Round One project proposals - Inland Rail Interface Program

 
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Announced yesterday, the following are projects that have been selected for business case development

1. Intermodal terminal at Mangalore (Strathbogie Council)
2. Intermodal and refrigeration hub at Wodonga (SCT Logistics)
3. Intermodal and refrigeration hub at Parkes (SCT Logistics)
4. Intermodal terminal at Bomen (the RIFL) (Wagga City Council)
5. Upgrades to WR Connect facility at Wumbulgul (Leeton and Griffith City Councils)
6. Increased TAL on Stockinbingal to Griffith (TfNSW)
7. Increased TAL on Narromine to Dubbo (TfNSW)
8. Intermodal terminal at Gunnedah (Gunnedah SCl)
9. Intermodal termina at Moree (Moree SC)
10. Review of transport network around the NSW/Qld border (Border ROC)
11. Croppa Creek road/rail interface project (Moree and Gwydir SCs)
12. Upgrade Goondiwindi to Inland Rail (Goondiwindi RC)
13. Rail maintenance centre in Toowoomba (Toowoomba RC)
14. Additional rail connections at Yelarbon and Southbrook (Toowoomba RC and Darling Downs/SW Qld Council of Mayors)
15. Upgrade and reopen existing Western/West Moreton and South West Rail system (same as 14)
16. InterlinkSQ and Seaway terminal development (InterlinkSQ)


See link below for more detail

https://www.inlandrail.gov.au/regional-development/interface-improvement-program/round-one-project-proposals

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  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/croppa-creek-road-upgrades-among-proposals-given-green-light-under-inland-rail-interface-improvement-program details the croppa creek proposal.

Are we to presume the Mangalore development to be on the Goulburn Valley line?

I must say this is starting to look very exciting.
  neillfarmer Chief Train Controller

There is a lot of smoke but not much fire on this project so far. When they start moving dirt for The Range Tunnel  and North Star to Toowoomba I will start to believe the whole project might happen. I can't see it being built by 2025 and with the obvious budget constraints post Covid-19 the IRL might well get pushed back to the never never.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Odd in my view is the building of an Intermodal and refrigeration hub at Wodonga (SCT Logistics) when one already exists or is this more of an expansion rather than a second site?
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Odd in my view is the building of an Intermodal and refrigeration hub at Wodonga (SCT Logistics) when one already exists or is this more of an expansion rather than a second site?
bevans
I think expansion of current.  SCT getting more money to expand their current ops (ie a subsidy)...
  ngarner Assistant Commissioner

Location: Seville
https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/croppa-creek-road-upgrades-among-proposals-given-green-light-under-inland-rail-interface-improvement-program details the croppa creek proposal.

Are we to presume the Mangalore development to be on the Goulburn Valley line?

I must say this is starting to look very exciting.
bevans
Why would they do it on the Goulburn Valley, broad gauge, line when inland rail is standard gauge? Mangalore Airport is mentioned in the link which isn't that far from either but for any benefit to inland rail users it would have to be connected to the Albury SG line, otherwise transshipping would defeat the benefits and be a complete waste of time and money; although our pollies are good at that so maybe that's exactly what they'll do.

Neil
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Mangalore is right next to the SG and BG lines.
  ngarner Assistant Commissioner

Location: Seville
Mangalore is right next to the SG and BG lines.
james.au
Yes, agreed; I traveled though it on locos often enough for 5 years to know that. The airport less so. Your point being?
Inland rail is still being built to SG (unless DangersDan gets his way). Considering they are working on a section near Parkes to that gauge I rather doubt it will change when they get to the Victorian border.

Neil
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Mangalore is right next to the SG and BG lines.
Yes, agreed; I traveled though it on locos often enough for 5 years to know that. The airport less so. Your point being?
Inland rail is still being built to SG (unless DangersDan gets his way). Considering they are working on a section near Parkes to that gauge I rather doubt it will change when they get to the Victorian border.

Neil
ngarner
Sorry, i misread your previous.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/croppa-creek-road-upgrades-among-proposals-given-green-light-under-inland-rail-interface-improvement-program details the croppa creek proposal.

Are we to presume the Mangalore development to be on the Goulburn Valley line?

I must say this is starting to look very exciting.
Why would they do it on the Goulburn Valley, broad gauge, line when inland rail is standard gauge? Mangalore Airport is mentioned in the link which isn't that far from either but for any benefit to inland rail users it would have to be connected to the Albury SG line, otherwise transshipping would defeat the benefits and be a complete waste of time and money; although our pollies are good at that so maybe that's exactly what they'll do.

