Edit: Note - this is a recovered so I've lost all the quote formatting . I got the dreaded "Phantom Post"
The number of breaches of HQ is simply too high ATM.Ok, my terminology is off, but my point was the Feds control the international border for bio-security, the states protect their own border and have jurisdiction to do so. ie Ruby Princess F/U was NSW Health screwing up. The feds cannot legally force people to enter the states if the states say no.
The Feds have responsibility for borders and national quarantine. The constitution is clear on that. They do it for agricultural pests. However, for reasons best known to themselves, they have elected not to fulfil that obligation to the satisfaction of all - or indeed any - of the states, who have taken up the slack.
As for the Ruby Princess: clearly borders are a Fed responsibility. The fact is they elected not to deal with it appropriately, instead they came out with "a grade 16.4 NSW public servant failed to do my job for me.
That said, NSW gvt's failure to deal with the Fed's failure was no less complete.
Ultimately resulted in our Hotel Quarantine system which has kept life reasonably normal in most of Australia - except where and when it has failed.
I'll repeat my earlier statement: borders and quarantine are a fed responsibility. They have chosen to abrogate it.
Once again, moving the HQ out of the major centres is pointless, impractical and will have more issues than it solves.
It's not pointless. Is a 10 week lockdown of a city like Melbourne more practical?
Your proposed work conditions are extreme and would not be approved. The people leaving still then need to be quarantined before returning home making the whole system impractical.
You are right. Currently, hospitality workers and security guards enjoy such excellent working conditions now, they'd never accept it, especially with such a powerful union. I guess our scheme will have to be staffed by back-packers in lieu of picking fruit. Maybe we could do a bit of Blackbirding.
If someone dies from cross contamination, the govt would be sued. Also reminder we are talking about 1000 - 2000 people PER DAY!
But if there is a 10 week lockdown, the gvt gets off Scot free.
The tent city that would be required to support such a population will need AC in summer and heating in winter.
5mil people locked down for months, or International travellers have to go without Air Conditioning. Hmmm. Which is less convenient?
Meanwhile the use of the hotels helped solve an employment crisis in the industry, so you are pi$$ing that up against the wall. The hotels have all the required facilities.
And of course lockdowns don't have any unemployment implications at all, because everyone can just work from home.
Part of the problem with Hotels is they *don't* have all the facilities required. They are designed for guests to be serviced by staff, so they need staff to service the rooms. Those staff tend to be low/under paid casuals, poorly trained, likely to use PT and live in low cost high density housing in out densest populated cities. They are the risk, as has been shown multiple times, and the cost is (at least) internal Australian border closures and various COVID restrictions.
The "solution" has been not to service rooms by hotel staff, which destroys the employment argument.
Meanwhile you and Vinelander have ignored again the most basic of preventative options, NEG PCR TEST PRIOR TO BOARDING THE F'N PLANE which would eliminate the whole issue. Fortunately today the fed cabinet has finally agreed to this despite the fact the bulk of the rest of the world implemented this months ago.
It should have been mandatory months ago (again, States can't do this, only the feds, so it hasn't happened).
Some airlines require this already, and AFAIK (not sure how much this extends beyond repatriation flights) this is already occurring. It's clearly having some impact, as a recent Vic report observed a higher incidence of COVID in flight crews than returning travellers (despite AFAIK QANTAS regularly testing their staff). The issue is that even when PCR testing prior to boarding occurs, multiple people are still testing positive in hotel quarantine.
Pre-flight PCR testing simply isn't enough.
Previously when we were debated the "who's to blame" regarding Ruby Princess with Valvegear back in May, I looked up all the regulatory and legal on who is responsible for health and border protection and it was very much the states. VG accepted this back then. The NSW govt has accepted full accountability for failing to check and look after the people as they left the ship. So please lets put an end to the Fed input this and move on or pehaps go back to the posts around MAy where I quoted all the relevant links and passages. Before hitting the keyboard ask yourself how many Dr's and Nurses the Fed govt health department employs?
As a one off its doable, but you have a continuous flow of people, now how do you manage this? Its not 1 or 2 flights from Wuhun we are talking about.
Yes, it won't work to get hospitality workers to live away from home for 3mths.
No, the Vic govt will answer to the people at the next election, however I can almost guarantee by then people won't care.
Trying locking Australian's with children and other issues in a tent city with no AC in the middle of the outback summer and then get back to me and see how long it will last. Remember while the border bio security was breeched, many of the Victorian people also failed to follow basic guidelines which allowed the virus to spread out of control long after the population was notified there was a problem and to follow specific guidelines. Surely the example of what would happen in NZ was warning enough. Meanwhile breech's in Adelaide and potentially Brisbane and Sydney are being contained without a 10 week lockdown.
Hotels are the same as a quarantine station, if you manage it poorly, as they have especially in Vic, the virus leaks out. The hotels still need to be serviced, food prepared etc so yes there are jobs, lots.
It would appear the requirement for CV-19 testing wasn't simply state or Fed level. The states could have mandated it for each flight going to their city, or the Feds the problem was they didn't trust the PCR test to be reliable enough, regardless its finally occurred.
Emirates and Etihad require PCR testing for almost every fight sector apart from Australia and NZ. Why the airlines choose not to force their passengers on these two destinations is unknown to me especially after the UAE govt said it would be mandatory for all flights and include transit passengers.
The problem is the bulk of the returning passengers were simply not tested. Testing would have eliminated at least 95% of the risk and the airline crew need to be tested more frequently. Was yesterday that the hotel staff are tested now daily, meanwhile the flight / cabin crew are tested what every 2 weeks?
Moral of the story the state and Fed govts have not taken PCR testing seriously and used the technology that is available. Hell we have two options here,
- PCR which has a 16-24 h turn around time, costs down to around A$60, but can be done faster if you pay more.
- DPI which is a laser blood test (from finger prick) that gives a result in 1min and costs A$20.
The later is prone to false positives and it looks for an immune response to anything, not just CV-19, hardly a bad thing. Having done DPI test now to enter Abu Dhabi where I commute daily multiple times I have yet to have a false positive but others at work have and they just then move into another tent to have a PCR test where the result is provided in 16h and told to go home until the get a result.
Abu Dhabi Emirate also issues compulsory wrist trackers that cannot be removed and are synced to your phone or wifi so that when arriving from abroad from certain countries you self isolate and they track your movements for a few days. The fine for interfering with this is around $10,000 and jail. Seems to work as UAE has 1500 new cases a day on average for months, its stable at this level and we have no lockdowns or quarantine centres anymore.