FEDS & STATE JOINTLY FINANCE FURTHER VICTORIAN REGIONAL RAIL WORKS

 
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

Announced by Deputy PM Mon 05/10/20 jointly funded works by Feds & Victoria as immediate employment creating projects :

- Northern Victorian Passenger Service Upgrade  Feds $ 7.5m  Victoria $ 7.5m = $ 15m probably Echuca Line speed upgrade
- Stage - 3 Shepparton Line upgrade to run V/Locity at 130kmh  Feds $ 320m  Vic $ 80m =  $ 400m
- Stage - 2 Warrnambool Line track upgrade to allow V/locity at 130kmh  Feds 208m  Victoria $ 52m =  $ 260m
- Stage - 2 South Geelong - Waurn Ponds duplication bought forward Federal funding of $ 605m to allow early start follow on from Stage - 1 second platform and 900m loop currently underway at Waurn Ponds.

No word on Murray Basin standardization. Ruperts HUN reports Victoria wants an el cheapo solution, where as the Feds want the 'full monty" on a 50/50 basis. So apparently a Mexican standoff at the moment.

Victoria will need to pull finger out as contracts still not let after 4 1/2 years for the originally announced Bendigo/Echuca and Gippsland line works.

Melbourne suburbia rail and tram wise we will have to wait till budget night Tuesday 06/10/20

Sponsored advertisement

  Greensleeves Chief Commissioner

Location: If it isn't obvious by now, it should be.
Announced by Deputy PM Mon 05/10/20 jointly funded works by Feds & Victoria as immediate employment creating projects :

- Northern Victorian Passenger Service Upgrade  Feds $ 7.5m  Victoria $ 7.5m = $ 15m probably Echuca Line speed upgrade
- Stage - 3 Shepparton Line upgrade to run V/Locity at 130kmh  Feds $ 320m  Vic $ 80m =  $ 400m
- Stage - 2 Warrnambool Line track upgrade to allow V/locity at 130kmh  Feds 208m  Victoria $ 52m =  $ 260m
- Stage - 2 South Geelong - Waurn Ponds duplication bought forward Federal funding of $ 605m to allow early start follow on from Stage - 1 second platform and 900m loop currently underway at Waurn Ponds.

No word on Murray Basin standardization. Ruperts HUN reports Victoria wants an el cheapo solution, where as the Feds want the 'full monty" on a 50/50 basis. So apparently a Mexican standoff at the moment.

Victoria will need to pull finger out as contracts still not let after 4 1/2 years for the originally announced Bendigo/Echuca and Gippsland line works.

Melbourne suburbia rail and tram wise we will have to wait till budget night Tuesday 06/10/20
kuldalai

The logical thing to do with the Echuca line is put a signal in at Epsom to allow them to run a train south from Echuca (*or a grain from Elmore) while there's a Vlocity at or going to Epsom station. As it is currently, they can't send a train south from Elmore if there's an Epsom Vlo hanging around. Same goes for the Swan Hill line with Eaglehawk Vlo's.
  justarider Chief Commissioner

Location: Free at last, free at last
The logical thing to do with the Echuca line is put a signal in at Epsom to allow them to run a train south from Echuca (*or a grain from Elmore) while there's a Vlocity at or going to Epsom station. As it is currently, they can't send a train south from Elmore if there's an Epsom Vlo hanging around. Same goes for the Swan Hill line with Eaglehawk Vlo's.
"Greensleeves"

Electronic Train Ordering (ETO) - whatever that is,
Is on the todo list already.
https://regionalrailrevival.vic.gov.au/bendigoechuca

cheers
John
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Announced by Deputy PM Mon 05/10/20 jointly funded works by Feds & Victoria as immediate employment creating projects :

- Northern Victorian Passenger Service Upgrade  Feds $ 7.5m  Victoria $ 7.5m = $ 15m probably Echuca Line speed upgrade
- Stage - 3 Shepparton Line upgrade to run V/Locity at 130kmh  Feds $ 320m  Vic $ 80m =  $ 400m
- Stage - 2 Warrnambool Line track upgrade to allow V/locity at 130kmh  Feds 208m  Victoria $ 52m =  $ 260m
- Stage - 2 South Geelong - Waurn Ponds duplication bought forward Federal funding of $ 605m to allow early start follow on from Stage - 1 second platform and 900m loop currently underway at Waurn Ponds.
kuldalai

A nice bunch of work there and something which will benefit regional areas and assist with on time running.  Still $400m for the shepparton line seems overkill should be $100m as what really needs to be done to bring the line up to that speed?  Someone please tell us.