Neil
ngarner

Hi Neil, my thoughts were more about the idea that perhaps there were plans for BG-SG conversion of the Goulburn Valley Line in the near future?
  ngarner Assistant Commissioner

Location: Seville
https://www.railpage.com.au/news/s/croppa-creek-road-upgrades-among-proposals-given-green-light-under-inland-rail-interface-improvement-program details the croppa creek proposal.

Are we to presume the Mangalore development to be on the Goulburn Valley line?

I must say this is starting to look very exciting.
Why would they do it on the Goulburn Valley, broad gauge, line when inland rail is standard gauge? Mangalore Airport is mentioned in the link which isn't that far from either but for any benefit to inland rail users it would have to be connected to the Albury SG line, otherwise transshipping would defeat the benefits and be a complete waste of time and money; although our pollies are good at that so maybe that's exactly what they'll do.

Neil

Hi Neil, my thoughts were more about the idea that perhaps there were plans for BG-SG conversion of the Goulburn Valley Line in the near future?
bevans
Your post makes a lot more sense with that clarification.
I haven't seen, or heard, anything from the government to suggest it and considering the money being put into upgrading the Shepparton line to handle V'locities, and more services, it isn't something they're looking at in the short term. However, governments do like spending our money on reinventing the wheel, so I wouldn't discount the idea at all. Personally, I'd say just don't expect it in the next couple of years but, after that, who knows?

Neil
  WimbledonW Train Controller

Location: Sydney
Are any new triangles proposed; for example at Stockinbingal, to allow direct moves via an upgraded line from Griffith to the  hub at Dubbo?

The triangle at Dubbo which was worked by ground frames, is now power signalled.

Merrygoes and Binnaway could also do with new triangles.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Your post makes a lot more sense with that clarification.
I haven't seen, or heard, anything from the government to suggest it and considering the money being put into upgrading the Shepparton line to handle V'locities, and more services, it isn't something they're looking at in the short term. However, governments do like spending our money on reinventing the wheel, so I wouldn't discount the idea at all. Personally, I'd say just don't expect it in the next couple of years but, after that, who knows?

Neil
ngarner
See this link Neil as Vlocities on the Shepparton line are definitely in the pipeline in what I would consider the short term

https://regionalrailrevival.vic.gov.au/shepparton
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Are any new triangles proposed; for example at Stockinbingal, to allow direct moves via an upgraded line from Griffith to the  hub at Dubbo?

The triangle at Dubbo which was worked by ground frames, is now power signalled.

Merrygoes and Binnaway could also do with new triangles.
WimbledonW
Stockinbingal Is getting a new railway diversion as part of the new link to Illabo (North - South trains will sail through at mainline speed, where as the East - West trains will have to negotiate lower speed turnouts)
https://maps.inlandrail.com.au/i2s#/
  ngarner Assistant Commissioner

Location: Seville
Your post makes a lot more sense with that clarification.
I haven't seen, or heard, anything from the government to suggest it and considering the money being put into upgrading the Shepparton line to handle V'locities, and more services, it isn't something they're looking at in the short term. However, governments do like spending our money on reinventing the wheel, so I wouldn't discount the idea at all. Personally, I'd say just don't expect it in the next couple of years but, after that, who knows?

Neil
See this link Neil as Vlocities on the Shepparton line are definitely in the pipeline in what I would consider the short term

https://regionalrailrevival.vic.gov.au/shepparton
james.au
"considering the money being put into upgrading the Shepparton line to handle V'locities" - that's what I was trying to say, apparently poorly. There will be SG Vlo's in the next year and a half but supposedly for Albury only. The Shep line upgrade is BG and always has been planned that way.

Neil
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
What's a rail freight terminal got to do with a small regional airport ?

Trains don't handle air freight !

Some of the large European airports have rail freight sidings, but that's only to supply consumables to the airport (aircraft fuel, non perishable foodstuff, rubbish removal)

Air freight on the ground goes by road directly from/to the customer, with limited stuffing around.
  WimbledonW Train Controller

Location: Sydney
Are any new triangles proposed; for example at Stockinbingal, to allow direct moves via an upgraded line from Griffith to the  hub at Dubbo?

The triangle at Dubbo which was worked by ground frames, is now power signalled.

