The corona virus COVID-19

 
  emmastreet Train Controller

Location: Goulburn Valley
RTT_Rules  "...if you don't like it, feel free to move to Sweden...."
Another one who does'nt want any criticism of Andrew's and his Gov't.

Sponsored advertisement

  emmastreet Train Controller

Location: Goulburn Valley
[quote=Valvegear][quote=emmastreet]Quite obviously Valvegear's idea of democracy is that we all agree with him
[quote]Not a bit of it; let's have your idea of what democracy means.[/quote [/quote][/quote]Geez Valvegear. Maybe you've been in lockdown too long.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Geez Valvegear. Maybe you've been in lockdown too long.
emmastreet
My apologies for the computer screw up. I won't delete it just so that everybody knows you've read it.

The lockdown hasn't affected me. I understand the need for it and the results speak for themselves.

P.S. I am still waiting for your definition of democracy.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
RTT_Rules  "...if you don't like it, feel free to move to Sweden...."
Another one who does'nt want any criticism of Andrew's and his Gov't.
emmastreet
I think my past position and comments in general against "Dan the Man" and the Socialists south in of the Murry are on record for which I'm sure VG and others will testify to.

My comments were non-political and for the requirement by the current Vic govt to contain and successfully eliminate the virus, which they have clearly achieved. You on the other hand have nothing better to add than a political statement with no realistic alternative suggested other than F-em!
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
The difference here Is the quarantine outbreak was a Melbourne Meto only deserter (Regional Victoria was no real worse off to the rest of Australia)

But all of Victoria had to pay the price, being labeled "Sicktoria" "The Leper Colony"

The rest of Australia was quickly getting back to near normal life.

Victoria is now free of new infections. Rural Victoria recovered sooner than Melbourne metro area.
Queensland's border is still shut; NSW still has new cases;  and so on.
Who the hell cares what some people called Victoria - is that more important than disease control?

But the figure head theory becomes unstuck when the leader starts throwing around captains calls (just like Tony Abbott) and under the extreme powers of "State of Emergency" the leader becomes extremely powerful and virtually unstoppable (he claims that he's taking the advice of the CHO, but no he's clearly twisting the CHO's arm to tell the public what he want's to be told)
Quite obviously you never watched a press conference or, if you did, you had no idea what was happening. Both the CHO and his deputy were extensively questioned and these questions were answered on the spot.  I would like you to put your comment about Andrews twisting the CHO's arm into the public arena, and put your name to it. I think you would probably get away with only three lawsuits for defamation; one each from Daniel Andrews, Brett Sutton and Allen Cheng.

I confess that I am completely at a loss to know what you really want. A once-in-a-lifetime event has hit us; something beyond the experience of any living person. Nobody had ever had to deal with one before, and mistakes were made (not just in Victoria). It has been successfully dealt with in Victoria, but that's not good enough for you. Where did you earn your Diploma of Whingeing?
Valvegear
It's pointless trying to convince a "Stand by Dan" supporter !

What's Dans death and miserly toll ?  (spin spin spin, oh look there's a little birdie)
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
It's pointless trying to convince a "Stand by Dan" supporter !
Nightfire
Let me know when you find one.

Meanwhile, I will continue to deal in facts and you, I presume, will keep up your pointless and repetitious rhetoric because you have no case against the evidence before you.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
It's pointless trying to convince a "Stand by Dan" supporter !
Let me know when you find one.

Meanwhile, I will continue to deal in facts and you, I presume, will keep up your pointless and repetitious rhetoric because you have no case against the evidence before you.
Valvegear
Blar Blar Blar

Let's just kick back and see how things pan out.

Dan's pet new law "Corporate Manslaughter" will be very Interesting (there are people In high places that will stop at nothing)

That so called little mistake would put any other Manager / CEO behind bars (the law applies to the Crown too)
  DirtyBallast Chief Commissioner

Location: Standing at the limit of an endless ocean
It's pointless trying to convince a "Stand by Dan" supporter !
Let me know when you find one.

Meanwhile, I will continue to deal in facts and you, I presume, will keep up your pointless and repetitious rhetoric because you have no case against the evidence before you.
Blar Blar Blar

Let's just kick back and see how things pan out.

Dan's pet new law "Corporate Manslaughter" will be very Interesting (there are people In high places that will stop at nothing)

That so called little mistake would put any other Manager / CEO behind bars (the law applies to the Crown too)
Nightfire
^ You sound as drunk as don_dunstan on a Saturday night! Laughing

Blar blar blar indicates a total dismissiveness of anything that goes against your personal opinion. Blinkers on, earplugs in etc.

Kick back and see how things pan out? Yet you're attacking people?

The law is "Workplace Manslaughter" not 'Corporate Manslaughter" which indicates that you are only interested in the welfare of the top, not the bottom. Just like the TV ad, the law is designed to punish bosses who don't give a f...  If Dan didn't give a f..., then the hotel quarantine system would never have eventuated in Victoria. History will show that thousands of returning travellers were successfully processed in Victoria.

Dan won't be put behind bars because of the thousands of lives that he has saved. You want him in jail? How should his sentence compare to Trump, Johnson and Bolsonaro?
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE

Let's just kick back and see how things pan out.

