Future of the Belair Line

 
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Mt. Barker is now 36,000 and I believe it's the fastest growing town outside of the Adelaide metro area. That's despite the fact that the state government had a policy to keep rampant development out of the Hills water table...

A standard gauge service to Mt Barker using 3000 class cars freed up from the Gawler electrification might be viable in the longer term.

It must be very hard to live in SA with such a chip on their shoulders.  30,000 is not a town rather a city and believe it or not in other parts of the country those "cities" have rail services for passengers and even freight.  I cannot understand why SA people appear to be so anti-rail.

Buy a couple of explorers and run some services and you may just see how popular they could become. Mount Barker is one which could work.

Orange has 40,000 and a rail service (not too disimilar)
Broken Hill has 17,000 and a service
Griffith has 20,000 and a service
Echuca has 14,000 and a service
Ararat has 8000 and a service
Bathurst at 36,000 and a service
Maryborough Vic 8000 and a service
Swan Hill 10000 and a service

Port Augusta 13,000 no service
Whyalla, 22,000 no service
Mount Gambier 22,000
Port Pirie 14,000 no service

The problem is your idealistic government without vision.

Why don;t we dispense with the idea people outside of SA don't understand SA and make some comparisons which I just did.
NSWGR8022
Nothing stirs me up more that persons looking over the border fence and with airs of superiority telling SA how to run its transport system. It was their choice of NSW narrow Gauge which stuffed up the rail system in SA. It fractured an already ailing network that in many instances had outlived its usefulness. SA had no mineral traffic to cross subsidise passenger operating costs.
Others have already said authoritatively that a rail service from Mt Barker on the present infrastructure is not viable, too slow, buses are quicker and provide a service to where people want to go.

As for town comparisons, interesting but hardly useful. Unlike NSW correspondents on this topic I have lived in Whyalla. I was even part of a campaign to keep the then passenger service running to Whyalla. I and my family had even used the train, most hadn't.
In my latter years I have moved back to the country. At various times in my life I have spent long periods working in Melbourne where I used the excellent public transport, but even there had to use a private vehicle to get to some places. On a few occasions I used the Overland to get to/from home in Adelaide

What I can say regarding rail to the SA country is this:
Country people do not need to go to the Big cities as often as city people might imagine.
When we do, we want the flexibility provided by our own vehicle.
We would rather facilities be improved in our regions than have better transport to use facilities in Adelaide. (See below)
At best a rail service from Whyalla to Adelaide would take 4 hours while one can fly there in one hour. Air travel gives one a full business day at either end, rail (unless TGV) can't do that.

The cost of a rail vehicle is some $millions. For that price a regional hospital can have CAT scan machine or an MRI machine. The cost of two or three vehicles, a train, would provide a radiation therapy suite.
I don't have to do a poll to know what regional people want.

Sponsored advertisement

  steam4ian Chief Commissioner


Apologies for the direct reply but I don't believe this for a second and believe this to be a convenient excuse on the basis of the govt (who is an under performing group of self serving narcissists) not to want to idealologically invest in rail.  The GDP of SA has never been higher at almost $110b per annum and you suggest there is no money for 5 velocity style sets to run service between Adelaide and Mount Barker and Adelaide-Port Pirie-Port Augusta- Whyalla?  

That is just not believable sorry.
NSWGR8022
Since you have led with a pseudo political comment I will follow, otherwise I would not waste my time or risk my credibility on these pages.

Perhaps your comments have less to do with the facts in SA than with your powers of comprehension!
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Whilst I am on a rant about those from the Eastern states sniping at SA for lack of interest in passenger rail services it is my turn to ask a question.

Eastern staters please tell me why so little freight goes by rail on the Sydney Melbourne route; it is only 1% of total freight movements.

Before you poke at SA, or propose rash passenger schemes, answer that question first.

Yes! I did have razor blades for breakfast, or was it the Indian I had for dinner last night?
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Whilst I am on a rant about those from the Eastern states sniping at SA for lack of interest in passenger rail services it is my turn to ask a question.

Eastern staters please tell me why so little freight goes by rail on the Sydney Melbourne route; it is only 1% of total freight movements.

Before you poke at SA, or propose rash passenger schemes, answer that question first.

Yes! I did have razor blades for breakfast, or was it the Indian I had for dinner last night?
steam4ian
There's an Indian restaurant in Claire?

The collapse in freight on rail on our (once) busiest route is nothing short of a national disgrace; unfortunately no noise from any government about how to get some of the freight task back onto rail.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Others have already said authoritatively that a rail service from Mt Barker on the present infrastructure is not viable, too slow, buses are quicker and provide a service to where people want to go.
steam4ian
In the longer term there are two options that have been explored; one was Mt Barker and the other one was a (less likely) extension of services to Kapunda. I believe that Kapunda is permanently off the radar now as the track has deteriorated too much since closure.