I always get the feeling Victoria bundles other money into a project when it goes up to the feds and this is why we miss out.

$605m for a second track over what distance and some signalling?  Seriously?

What the extra money for Echuca?  This has been announced so many times I have lost count.

Disappointed not to see carbon emissions not being taken seriously.  Where is the electrification work for the Geelong Line connected with the double track work south of Geelong station?
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Announced by Deputy PM Mon 05/10/20 jointly funded works by Feds & Victoria as immediate employment creating projects :

- Northern Victorian Passenger Service Upgrade  Feds $ 7.5m  Victoria $ 7.5m = $ 15m probably Echuca Line speed upgrade
- Stage - 3 Shepparton Line upgrade to run V/Locity at 130kmh  Feds $ 320m  Vic $ 80m =  $ 400m
- Stage - 2 Warrnambool Line track upgrade to allow V/locity at 130kmh  Feds 208m  Victoria $ 52m =  $ 260m
- Stage - 2 South Geelong - Waurn Ponds duplication bought forward Federal funding of $ 605m to allow early start follow on from Stage - 1 second platform and 900m loop currently underway at Waurn Ponds.

A nice bunch of work there and something which will benefit regional areas and assist with on time running.  Still $400m for the shepparton line seems overkill should be $100m as what really needs to be done to bring the line up to that speed?  Someone please tell us.

I always get the feeling Victoria bundles other money into a project when it goes up to the feds and this is why we miss out.

$605m for a second track over what distance and some signalling?  Seriously?

What the extra money for Echuca?  This has been announced so many times I have lost count.
bevans
Shepp line upgrade is likely to include Donnybrook to Seymour line upgrade to Class 2M as mentioned elsewhere, along with the likely retirement of the Double-line Block (Absolute Block atm really) signaling in this section.

The Echuca line was found to be in much worse shape than they originally thought (it's only just had 20km of 50 km/h TSRs lifted!).  Thus the delay and need for extra $$$ apparently....
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia

The Echuca line was found to be in much worse shape than they originally thought (it's only just had 20km of 50 km/h TSRs lifted!).  Thus the delay and need for extra $$$ apparently....
Carnot

It sounds like a maintenance circus in V/Line.
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner


The Echuca line was found to be in much worse shape than they originally thought (it's only just had 20km of 50 km/h TSRs lifted!).  Thus the delay and need for extra $$$ apparently....
It sounds like a maintenance circus in V/Line.
bevans
The issues here are three fold it seems:

1. Sufficient $ funds are not being given to maintain adequate standards to maintain pax network to existing track classes and max train speeds, and ditto on the freight only lines which get the crumbs and therefore caught up in a perpetual cycle of on going claimed track upgrades to make them fit for traffic. In reality NOT upgrades at all just catch up maintenance.
(e;g: Toolamba - Echuca out of service yet again - facing its third "upgrade" within 10 years to the same low speed standard !!!)

2. Should VLP be maintaining tracks at all ?  Is VLP a value for money maintenance provider ?  If not outsource to get best bang for buck.

3. VLP as operator has now decreed that as newer V/Locity sets have a slightly heavier axle loads that Class-2M track requiring 53kg/107lb rail is now required for V/Locity operation at 130kmh. One would think that DOT would be setting these standards (NOT the rail operators)  based on external expert advice using world standards found elsewhere on railways both Australian and International.

Thus the current VLP driven requirement for Warrnambool line to be upgraded to Class-2Mtrack to allow V/Locity 130kmh.
Shepparton track rail is quite aged and well in need of renewal. So put in new 53kg CWR rail NOW and spend $ 30m on actual new rail rather than on a totally unnecessary business case to tell you the existing rail has limited life remaining.
Echuca rail is not that bad on good quality sleepers and adequate ballast as Class- 3 traclk should well be OK for V/Locity at 100kmh minimum, or upgarde to Class-2 allowing V/Locity at 115kmh.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Echuca rail is not that bad on good quality sleepers and adequate ballast as Class- 3 traclk should well be OK for V/Locity at 100kmh minimum, or upgarde to Class-2 allowing V/Locity at 115kmh.
kuldalai
The Echuca to Elmore section isn't too bad apparently.  It's the Elmore to Nth Bendigo section that seems to get whacked with TSRs every time the IEV100 runs over it....  They did a sleeper replacement of life-expired units and a tamp to get the most recent TSRs removed.  Rumour has it that this section might need re-railing too.
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

