ireland's only coal-fired power plant (Moneypoint) to biomass. I wasn't aware but apparently the proposal was initially sourcing box eucalypt trees from places like Kangaroo Island and Western Victoria where there are a lot of these 'carbon sink' purpose plantations put in 15-20 years ago by both foreign and domestic owners that are now becoming 'mature'.

The problem is that the cost of shipping the pre-manufactured logs from the box gums kinda cancels out the gain over not using coal @ 186 g of carbon emitted per kw/h as opposed to using other purpose-planted 'carbon sink' forests in North America (about 60 g carbon less) much closer to Ireland. Interesting that these things are even being considered - I suppose the large box gum plantations between Ararat-Beaufort and on Kangaroo Island at least might have a customer for their mature product... power plants on the other side of the planet.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Trees are not a carbon sink and should never have been planted as such, and most certainly ought not be combusted if they were supposedly for this purpose.

Just goes to show why a ‘carbon trading’ scheme is smeg, an idea dreamt up by economists with no knowledge of science purely for a money making exercise - no thought for the environment/atmosphere whatsoever.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Trees are not a carbon sink and should never have been planted as such, and most certainly ought not be combusted if they were supposedly for this purpose.

Just goes to show why a ‘carbon trading’ scheme is smeg, an idea dreamt up by economists with no knowledge of science purely for a money making exercise - no thought for the environment/atmosphere whatsoever.
Aaron
Arguing with a family member about exactly this over the Xmas dinner - are 'carbon sink' forests of box gums allowed to be burnt for fuel once they get to maturity or are they supposed to "capture carbon" forever? Don't get me wrong, its not a bad thing that these plantations are there but I don't understand what we're supposed to do with them longer term; leave them in situ forever?

The whole concept of 'carbon offset' is bullsh*t designed to make wealthy people feel good about being excessive consumers - I remember years ago when Virgin or whoever it was started offering you a few dollars per flight to buy "carbon off-set". No information about where or how the money will be used, if the trees grow up and are harvested for pulp or timber thus eventually releasing the captured carbon.

Even then it's just theoretical rubbish about "if I emit 1kg of carbon dioxide flying to the UK then the five trees I've planted with carbon off-set should cancel that"? According to who, the airline?

It's all a load of rubbish.
  kitchgp Chief Commissioner

There’s a higher authority that’s beyond our comprehension – right up there in the sky. And unless we understand that that’s got to be respected, then we’re just fools. We’re going to get nailed.
Hon B Joyce, MHR New England, 25 Dec 2019
Problem solved. Any further discussion is redundant.


PS: Is he The Messiah or just a very ……………………….?
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
There’s a higher authority that’s beyond our comprehension – right up there in the sky. And unless we understand that that’s got to be respected, then we’re just fools. We’re going to get nailed.
Problem solved. Any further discussion is redundant.


PS: Is he The Messiah or just a very ……………………….?
kitchgp
If he really believed in God he would have had more respect of the sacred institution of marriage. But he didn't, he had an ongoing affair while still married and lied to his own family and the public about it for ages. You really have to wonder about the character of someone who can do that and keep lying with a straight face to everyone. Zero integrity.

He's a repulsive hypocrite of the worst kind, one who thinks that he's better than everyone else while he's hurting people with his lies. Where does he get off lecturing the rest of us about God?

Go to hell, Barnaby.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Interesting article about the fact that the world simply doesn't have enough resources to replace all the current internal combustion cars with electric vehicles. Specifically we don't have enough rare earth minerals, cobalt, lithium, copper, etc to make the vehicles needed; Tree-Hugger:

British scientists do the math and find that we come up short for cobalt, lithium and copper.

TreeHugger previously covered the UK Committee on Climate Change report, and complained that that it was too much business as usual, particularly with its suggestion that electric cars could replace all the ICE (internal combustion engine) powered cars in the UK, and its lack of interest in alternatives.

Now, a letter from the Natural History Museum's head of Earth Sciences, Professor Richard Herrington, along with other experts, points out the scale of the problem of building so many electric cars. They calculate that, even with the most efficient batteries available, full electrification of the auto fleet by 2035 would need a lot more mining.

The worldwide impact: If this analysis is extrapolated to the currently projected estimate of two billion cars worldwide, based on 2018 figures, annual production would have to increase for neodymium and dysprosium by 70%, copper output would need to more than double and cobalt output would need to increase at least three and a half times for the entire period from now until 2050 to satisfy the demand.

Long story short, it can't be done.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Lots of ongoing development is seeing reductions in some of the minerals required in batteries, and then there's solid state batteries which offer a significant improvement in performance.

That's said, EVs are resource hungry (Elon's Cybertruck as Exhibit A), which convinces me that most of the population are going to have to be dependent on Public transport in future. It's a huge shift and many will be resistant for obvious reasons (a lack of convenience and time to travel, in particular).
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Don, trees are a smeg carbon offset because they actually offset CO2 production at all.

In the long term at best trees only offset carbon for the maybe 100 years the tree lives. After that 100 years microbial action will see near enough to 100% of the ‘sequestered’ carbon returned to the atmosphere. It’s no big secret, it’s not new information, there’s a pretty picture of it in every school kids science book.

A while ago I asked Dan and some others in the Greta or school strike thread, whatever it was, to explain how to sequester carbon, alas I note that not one of them bothered to think about it or come up with something.

The only real hope we have of actual carbon sequestration in longer terms is something like production of geological carbonates, preferably those which are as insoluble as possible.

Or, we can come up with a way of efficiently sequestering CO2 back into coal and liquid hydrocarbons. That said, thermodynamics are always going to be there to smeg us in the smeg on that too, AND we’d have to remember not to combust them again... A difficult task given that pricks in the UK today can’t work out why we planted trees 20 years ago...
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Aaron, what about plantation hardwood or pine for carbon sequestration? It's been explained to me in the past that hardwood in particular need the exact right growing conditions and takes many decades to mature - but surely as a permanent store of carbon its a more natural alternative than artificially making some kind of carbonite compound to store it away. Interested in your opinion.

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