Mt Barker is a possibility in the longer term simply because its achievable, Mt Barker is a rapidly-growing town and the infrastructure is still mostly there but unless the Commonwealth comes to the party I can't see it happening.
  steam4ian Chief Commissioner

Whilst I am on a rant about those from the Eastern states sniping at SA for lack of interest in passenger rail services it is my turn to ask a question.

Eastern staters please tell me why so little freight goes by rail on the Sydney Melbourne route; it is only 1% of total freight movements.

Before you poke at SA, or propose rash passenger schemes, answer that question first.

Yes! I did have razor blades for breakfast, or was it the Indian I had for dinner last night?
There's an Indian restaurant in Claire?

The collapse in freight on rail on our (once) busiest route is nothing short of a national disgrace; unfortunately no noise from any government about how to get some of the freight task back onto rail.
don_dunstan
There certainly is an Indian restaurant in Clare. Two years ago it was voted the second best Indian restaurant in Australia!
Seriously!

Thanks for asking.
  ARG706 Chief Commissioner

Location: SA
Yes! I did have razor blades for breakfast, or was it the Indian I had for dinner last night?
steam4ian

I hope it wasn't cannibalism. There would be some explaining to do.
  Gayspie Deputy Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
The lions share of the Belair line patronage comes from Mitcham and Blackwood.
Unley Park and Coromandel also contribute a healthy share of the lines ridership.

I know it is a long shot but does anyone here happen to have a copy of a Belair line timetable from when the service was first single tracked back in 1995?
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Whilst I am on a rant about those from the Eastern states sniping at SA for lack of interest in passenger rail services it is my turn to ask a question.

Eastern staters please tell me why so little freight goes by rail on the Sydney Melbourne route; it is only 1% of total freight movements.

Before you poke at SA, or propose rash passenger schemes, answer that question first.

Yes! I did have razor blades for breakfast, or was it the Indian I had for dinner last night?
There's an Indian restaurant in Claire?

The collapse in freight on rail on our (once) busiest route is nothing short of a national disgrace; unfortunately no noise from any government about how to get some of the freight task back onto rail.
There certainly is an Indian restaurant in Clare. Two years ago it was voted the second best Indian restaurant in Australia!
Seriously!

Thanks for asking.
steam4ian
This is the single most interesting piece of info in the thread so far! I only go to Clare for Skillogallee, top two Indian too? Now I can go to Clare twice as often.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
The lions share of the Belair line patronage comes from Mitcham and Blackwood.
Unley Park and Coromandel also contribute a healthy share of the lines ridership.

I know it is a long shot but does anyone here happen to have a copy of a Belair line timetable from when the service was first single tracked back in 1995?
Gayspie
By chance today I was talking to someone that works in the State Library, we were talking about their archives of something else, but I think they might be a shot for having old copies of PT timetables.
  62430 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Metro Adelaide
The lions share of the Belair line patronage comes from Mitcham and Blackwood.
Unley Park and Coromandel also contribute a healthy share of the lines ridership.

I know it is a long shot but does anyone here happen to have a copy of a Belair line timetable from when the service was first single tracked back in 1995?
Gayspie
Archived on the Wayback Machine is the TransAdelaide  Belair timetable of 14 October 2002.

https://web.archive.org/web/20060422190635/http://www.adelaidemetro.com.au/routes/timetables/Belair_ttable.pdf

This is more recent than you were asking for, but so far I haven't been able to locate an earlier archive.  TransAdelaide was formed in 1995, but when did its website go online?
  Gayspie Deputy Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
[color=#000000][size=3][table][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]STATION[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]DOWN[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]UP[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Adelaide[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]601[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]734[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Mile End Cross A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]603[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif][b]733[/b][/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Wayville[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]607[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]728[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Goodwood[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]609[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]727[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Millswood loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]610[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif][b]725[/b][/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Millswood loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]610[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]721[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Millswood[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]611[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]720[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Unley Park[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]613[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]718[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Mitcham loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]615[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif][b]715[/b][/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Mitcham loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]615[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]711[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Torrens Park[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]617[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]709[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Lynton[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]619[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]707[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Sleeps Hill loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]620[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif][b]705[/b][/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Sleeps Hill loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]620[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]705[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Eden Hills[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]624[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]702[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Eden Hills loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]626[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif][b]700[/b][/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Eden Hills loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]630[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]700[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Coromandel[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]634[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]657[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Blackwood loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]636[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif][b]655[/b][/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Blackwood loop A/D[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]640[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#00b050][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]655[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][tr][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]Belair[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]645[/font][/size][/color][/td][td][color=#000000][size=2][font=Calibri, sans-serif]650[/font][/size][/color][/td][/tr][/table]
This is my draft belair line timetable, designed for a 15 minute frequency but with the permanent closure of the Mile End, Glenalta, and Pinera stations.
[/size][/color]
  62430 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Metro Adelaide
STATION DOWN UP
Adelaide 601 734
Mile End Cross A/D 603 733
Wayville 607 728
Goodwood 609 727
Millswood loop A/D 610 725
Millswood loop A/D 610 721
Millswood 611 720
Unley Park 613 718
Mitcham loop A/D 615 715
Mitcham loop A/D 615 711
Torrens Park 617 709
Lynton 619 707
Sleeps Hill loop A/D 620 705
Sleeps Hill loop A/D 620 705
Eden Hills 624 702
Eden Hills loop A/D 626 700
Eden Hills loop A/D 630 700
Coromandel 634 657
Blackwood loop A/D 636 655
Blackwood loop A/D 640 655
Belair 645 650