Echuca rail is not that bad on good quality sleepers and adequate ballast as Class- 3 traclk should well be OK for V/Locity at 100kmh minimum, or upgarde to Class-2 allowing V/Locity at 115kmh.
The Echuca to Elmore section isn't too bad apparently.  It's the Elmore to Nth Bendigo section that seems to get whacked with TSRs every time the IEV100 runs over it....  They did a sleeper replacement of life-expired units and a tamp to get the most recent TSRs removed.  Rumour has it that this section might need re-railing too.
Carnot
94lb rail in that section if welded should be quite ok for DMU up to 115kmh.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia

The Echuca line was found to be in much worse shape than they originally thought (it's only just had 20km of 50 km/h TSRs lifted!).  Thus the delay and need for extra $$$ apparently....
It sounds like a maintenance circus in V/Line.The issues here are three fold it seems:

1. Sufficient $ funds are not being given to maintain adequate standards to maintain pax network to existing track classes and max train speeds, and ditto on the freight only lines which get the crumbs and therefore caught up in a perpetual cycle of on going claimed track upgrades to make them fit for traffic. In reality NOT upgrades at all just catch up maintenance.
(e;g: Toolamba - Echuca out of service yet again - facing its third "upgrade" within 10 years to the same low speed standard !!!)
kuldalai

During the time since suspended and the reopening of the line what maintenance cycles were approved and observed?
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Guys if there are no objections should we use this thread to discuss the budget tonight?
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
treasurer has just announced you guessed it $2b in road improvements.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Digging through the documents so far, no mention of Murray Basin Rail. There might be more after 8:30pm in the portfolio releases...
  Carnot Minister for Railways

And what I see so far seems to be very skewed towards roads. Sad.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Josh Frydenberg will bank on a $74bn jobs and tax stimulus plan including tax cuts for 11 million Australians, $200-a week wage subsidies for new workers and $35bn in business tax breaks to restore the economy to pre-COVID levels next year and drive down the jobless rate.

Delivering a budget promising a shorter road to economic recovery and $17bn back into the pockets of taxpayers, the Treasurer revealed that government spending in response to the pandemic had now reached an unprecedented $507bn.
The government will move immediately to pass its personal income and corporate tax plan in a $74bn JobMaker omnibus bill to be put to parliament on Wednesday claiming it would underpin the creation of 950,000 jobs over the next four years.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Australia's debt levels (govt) will reach $1.7t by the end of the decade.  These numbers we used to talk about 20 years ago were in the realm of USA foreign debt.  Not anymore.
  Galron Chief Commissioner

Location: Werribee, Vic
Australia's debt levels (govt) will reach $1.7t by the end of the decade.  These numbers we used to talk about 20 years ago were in the realm of USA foreign debt.  Not anymore.
bevans
With tax cuts and no tax increases this deficit will be a problem for the next generation. now is not the time to increase taxes, as long as they plan to later. but this is more a topic for the lounge than here.

A shame no money apparently for Murray basin rail. One suspects the state government is playing hardball, so the feds are saying it's our way or the high way.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
The budget also relies on some crazy assumptions including 4.75% economic growth in 18 months time.  I cannot see the budget working the way they would like unless confidence in business and people rises.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Full list here (includes items since 2013/4):
https://minister.infrastructure.gov.au/mccormack/media-release/infrastructure-investment-laying-foundations-australias-economic-recovery

A few numbers seem very different to original ones from memory. And a big chunk hasn't been spent at all, just 'promised'....
  John.Z Assistant Commissioner

No need to be worried about Gov Debt as a number in isolation, what I worry about is the ratio of debt to GDP, which is still amongst the lowest in OCED countries which is what we want. Grow the GDP to dwarf the debt. The cost of debt is quite low (less than 1%) which is the perfect time to increase it. If interests rates are lower or equal to inflation, then it's basically like afterpay but for government spending, the true cost to tax payers is any interest paid above inflation, which right now is minimal.
  skitz Chief Commissioner

Echuca rail is not that bad on good quality sleepers and adequate ballast as Class- 3 traclk should well be OK for V/Locity at 100kmh minimum, or upgarde to Class-2 allowing V/Locity at 115kmh.
The Echuca to Elmore section isn't too bad apparently.  It's the Elmore to Nth Bendigo section that seems to get whacked with TSRs every time the IEV100 runs over it....  They did a sleeper replacement of life-expired units and a tamp to get the most recent TSRs removed.  Rumour has it that this section might need re-railing too.
94lb rail in that section if welded should be quite ok for DMU up to 115kmh.
kuldalai


Bit more to it than rail size.  For example WestNet ran the Prospector at 160km/hr on 47kg rail.  It aslo had full conrete at 1800 per km too.  There is also the welding, rail stress and teting regimes that are in place to allow this too.
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

Australia's debt levels (govt) will reach $1.7t by the end of the decade.  These numbers we used to talk about 20 years ago were in the realm of USA foreign debt.  Not anymore.
With tax cuts and no tax increases this deficit will be a problem for the next generation. now is not the time to increase taxes, as long as they plan to later. but this is more a topic for the lounge than here.