Dan's pet new law "Corporate Manslaughter" will be very Interesting (there are people In high places that will stop at nothing)

That so called little mistake would put any other Manager / CEO behind bars (the law applies to the Crown too)
Nightfire
So what's your point? What do you want to see done?

- The Opposition didn't call for the Premier to resign
- The ALP didn't call for the Premier to resign
- Once again, was the state's constitution breached? NO
- Was at any time people's "rights" compromised? NO. Some people chose to break the law and they were arrested as they should be.

So why should the Premier resign? But more to the point, right now is this the best time to change leadership in the middle of a crisis when the solution is in hand. If Premier wasn't managing the recovery well you could argue he should go, but rather it was done well. Result is zero cases! Was not that the desired outcome?

A screw up at security, seems small but it had significant consequences, regardless there was only one way to fix it and it was fixed, no one can argue with that.

Do I think the Premier should contest the next election? Probably not, perhaps stepping down in a year or so. Its called time and place.
  emmastreet Train Controller

Location: Goulburn Valley
RTT_Rules  "...if you don't like it, feel free to move to Sweden...."
Another one who does'nt want any criticism of Andrew's and his Gov't.
I think my past position and comments in general against "Dan the Man" and the Socialists south in of the Murry are on record for which I'm sure VG and others will testify to.

My comments were non-political and for the requirement by the current Vic govt to contain and successfully eliminate the virus, which they have clearly achieved. You on the other hand have nothing better to add than a political statement with no realistic alternative suggested other than F-em!
RTT_Rules
So your comments are non- political but mine are political !!
I thought my comments of a few days back suggesting we compare Victoria with the rest of Australia instead of the rest of the world would give some indication of a realistic alternative. You suggest moving to Sweden, why not suggest moving to NSW or SA?
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!

Let's just kick back and see how things pan out.

Dan's pet new law "Corporate Manslaughter" will be very Interesting (there are people In high places that will stop at nothing)

That so called little mistake would put any other Manager / CEO behind bars (the law applies to the Crown too)So what's your point? What do you want to see done?
RTT_Rules
The chain of responsibility is still subject to the reasonableness test. How granular, how 'need to know' does it need to be. Is Scotty across everything Federal parliamentarians, staff and authorities are doing???
This is seems to be a case of everyone thinking someone else was 'looking after that'. That's hardly unusual and the only thing that will come out of this is to state the obvious, clearly define responsibilities and communicate them.
  emmastreet Train Controller

Location: Goulburn Valley
Andrews has repeatedly said he would take responsibility but he hasn't. I think he should have stood down as Premier and spent some time on the backbench. That would be the price of failure. Failure of the "ghastly error" that was hotel quarantine, Cedar Meats, contact tracing, the shambles of the Flemington, Nth Melbourne high rise lockdowns. The only people to have paid the price are Mikakos and Eccles.
People praise Andrews for possibly getting us through the worst of the pandemic though who knows if the worst is over. I criticize him for getting us into it in the first place.
  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

Posting from Sydney. Just returned from the nearest sizeable shopping centre. Called in on the local drive through bottlo, it’s attached to the centre, bloke made comment on my facial diaper. I’m indifferent to those remarks and they don’t influence my decision making but,
Jerk offs like that are part the problem.
michaelgm
https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-nsw-residents-in-sydneys-west-and-north-west-urged-to-get-tested-covid-19-found-in-sewerage/75bccd58-3dba-4ac5-b399-bb3955e21a61

Just a follow up.
Confident the person referred to above resides in this area, ain’t karma a b1tch.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

A very good article by an Associate Professor at Uni of Melbourne:
https://pursuit.unimelb.edu.au/articles/time-for-smart-masking
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Andrews has repeatedly said he would take responsibility but he hasn't. I think he should have stood down as Premier and spent some time on the backbench. That would be the price of failure. Failure of the "ghastly error" that was hotel quarantine, Cedar Meats, contact tracing, the shambles of the Flemington, Nth Melbourne high rise lockdowns. The only people to have paid the price are Mikakos and Eccles.
"emmastreet"
Andrews has stood public questioning every day for months. He has led, and we are now out of lockdown. I did not want him to abdicate his responsibility and run away to the backbench; I do not want any leader to duck when the going gets tough. I wanted him to do his job as leader which he has done.
The hotel quarantine was the error which has been revisited repeatedly. The lockdown of Flemington and North Melbourne were essential and worked. Cedar Meats was an outbreak like any other, and was handled. Contact tracing has quite obviously worked; we are not seeing new cases. Mikakos and Eccles may not be the only failures but they were vital ones. Andrews has appeared before the enquiry and given evidence; I will await the enquiry report with interest. I suggest that you do.