Merrygoes and Binnaway could also do with new triangles.
Stockinbingal Is getting a new railway diversion as part of the new link to Illabo (North - South trains will sail through at mainline speed, where as the East - West trains will have to negotiate lower speed turnouts)
https://maps.inlandrail.com.au/i2s#/
Nightfire


The curves and turnouts at Stockinbingal Junction seem to be both 80km/h for goods trains. Even the speed on the main road seems, and its bridge over the rail,  to be higher than before.

There is no connection between the Griffith line and the Parkes line, although one could be added later. There used to be a WWII triangle, and the land boundaries and fences still show this.

For a diagram of Stockinbingal see http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR431.pdf

Overall, the design of road and rail looks to be excellent.

The only slight problem is that 2E points are no longer on the straight, but are on the start of an 80km/h curve.
  WimbledonW Train Controller

Location: Sydney
Are any new triangles proposed; for example at Stockinbingal, to allow direct moves via an upgraded line from Griffith to the  hub at Dubbo?

The triangle at Dubbo which was worked by ground frames, is now power signalled.

Merrygoes and Binnaway could also do with new triangles.
WimbledonW
Stockinbingal Is getting a new railway diversion as part of the new link to Illabo (North - South trains will sail through at mainline speed, where as the East - West trains will have to negotiate lower speed turnouts)
https://maps.inlandrail.com.au/i2s#/
"Nightfire"


The curves and turnouts at Stockinbingal Junction seem to be both 80km/h for goods trains. Even the speed on the main road seems, and its bridge over the rail,  to be higher than before.

There is no connection between the Griffith line and the Parkes line, although one could be added later.

For a diagram of Stockinbingal Junction see http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR431.pdf

For a diagram of Stockinbingal Station   see http://www.sa-trackandsignal.net/Pdf%20files/ARTC/AR298.pdf

Overall, the design of road and rail looks to be excellent.

The only slight problem is that 2E points are no longer on the straight, but are on the start of an 80km/h curve.
  Fatty Deputy Commissioner

Location: Melbourne
What's a rail freight terminal got to do with a small regional airport ?

Trains don't handle air freight !

Some of the large European airports have rail freight sidings, but that's only to supply consumables to the airport (aircraft fuel, non perishable foodstuff, rubbish removal)

Air freight on the ground goes by road directly from/to the customer, with limited stuffing around.
Nightfire
It's hard to believe that anyone would consider consolidating freight handling to a single location to service a regional area. They must be nincompoops.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland


The curves and turnouts at Stockinbingal Junction seem to be both 80km/h for goods trains. Even the speed on the main road seems, and its bridge over the rail,  to be higher than before.
WimbledonW
Where does It say 80 km/h turnouts ? (I'm thinking they would be more 40 or 50 km/h)

See some of the comments question why the opportunity Is not taken to highway bypass the town of Stockinbingal, but what Is there really to bypass ! the town probably relays on passing traffic.

I wonder what would be built first, the highway diversion or the railway diversion, they both Intertwine with one and other (new and existing) you would think temporary level crossings would want to be avoided (probably a temporary section of highway would be needed along the Southern side of the existing railway (from the level crossing towards the new overpass)
  WimbledonW Train Controller

Location: Sydney
The curves and turnouts at Stockinbingal Junction seem to be both 80km/h for goods trains. Even the speed on the main road seems, and its bridge over the rail,  to be higher than before.

Where does It say 80 km/h turnouts ? (I'm thinking they would be more 40 or 50 km/h)

A picture of the newly constructed junction (in Track+Signal magazine) at Goobang Junction looks as if they were as high as about 80km/h, even for the turnout in and out of the siding. These turnout lead to wide track centres which is an indication that these turnouts are something like 80km/h.

80km/h points and curves match the speed limit for goods trains which is set at 80km/h.

Of course ARTC doesn't gloat about these fast turnouts, as that would be ill--disciplined.

The existing junction at Stockinbingal has a 200m radius curve with a 25km/h turnout; the new junction has a radius of 400m  to 800m with a higher speed.
  WimbledonW Train Controller

Location: Sydney
.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
I can't see ARTC designing 50kph turnouts for the Inland when the line should be 80+kph for the TAL they want.  Looking at the curves on Inland alignment in that map the speed may well be higher.  Sure, the turnouts from Temora and Coota could work slower from those angles but travelling through on the Inland should be kept fast, and i cant see them designing a slower turnout at this stage...

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