A shame no money apparently for Murray basin rail. One suspects the state government is playing hardball, so the feds are saying it's our way or the high way.
Galron
In the face of no Federal funding in tonights Commonwealth budget for Murray Basin standardization , Victoria needs to get moving with re-activating Inglewood  Eaglehawk , facing a bumper grain harvest as if this cross  country link is not re-activated by Victoria thousands of extra road trucks will flood roads for many months to and from ports especially from lack of train capacity on the two broad gauge lines limiting each line currently to only a single grain train a day.

At around $ 30m to re-open as fit for purpose 40 - 50kmh operation it will be totally un-acceptable NOT to adopt the low cost job creation project and save Victorians thousands of road truck movements. The acid is really on the State Government now to act and prove that they are champions of encouraging more freight onto rail, and not just allowing  more of the same in more bulk road haulage when an enviromentally/safer rail freight alternative is readily available at afforable on-going cost.

Ministers saying there are on-going talks with Canberra over Murray Basin totally ignores the issues of lack of current MB capacity , and what happens over the next few years in the face of bumper grain harvests while Victoria and Canberra negotiate a "BLUE HILLS" solution of some sort. Further in the face of good harvests the required window to allow further standardization of the two broad gauge lines will be hard to realize . One needs average to below average harvests to allow further standardization, otherwise even more trucks on roads.

Plus the bonus of shorter trip to/from Melbourne via Bridgewater, for the existing Ultima train, and 100 export containers a week potentially on rail ex Bridgewater (and off roads) by simply attaching to the existing Ultima inter-modal train.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

So we await the State Budget.  That usually follows the Fed Budget by several weeks, although who knows what's going to happen in 2020?

V/line's Annual Report is running a month or two late already.
  Duncs Chief Commissioner


The Echuca line was found to be in much worse shape than they originally thought (it's only just had 20km of 50 km/h TSRs lifted!).  Thus the delay and need for extra $$$ apparently....
It sounds like a maintenance circus in V/Line.The issues here are three fold it seems:

1. Sufficient $ funds are not being given to maintain adequate standards to maintain pax network to existing track classes and max train speeds, and ditto on the freight only lines which get the crumbs and therefore caught up in a perpetual cycle of on going claimed track upgrades to make them fit for traffic. In reality NOT upgrades at all just catch up maintenance.
(e;g: Toolamba - Echuca out of service yet again - facing its third "upgrade" within 10 years to the same low speed standard !!!)

2. Should VLP be maintaining tracks at all ?  Is VLP a value for money maintenance provider ?  If not outsource to get best bang for buck.

3. VLP as operator has now decreed that as newer V/Locity sets have a slightly heavier axle loads that Class-2M track requiring 53kg/107lb rail is now required for V/Locity operation at 130kmh. One would think that DOT would be setting these standards (NOT the rail operators)  based on external expert advice using world standards found elsewhere on railways both Australian and International.

Thus the current VLP driven requirement for Warrnambool line to be upgraded to Class-2Mtrack to allow V/Locity 130kmh.
Shepparton track rail is quite aged and well in need of renewal. So put in new 53kg CWR rail NOW and spend $ 30m on actual new rail rather than on a totally unnecessary business case to tell you the existing rail has limited life remaining.
Echuca rail is not that bad on good quality sleepers and adequate ballast as Class- 3 traclk should well be OK for V/Locity at 100kmh minimum, or upgarde to Class-2 allowing V/Locity at 115kmh.
kuldalai
I would have though 50 kg rail sufficient. It is stronger than 47 kg, and probably as good as the older design 53kg in any case. Sounds like some backside covering at V Line.
  True Believers Chief Commissioner

Looks like a continuation of the regional rail revival agreements made between Federal and State government, hope some suburban rail projects also get some funding too, not just the airport rail link.

Sponsored advertisement

Display from:   

Quick Reply

We've disabled Quick Reply for this thread as it was last updated more than six months ago.