This is my draft belair line timetable, designed for a 15 minute frequency but with the permanent closure of the Mile End, Glenalta, and Pinera stations.
Gayspie
Your post displayed with the BBL tags uninterpreted.

Edit: Strangely your post when quoted in my reply displayed as table.
Why eliminate Mile End which is double track?  Also your crossing timings mean that if the second train is late, the first train will be delayed.  In the present timetable the crossing timings are more generous and are arranged to have trains in the non peak direction waiting and in the peak direction run through.
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
Thanks to 62430 for making that actually intelligible.

No one aside from absolute necessity is going to use that service.

Why on earth would you want to have net increase in journey time?


Why does a ‘peak’ up service lose 8 minutes AT BEST to a down service?

Also, you’ve not factored in the coffee stop out front of the nRAH either, so that’s the best part of a quarter hour wasted, I’d drive in.
  Gayspie Deputy Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
This timetable is designed to be both clockface and to give each direction an equal journey time.

You are right that yes if the passing train is late due to heavy loadings, wheelchair access, speed restrictions, etc. then the waiting train will be delayed but that is accounted for with the four minute catch up waiting time at the next crossing loop.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

What an odd suggestion. Providing less service by closing three good stations*, making the service prone to delays spiralling out of control and making services slower is not going to attract people to use public transport.

If you're getting up towards 15 minutes wasted with sitting around at loops, the advantage of having a higher frequency is almost completely wiped out.

A better move for improve the Belair line would be to close the Grange line and cascade the cars to provide Belair with extra peak capacity.


* According to Heath, Glenalta and Pinera contribute 10% of patronage. This puts them pretty close to the average for the line, given they are 14% (2/14) of the stations other than Adelaide.
  62430 Assistant Commissioner

Location: Metro Adelaide
What an odd suggestion. Providing less service by closing three good stations*, making the service prone to delays spiralling out of control and making services slower is not going to attract people to use public transport.

If you're getting up towards 15 minutes wasted with sitting around at loops, the advantage of having a higher frequency is almost completely wiped out.

A better move for improve the Belair line would be to close the Grange line and cascade the cars to provide Belair with extra peak capacity.


* According to Heath, Glenalta and Pinera contribute 10% of patronage. This puts them pretty close to the average for the line, given they are 14% (2/14) of the stations other than Adelaide.
justapassenger
Is Pinera platform long enough to take 3 car sets?
  ARG706 Chief Commissioner

Location: SA
A better move for improve the Belair line would be to close the Grange line and cascade the cars to provide Belair with extra peak capacity.
justapassenger


So what happens with the 3000s that will be surplus as a result of the Gawler line electrification? Just scrap them in lieu of boosting capacity, at the Grange line's expense?
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
A better move for improve the Belair line would be to close the Grange line and cascade the cars to provide Belair with extra peak capacity.


So what happens with the 3000s that will be surplus as a result of the Gawler line electrification? Just scrap them in lieu of boosting capacity, at the Grange line's expense?
ARG706
Exactly, they could be cascaded to the remaining diesel services. They've just spent a fortune on replacing the diesel engines... why scrap them?
  Aaron The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: University of Adelaide SA
This timetable is designed to be both clockface and to give each direction an equal journey time.

You are right that yes if the passing train is late due to heavy loadings, wheelchair access, speed restrictions, etc. then the waiting train will be delayed but that is accounted for with the four minute catch up waiting time at the next crossing loop.
Gayspie
You’ve not done that at all.

You’ve timetabled an up departure from Millswood at 725, the exact minute the down is supposed to arrive, suppose that down is 2 minutes, 4 minutes, 6 minutes late, what time will your up service depart? And post coffee stop at nRAH how late will it be to ARS?
  Gayspie Deputy Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
What an odd suggestion. Providing less service by closing three good stations*, making the service prone to delays spiralling out of control and making services slower is not going to attract people to use public transport.