People praise Andrews for possibly getting us through the worst of the pandemic though who knows if the worst is over. I criticize him for getting us into it in the first place.
"emmastreet"
Which is not your only mistake but is by far your biggest. In case you are not familiar with the fact, a pandemic is a worldwide occurrence. I suppose you expected Andrews to stand at the state border or the airport, telling the naughty virus that it wasn't allowed into Victoria.
  emmastreet Train Controller

Location: Goulburn Valley
No Valvegear I look across the river to NSW and other states and see how they went in the pandemic.
Again we disagree as we both have the right to do so. I do take exception to you telling me i am wrong because I don't agree with you.
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
No, we expected Andrews to have someone in direct charge of ensuring that those that returned from overseas stayed in their motel room & didn't interact with the guards.
As no one can remember what department signed off on the deal, then yes, Andrews is responsible for the outbreak.
What has been happening since then is Andrews fixing HIS mistakes.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
No Valvegear I look across the river to NSW and other states and see how they went in the pandemic.
"emmastreet"
Which state has the better record for new cases now?

Again we disagree as we both have the right to do so. I do take exception to you telling me i am wrong because I don't agree with you.
"emmastreet"
That is one of the funniest I've read in a long time. I say you're wrong because I believe that I am right. You say that you don't agree with me, which obviously means you believe that you're right and I'm wrong. Why are you taking exception? I'm not. It's called a difference of opinion, and happens all the time as it should.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
No, we expected Andrews to have someone in direct charge of ensuring that those that returned from overseas stayed in their motel room & didn't interact with the guards.

As no one can remember what department signed off on the deal, then yes, Andrews is responsible for the outbreak.

What has been happening since then is Andrews fixing HIS mistakes.
"Donald"
Don't get me wrong. I am not suggesting for one moment that he's been perfect.  But I will challenge your grammar, and say, "his mistake"; singular, not plural. Nobody doubts that hotel fiasco. It was bad, but not the only source of transmitted infections. I have taken a while to answer you because I saw some data weeks ago on this and now can't find it; Ill keep looking.

The ensuing job Andrews and Co did has been good - not just my opinion but opinions from other countries as well. The whole pandemic has been one giant learning curve, and it's till going on.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Which state has the better record for new cases now?

Valvegear
Point of order on this one.

Nearly all, of not all new positive cases for months (with exception of NSW) has been returning Australian's in hotel Quarantine. While Vic does not accept returning Aussie's then yes your books look better than some others.

Regarding NSW, as there was a mass exodus of Victorian's into NSW prior to lockdown, some of which later reported positive then NSW has suffered at the hands of the Victorian issue.

As for the infected returning Aussie's, the infection rate is concerningly bloody high. They should be forced to have a negative test result prior to boarding the plane which most but not all airlines require, now!
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Point of order notwithstanding; that is part of the reason why we have such low numbers as you yourself say. If it's a piece of our procedure and infections are not allowed in, that's fine by me.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
I did think personally the covid related fines would not stand up in court and yes there you have it: https://www.rebelnews.com/police_withdraw_first_covid_fine
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Andrews has repeatedly said he would take responsibility but he hasn't. I think he should have stood down as Premier and spent some time on the backbench. That would be the price of failure. Failure of the "ghastly error" that was hotel quarantine, Cedar Meats, contact tracing, the shambles of the Flemington, Nth Melbourne high rise lockdowns. The only people to have paid the price are Mikakos and Eccles.
Andrews has stood public questioning every day for months. He has led, and we are now out of lockdown. I did not want him to abdicate his responsibility and run away to the backbench; I do not want any leader to duck when the going gets tough. I wanted him to do his job as leader which he has done.
The hotel quarantine was the error which has been revisited repeatedly. The lockdown of Flemington and North Melbourne were essential and worked. Cedar Meats was an outbreak like any other, and was handled. Contact tracing has quite obviously worked; we are not seeing new cases. Mikakos and Eccles may not be the only failures but they were vital ones. Andrews has appeared before the enquiry and given evidence; I will await the enquiry report with interest. I suggest that you do.

People praise Andrews for possibly getting us through the worst of the pandemic though who knows if the worst is over. I criticize him for getting us into it in the first place.
Which is not your only mistake but is by far your biggest. In case you are not familiar with the fact, a pandemic is a worldwide occurrence. I suppose you expected Andrews to stand at the state border or the airport, telling the naughty virus that it wasn't allowed into Victoria.
Valvegear
A powerful case of selective bias going on here.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
I did think personally the covid related fines would not stand up in court and yes there you have it: https://www.rebelnews.com/police_withdraw_first_covid_fine
bevans
Something like only 4% of them have been paid.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
No, we expected Andrews to have someone in direct charge of ensuring that those that returned from overseas stayed in their motel room & didn't interact with the guards.
As no one can remember what department signed off on the deal, then yes, Andrews is responsible for the outbreak.
What has been happening since then is Andrews fixing HIS mistakes.
Donald
I remember people calling up on the radio about how they scored a security job In hotel quarantine with no experience no training (apart from a short briefing In diversity and Inclusion)

They said they were hired as a Sub Contractor on no formal employment agreement, they had to provide their own PPE, the management changed every shift, the caller quit because he didn't want to have anything to do with the shemozzle unfolding.

The DHHS failed to protect the health and wellbeing of the Australian public (Other States and Territories managed as they followed the direction that was set out during the COAG meeting on how to set up quarantine of returned travelers)

Sponsored advertisement

Display from: