http://www.wired.co.uk/article/UK-lockdown

And what has our Premier been saying
"5 minutes of sunshine"
I reckon he's on the money

They UK has far, far, far more cases and their lockdown is nowhere near comparable to what we are doing here...they still even have restaurants and pubs open.

Lockdowns in Europe are geared towards keeping the health systems from collapsing, not eliminating the virus, so they are not comparable.

No one is going so hard for so few cases as Melbourne. The only reason I think we are doing this now is to get into line with the other Australian states so they are willing to reopen borders. There isn't much of a health justification for doing what we are doing.

Although if the situation in Britain becomes a lot worse, they will have to impose a national lockdown, at least that is what I am reading, the deaths and the hospitalizations aren't there at the moment in U.K, but they are going up in other parts of Europe so I understand, wait and see what happens over there I guess, but I certainly do agree that lockdowns should only be used when health systems can't cope.

And I'm still annoyed with the final episode of game of thrones

Friends in the UK are just waiting to get it.. They want to be here
Is this right that only 8% of the UK  population has had covid? '
abc news radio'

Local lockdowns for years to come
well that's not ideal

herd immunity not real and impossible to achieve

Of course we need to align with the other states that is the point

It may be the point, but I haven't actually heard the political class articulate this as the main driving factor. It has always been "to keep people safe."

If Dan Andrews came out and said "we are only doing this because the other states will keep us in isolation if we don't" my opinion of him would be raised.

I don't like the scare tactics and many people don't. Just be honest about the reasoning.

The political class won't say that, but that seems to be the goal, we will see when thay pat themselves on the back
Honestly not their strong point

And the economic recovery begins

Eh...we haven't even hit the bottom of this rescission yet, not even close...there is going to be months and months of pain ahead.

The Stage 4 extension has been the nail in the coffin of many local small businesses around where I live: many For Lease signs are now popping up on commercial real-estate and I am starting to hear of redundancies in some of the industries my friends and I am involved with.

Most importantly, JobKeeper hasn't been withdrawn yet and the loan holidays are still in effect. They they wind up, we could be in a world of hurt.

I think the risk of a depression has passed but we are in for a long and deep recession with a slow recovery. It is just beginning, the worst is yet to come and it is going to be nasty.

This is true, it will be a long and hard road back that is for sure, especially for Victoria, let's just hope and pray that there are no further lockdowns in ANY other state, otherwise the situation will be 3x4 more worse than it is now, (if that's possible)

Even Julian Burnside reckons Dan Andrew's gone too far:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8758579/Daniel-Andrews-demands-extraordinary-new-law-let-government-officials-arrest-Victorians.html

Seriously though, Dan is turning the place into a police/surveillance state.

Of course we need to align with the other states that is the point

Tell that to the Peoples Republic of Westralia...They don't give a flying feck what other states are doing, or the damage their actions are causing to others.

Of course we need to align with the other states that is the point

Tell that to the Peoples Republic of Westralia...They don't give a flying feck what other states are doing, or the damage their actions are causing to others.

Because they have always had this ambition to break away from the rest of Australia and keep all their mining taxes / royalties to themselves.

At the moment their testing the waters to just see how they go.

Yeah sorry about that

And the economic recovery begins


Frankston Hospital To Deliver Better Care And Local Jobs
The Victorian Government is getting on with the massive $562 million expansion of the Frankston Hospital – to provide world-class healthcare for local families and create hundreds of jobs in Melbourne’s south-east.


And this

Extra Upgrades For Victoria’s Public Aged Care Facilities
The Victorian Government is upgrading more than 50 public sector residential aged care services, delivering hundreds of new jobs and ensuring thousands of older Victorians continue to get the care and comfort they deserve.

Premier Daniel Andrews and Minister for Disability, Ageing and Carers Luke Donnellan today announced $30 million in funding to improve Victoria’s public sector residential aged care services, home to some of our most vulnerable older Victorians.

The package will deliver $20 million to upgrade 33 facilities that collectively operate 1,787 aged care beds – including 267 beds that are dedicated to supporting the mental health of older Victorians.

This includes $15 million shared by 17 metropolitan facilities to upgrade buildings, replace infrastructure and improve accessibility for residents and staff.

Another $5 million will see 16 regional facilities also undertake important upgrades, including installing new flooring, refurbishing communal living areas and replacing equipment.


Melton residents also should benefit from a new hospital at cobblebank soonish mentioned by Steve bracks several days ago

It's a start

And Melton residents

Where is the money for all this coming from? Is the budget in surplus or are we borrowing to pay for it?

Don't be fooled by all the talk of governments borrowing at low interest rates, it is still borrowed money that has to be paid back.

Debt whether it be used for painting rock gardens or aged care beds is still debt that needs repaying. And with a diminished tax base due to the number of businesses closed it will just go on and on and on

And what happens when the Govmit have built all the hostipals, town halls, roads to nowhere, rail lines for empty trains to run on etc etc etc?

There will still be empty shops where once viable businesses stood, businesses who paid taxes that were used to pay down debt and employed staff who paid income tax.

You cannot sustain an economy on government spending. Just look at the Eurozone PIGS if you want an example of how well that goes.

Even Julian Burnside reckons Dan Andrew's gone too far:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8758579/Daniel-Andrews-demands-extraordinary-new-law-let-government-officials-arrest-Victorians.html

Seriously though, Dan is turning the place into a police/surveillance state.

Well at least you have Boris and Donald to look up to.

Donald - 200,000 and still counting.

I'd prefer the US death rate (not toll, rate), a fully open country and a fully functional, even if it isn't a 'normal' economy than what we have now. 0.062% of the population has died from COVID in the US to date. In the UK it is also 0.062% of their population. Applying that %age to us gives ~15,800 deaths from it here.
Tragic as each death is, we lose half that number every year from lung cancer, the vast majority of which is caused by voluntary smoking and the Governments do diddly-squat about that.

The imposition of border closures, arresting of little-oid-ladies in the park and having a sworn police officer telling a clearly pregnant woman she can't sit down to rest while exercising is absurd. Oh, and there's also Comrade Dan's newfound favourite criminal offence, incitement. Because now not only is protesting illegal, discussing plans about a protest is also illegal....

More Rocket Surgery from the Victorian Public Service at the inquiry this time courtesy of Department of Health and Human Services (DHHS) secretary Kym Peake;

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/hotel-quarantine-inquiry-told-departmental-boss-not-responsible/12690694

"We had sole responsibility but there was shared accountability," she said"

Public Service Speak 101. Translation; "We stuffed it up, but if I'm going down the gurgler I'll be bloody sure to take a few more with me."

I don't want that happening here.

That's at the core of the issue for you though isn't it Valvegear. You're not 20 or 30 and starting out in life so having business shut down or losing your job doesn't affect you anyway.

A bit of honesty would be nice.

Could you please explain where I have been dishonest? I've expressed a wish; that seems honest to me.

You have no job - not one that you're dependent on anyway. You don't have a small business. You're not trying to build a future for yourself or starting out in life like young Victorians are. You just want to preserve your own life, you have no interest whatsoever in how many people's livelihoods have to be destroyed in order to get that done.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell isn't it?

You have no job - not one that you're dependent on anyway. You don't have a small business. You're not trying to build a future for yourself or starting out in life like young Victorians are. You just want to preserve your own life, you have no interest whatsoever in how many people's livelihoods have to be destroyed in order to get that done.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell isn't it?

Nearly but not quite.  I am a Sole Trader, but where have I said anything dishonest?

Lesson in English from Oxford:-

"Dishonest:  Fraudulent, insincere . . ."

"Selfish: Deficient in consideration for others, thinking chiefly of one's own personal profit or pleasure . . ."

Instead of your customary yell of "semantics", look again. My statement was not fraudulent, and was definitely sincere.

You may well consider me selfish and that doesn't bother me because you don't know what I think and your opinion is irrelevant. Your misuse of "honesty" doesn't bother me either because it is completely wrong, and again, what you think doesn't matter.

It's just nice to hold you to account for your continuing misuse of the Queen's English.

I don't want that happening here.

That's at the core of the issue for you though isn't it Valvegear. You're not 20 or 30 and starting out in life so having business shut down or losing your job doesn't affect you anyway.

A bit of honesty would be nice.

Could you please explain where I have been dishonest? I've expressed a wish; that seems honest to me.

You have no job - not one that you're dependent on anyway. You don't have a small business. You're not trying to build a future for yourself or starting out in life like young Victorians are. You just want to preserve your own life, you have no interest whatsoever in how many people's livelihoods have to be destroyed in order to get that done.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell isn't it?

There you go again, ascribing feelings to people that they don't have, face it Don, you've done nothing but whinge and whine ever since this whole thing started! did you know that it's the same in the whole world, not just here? world leaders are grappling with how to get a handle on this, until a vaccine comes along, countries will have to deal with this the best they can.

There you go again, ascribing feelings to people that they don't have, face it Don, you've done nothing but whinge and whine ever since this whole thing started! did you know that it's the same in the whole world, not just here? world leaders are grappling with how to get a handle on this, until a vaccine comes along, countries will have to deal with this the best they can.

And that's the issue right there, innit? There is no vaccine. There may never be a vaccine...The sooner we accept we will have to live with this Pestilence as best we can, the better off our economy and by default the nation and her (our) futures will be. There will be outbreaks. People will get sick. People will unfortunately die. But destroying the nation's future means the response to COVID is worse than COVID itself.

But for what we have done so far we might as well go back and tear up Federation, because apart from all paying the the GST, there's stuff all else we have in common anymore.

"We had sole responsibility but there was shared accountability," she said"

Public Service Speak 101. Translation; "We stuffed it up, but if I'm going down the gurgler I'll be bloody sure to take a few more with me."

Sir Humphrey's verbosity at least made sense.

I must be getting old. During my working career, Ministers, Heads of Branches, Departmental Secretaries etc all at least looked old enough to make most of those supposedly in charge of the shambles we face today look like work experience schoolkids.

Given the formal nature of the Inquiry and the season in Melbourne Peake's sleeveless outfit seems to display a 'Territorial' outlook to the whole thing.

If you want a scare look them up on Linkedin.

There you go again, ascribing feelings to people that they don't have, face it Don, you've done nothing but whinge and whine ever since this whole thing started! did you know that it's the same in the whole world, not just here? world leaders are grappling with how to get a handle on this, until a vaccine comes along, countries will have to deal with this the best they can.

And that's the issue right there, innit? There is no vaccine. There may never be a vaccine...The sooner we accept we will have to live with this Pestilence as best we can, the better off our economy and by default the nation and her (our) futures will be. There will be outbreaks. People will get sick. People will unfortunately die. But destroying the nation's future means the response to COVID is worse than COVID itself.

But for what we have done so far we might as well go back and tear up Federation, because apart from all paying the the GST, there's stuff all else we have in common anymore.

There will hopefully be a vaccine, the Astrazeneca Vaccine is looking very promising at the moment, and, if that one does not work out, there are other companies doing their darndest to get one.  I agree with you it's all about managing to live with it the best we can, yes there will indeed be outbreaks, but if you have the correct contact tracing teams in place, living with it should be easy, it's only when you have a massive outbreak of it that it becomes a problem.

I don't want that happening here.

That's at the core of the issue for you though isn't it Valvegear. You're not 20 or 30 and starting out in life so having business shut down or losing your job doesn't affect you anyway.

A bit of honesty would be nice.

Could you please explain where I have been dishonest? I've expressed a wish; that seems honest to me.

You have no job - not one that you're dependent on anyway. You don't have a small business. You're not trying to build a future for yourself or starting out in life like young Victorians are. You just want to preserve your own life, you have no interest whatsoever in how many people's livelihoods have to be destroyed in order to get that done.

That's pretty much it in a nutshell isn't it?

Do not forget that in the last 30 odd years many/most younger people were 'Jeffed' in one way or another through privatisation, closures, off shoring, takeovers, so called free trade etc etc. It has not all been plain sailing. Many have been 'Jeffed' more than once.
Of course the current situation is tragically worse for so many but it is not correct to say that everyone has sailed through life on the basis that it seems so many in the senior levels Victorian Government and Public Service have and continue to do so hiding behind 'I don't remember that'. The Peter Principle seems to be the sole criterium for so many promotions. Flotsam floats doesn't it?

There you go again, ascribing feelings to people that they don't have, face it Don, you've done nothing but whinge and whine ever since this whole thing started! did you know that it's the same in the whole world, not just here? world leaders are grappling with how to get a handle on this, until a vaccine comes along, countries will have to deal with this the best they can.

And that's the issue right there, innit? There is no vaccine. There may never be a vaccine...The sooner we accept we will have to live with this Pestilence as best we can, the better off our economy and by default the nation and her (our) futures will be. There will be outbreaks. People will get sick. People will unfortunately die. But destroying the nation's future means the response to COVID is worse than COVID itself.

But for what we have done so far we might as well go back and tear up Federation, because apart from all paying the the GST, there's stuff all else we have in common anymore.

Sad but oh so very true.

Of course we need to align with the other states that is the point

It may be the point, but I haven't actually heard the political class articulate this as the main driving factor. It has always been "to keep people safe."

If Dan Andrews came out and said "we are only doing this because the other states will keep us in isolation if we don't" my opinion of him would be raised.

I don't like the scare tactics and many people don't. Just be honest about the reasoning.

'... It may be the point, but I haven't actually heard the political class articulate this as the main driving factor. It has always been "to keep people safe."

You haven't heard it because it hasn't been said. It's only been 'I'm all right the rest of you can get stuffed' where Queensland, in particular, has just prostituted itself. If you have money you can do what you like but if you are sick or in need of compassion you can just bugger off.
Wasn't there a 'Brisbane Line' or some such during WW 2 where the rest of a United Australia pitched in to keep the Japs out.

Victoria is moving deeper and deeper into crisis.
-  The political party behind the government been placed into administration because of fraudulent membership activity.
- The Premier is using the cover of COVID 19 and the sweetener of a couple of small lockdown concessions to pass draconian detention laws, never before dreamt of in Australia.
- The Hotel Inquiry is proving that Government Ministers and Public Servants are totally inept, and unfit to run this State.
- The Premier now holds the view that he doesn’t have to answer questions from the press, if the obvious answer is at odds with his personal doctrine.

Meanwhile the ALP faithful continue to lick the boots of their esteemed leader.  Most of them are either on welfare, are dyed-in-the-wool unionists, have come from war-torn areas and think Victoria is heaven, or have lived by the left wing rule that they are entitled to do as little work possible for the maximum amount of remuneration that they can screw out of their employers or the Government. They have always let other people do their thinking for them as they lack the ability to think for themselves.

It’s time for all clear thinking people to evacuate the State of Victoria, before you get detained by an Authorised Officer of Dan, who may just happen to live in your neighbourhood.