If you're getting up towards 15 minutes wasted with sitting around at loops, the advantage of having a higher frequency is almost completely wiped out.

A better move for improve the Belair line would be to close the Grange line and cascade the cars to provide Belair with extra peak capacity.


* According to Heath, Glenalta and Pinera contribute 10% of patronage. This puts them pretty close to the average for the line, given they are 14% (2/14) of the stations other than Adelaide.
"justapassenger"


Glenalta and Pinera have very low patronage compared to other Belair line stations.
Glenalta and Pinera are located in the opposite general direction of travel on the line.
Glenalta and Pinera will soon require costly upgrades to meet disability standards.
Glenalta and Pinera being kept open for a 15 minute service would require an extra passing loop to be constructed of which there is no room to do so at any point on the line beyond blackwood.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Glenalta and Pinera have very low patronage compared to other Belair line stations.
Gayspie
Nonsense.

Your own "statistics" show they are holding their own and providing quite reasonable numbers. If you take out the big numbers at Blackwood and Coromandel which come from those stations' large park and ride usage, I bet that Glenalta and Pinera would be above average for the rest of the route's stations.

Pinera is much closer to the centre of Belair than the Belair station, so perhaps it's Belair that should be closed. Find an alternative for overnight stabling, shorten the broad gauge and allow ARTC to extend their crossing loop to cater for 1800m trains.

Glenalta and Pinera are located in the opposite general direction of travel on the line.
Gayspie
And yet they still attract quite reasonable passenger numbers. Maybe there are benefits to them that a swamp dwelling Grange line user like you can't appreciate.

Glenalta and Pinera will soon require costly upgrades to meet disability standards.
Gayspie
Source?

My impression is that existing stations are deemed to be compliant with the DDA if they met the standards in place at the time they were built (or last rebuilt) and will only require upgrades to current standards next time they are rebuilt.

Until they are upgraded, I would suggest that providing free access cabs to those who require them in the area would be an acceptable accomodation to help everyone in the area. Passengers who need upgraded access get their transport needs met and passengers who can use the stations in their current format don't get punished = everyone wins.

Glenalta and Pinera being kept open for a 15 minute service would require an extra passing loop to be constructed of which there is no room to do so at any point on the line beyond blackwood.
Gayspie
Then stick to the existing service of 2 trains per hour and peak extras, instead of replacing it with your downgraded service.

A better move for improve the Belair line would be to close the Grange line and cascade the cars to provide Belair with extra peak capacity.
So what happens with the 3000s that will be surplus as a result of the Gawler line electrification? Just scrap them in lieu of boosting capacity, at the Grange line's expense?
ARG706
The Grange suggestion was largely tongue in cheek, though the potential net gain in patronage of switching from 2tph Grange-City and 2tph Outer Harbor over to 3-4tph Outer Harbor and a Woodville-Grange shuttle should be investigated.

When the A-City fleet is introduced to Adelaide-Salisbury and then extended to Gawler later next year, the 3000s released should not be scrapped. The first priority should be to stop sweating the assets and get the whole fleet back to the regular preventative maintenance regime (the regular one, not the newly increased warranty coverage with increased charges calculated for hard running) and only then look at increasing capacity after that.

If they are looked after properly, they'll last much longer and allow the difficult decisions on whether to refurbish/electrify/convert/close to be made at a time when further technology developments will provide more options.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
...

If they are looked after properly, they'll last much longer and allow the difficult decisions on whether to refurbish/electrify/convert/close to be made at a time when further technology developments will provide more options.
justapassenger...
Mt. Barker to Virginia via Adelaide station? I think its inevitable that they'll have to have at least one standard gauge path into Adelaide station.
  62440 Chief Commissioner

...
Mt. Barker to Virginia via Adelaide station? I think its inevitable that they'll have to have at least one standard gauge path into Adelaide station.
don_dunstan
Travelling from Irun to Madrid, the train ran through a shed at about 20 k/h without stopping and changed gauge from Iberian 1524 to standard gauge. One at Parklands and one at Dry Creek would probably be cheaper than putting dual gauge into ARS
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
...
Mt. Barker to Virginia via Adelaide station? I think its inevitable that they'll have to have at least one standard gauge path into Adelaide station.
Travelling from Irun to Madrid, the train ran through a shed at about 20 k/h without stopping and changed gauge from Iberian 1524 to standard gauge. One at Parklands and one at Dry Creek would probably be cheaper than putting dual gauge into ARS
62440
It's literally only a few km's of dual gauge that would required.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from:   

Quick Reply

We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.